Lets rewrite History

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by madame_zora, Jul 1, 2005.

  1. madame_zora

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  2. B_DoubleMeatWhopper

    B_DoubleMeatWhopper New Member

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    We really should be fair to Dubya: the stupidity there is not really coming from Bush ... it's coming from the fundie fucktards who voted for him
     
  3. Freddie53

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    When I was in public school we learned how the communists in the Soviet Union and China left important details out of history and added details. We also learned how HORRIBLE and ANITDEMOCRATIC that was. We learned a word for it: Propaganda - the deliberate slanting of a story to illicit a desired response.

    I know that an 8 minute video can't cover all of American history. However, the fact that the Congress was trying to take out major events out of a historical video is very threatning to our democracy and that is a vast understatement.

    To put in two events that aren't even connected to the Lincoln Memorial and give the implication that they are related to the Lincoln Memorial is like spitting in the face of Abraham Lincoln himself.

    The video now is a piece of propaganda only and not a factual video. I am more concerned about what was added that is not factual than what was almost taken out. (Two events that have nothing to do with the Lincoln Memorial in a video about the Lincoln Memorial.)

    Jana, thanks for finding this piece of information. We are a small group. Somehow we must find ways to get the information we share here out beyond this forum. All together we have made contributions of information from the internet. Somehow we must find ways to get a larger audience. Some one must hold this administriation accountable.

    We might as well do our part. We are either part of the problem or we are part of the solution. To do nothing incriminates us as well.
     
  4. madame_zora

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    In the Cincinnati Enquirer is was linked directly to Bush, I don't know what their sources were, but even that article insinuated that it came from much higher.
     
  5. Pecker

    Pecker Retired Moderator
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    The video was removed by Oct 2004.

    I know! Let's take a lesson from the Christmas fireplace video (remember that one - the loop that fills your TV screen with a warm fire for hours.) * getting snuggly all over *

    All they have to do is to run a similar video loop of the Memorial with nobody around to have their feelings hurt - no protesters, no visitors, just Memorial.

    By the time we get done teaching our children politically correct history, all of our monuments will be empty anyway.
     
  6. dufus

    dufus New Member

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    After the rumors that Abe Lincoln was gay (Was Abe Lincoln Gay?), I wouldn't be surprised if Bush and his string pullers closed the Lincoln Memorial altogether.
     
  7. madame_zora

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    "Politically correct history"?? Are you fucking kidding me? How about history as it really occured instead of history as it makes the religous right look good? A lot happened around the Lincoln Memorial, whitewashing history makes it propaganda, or don't you have a problem with that?

    Protests to the kind of crap that is going on now are a major part of our nation's history, to ignore it would mean we keep repeating the mistakes of the past.....oh, NOW I get it.
     
  8. Pecker

    Pecker Retired Moderator
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    "Politically correct history"?? Are you fucking kidding me? How about history as it really occured instead of history as it makes the religous right look good? A lot happened around the Lincoln Memorial, whitewashing history makes it propaganda, or don't you have a problem with that?

    Protests to the kind of crap that is going on now are a major part of our nation's history, to ignore it would mean we keep repeating the mistakes of the past.....oh, NOW I get it.
    [post=325847]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]

    Jana, darling, I was being facetious. I don't stand for any kind of revisionist history.
     
  9. jonb

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    Most "gay" historical figures were really bisexual, but the point remains.
     
  10. madame_zora

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    Jana, darling, I was being facetious. I don't stand for any kind of revisionist history.
    [post=325852]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]


    Dammit Pecker, you have to spoil all my fun! *licks Pecker in the face, amoung other places*
     
  11. madame_zora

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    Oh I'm well aware of that. Lincoln was not exactly free of racism, he just wanted to end slavery and the civil war. I don't attribute to him any more than that on the racist front.
     
  12. Pye

    Pye
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    How about a quote from Lincoln you may not have heard?

    "I have no purpose to introduce political and social equality between the white and black races.... I, as well as Judge Douglas, am in favor of the race to which I belong having the superior position." -Abraham Lincoln
    [post=325908]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]

    Just for shits and giggles I looked that one up-- it's true

    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo25.html
     
  13. Pye

    Pye
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    That's actually the exact source. ;)

    Notice, if you will, the fake quotes that have been used by the other side.
    [post=325916]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]


    What exactly is "the other side"?
     
  14. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree? Sex
    yeah, let's get rid of all them darkies. if they ain't picking tobacco then we don't want em here anymore. better find some space in the cargo holds of all those ships carrying guns to africa.

    I gotta wonder what you'd do without the internet, chimera, seeing as there's nowhere in the real world that you could spout this kinda crap without getting your chunky face broken.
     
  15. madame_zora

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    Chimera, that song post was slightly amusing.

    Actually I've read quotes of Lincoln saying that black people smelled bad, were less intelligent and the like. It has always made me sad when I've seen pictures of him in black people's homes next to Martin Luther King. History has been whitewashed long before our time, no doubt. All that being said, Lincoln lived in a time when that kind of thinking was the only thinking going on, so he was still a revolutionary in the cause of human rights- he DID still think it was wrong to own human beings, which is more than can be said of the south.

    I must admit it saddens me that someone as apparently well read as yourself can hold such abhorrent personal views. You seem well traveled, articulate, and informed in so many areas, but fairly lacking in this one. Are you sure you're not a 47 yr old KKK member? Was that pic you posted of a neighborhood kid?
     
  16. Freddie53

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    Just for shits and giggles I looked that one up-- it's true

    http://www.lewrockwell.com/dilorenzo/dilorenzo25.html
    [post=325913]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]
    This latest piece if information gives even more importance which videos should not be doctored up. We have this whole library of quotes and a legend of a man that isn't close to being accurate.

    On the one quote that Lincoln said in debate with Judge Douglas, Lincoln was still ahead of many of his contemporaries in opposing slavery. We do not know what Lincoln really believed, but we can surmise that it would have been political suicide to have stated that blacks from Africa are equal to whites from Europe.

    Thre has been this belief that blacks were some species between the great apes and European humans. For some Christians who accepted the Garden of Eden story as being factual, those Christians didn't believe then and some don't believe now that blacks were descended from Adam and Eve. Since I don't accept that story as a true historical story the question is moot.

    I have met some racists alive today who don't believe that "full blood" blacks have common ancesters with "full blood" European whites.

    I have also met some racists who do accept Darwinism evolution who believe that whites are just further along on the evolutionary trail than blacks.

    All the above is just facts as I have been told and read through in the past. I do not agree with any of this whites are suprerior to blacks theory at all. It goes agaisnt the core of every thing I believe.

    I do think it help explain the beliefs of people during the lifetime Abe Lincoln.
     
  17. B_DoubleMeatWhopper

    B_DoubleMeatWhopper New Member

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    Far more prevalent among fundies is that the black Africans are descended from Cush, the grandson of Noah. According to the account in Genesis, Noah's son Ham (whose name means 'black' in Hebrew), the father of Canaan, Mizraim and Cush, looked upon Noah's nakedness while Noah was drunk. Noah's other sons, Shem and Japheth, covered Noah's naked body with a robe while looking the other way. Noah issued this curse as a result of Ham's disrespect:

    " 'Cursed be Canaan!
    The lowest of slaves
    shall he be to his brothers.'
    "He also said:
    'Blessed be the LORD, the God of Shem!
    Let Canaan be his slave.
    May God expand Japheth,
    so that he dwells among the tents of Shem;
    and let Canaan be his slave.' " (Genesis 9: 24 - 29)

    The Jews used this passage to justify the subjugation of the Canaanites to establish Israel. Later, the passage was used by Whites of European descent to justify black slavery. But here's the kicker: Noah didn't mention Mizraim or Cush in his curse! The descendants of Ham were the Canaanites, the Philistines, and the peoples of North Africa: they were Caucasian! Nowhere did Noah imply that the descendants of Cush (the Negroid peoples) should become slaves. Somehow, the slave traders overlooked that little detail.
     
  18. madame_zora

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    No need, but just out of curiousity, how is it you have come to travel so much at 14? Are your parents in the army or something?
     
  19. jonb

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    And the entirety of the genealogy fits into language families: Semitic, Hamitic, and for some reason Japhtheth's descendants are a mixture of Indo-European, Turkic, and Caucasian speakers.

    Suffice it to say, most indigenous languages of the western coast of Africa are nowhere on the list. Not surprising; how can people explain what they don't know exists? And why would they? Another example: There were literally hundreds of reports of circumcision among Indians. It didn't actually occur, but they needed a way to explain Indians, and the more liberal-minded missionaries used the lost tribes. Other ministers argued that Indians actually were a separate species altogether, created merely to occupy North America. (They also argued blacks were a domestic animal.) Still others for some reason, such as Constantine Rafinesque and Jose de Acosta, preferred the idea of Indians crossing from some area around China. These people originally believed California connected directly to China. Today they've tried using a more complicated explanation using glaciation, but it ignores basic rules of natural selection and even basic time frames.

    The moral is, people create their own reality. Facts are only incidental.
     
  20. madame_zora

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    You know, that's true. The more facts that are revealed, the more our mythologies seem so simplistic. I don't claim to have the facts on all this, but it seems clear enough to me that the need to feel superior is in itself a weakness.
     
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