liberal or conservative?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by Axcess, Feb 27, 2008.

  1. Axcess

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    This thread is based in the liberal and conservative talk of some of the latest threads . To the members here I got question . You are liberal or conservative ? Neither of them? Why ? I don't consider myself liberal or conservative as both terms in my eyes are in the extremes . Maybe I'm 50% liberal and 50% conservative . I don't believe in extremes being 100% liberal or 100 % conservative is silly.
     
  2. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    cultural conservative

    spiritual radical

    environmental radical

    politically middle of road
     
  3. Axcess

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    May I ask why cultural conservative?
     
  4. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    I believe that our first priority should be the development of character in our young

    I believe in objective truths, absolute morality
     
  5. Axcess

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    I thought that you mean that you are cultural conservative in a more general way.
     
  6. Crew Guy

    Crew Guy New Member

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    Libertarian is probably the best description, or Classical Liberal.
     
  7. DC_DEEP

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    David, I almost started a thread about almost this exact topic, but I thought I needed to flesh out my thoughts a little better before doing so.

    One of the huge problems in presenting this question is that these terms have come to mean very different things to different people.

    In absolute terms, liberal means progressive, open-minded, amenable to change (especially what is seen as change for the better). Conservative means adhering to the old institutions, the old ways, the tried & true, averse to change and new ideas.

    Neither is inherently better than the other, and very few people are either one or the other in all aspects.

    My political leanings are heavily skewed toward the conservative side of conservative (think Goldwater) rather than the neo-conservative forged by the religious reactionaries (think Reagan). I am in favor of smaller government, both federal and state, and of a more decentralized "big picture," states' rights, and individual rights over all. The government should serve the people, not the other way around.

    Fiscally, I'm also old-style conservative. The current crop of pork-barrel republicans (and the few democrats that follow their lead) should be out on their ears. Nancy Pelosi is a joke, and a liar, and a hypocrite.

    Socially and culturally, I'm a dichotomy between liberal and conservative. I'm a huge supporter of self-determination, and a monstrous critic of the nanny-state. I do not recognize the governments' authority to decide whom I may marry, or whether or not I distill my own liquor. So long as it involves only me and other consenting adults, it's not the business of the government or nosy, meddling neighbors.

    The efforts of power-hungry evangelistic fundamentalist religious nuts have effectively destroyed anything good about the label "conservative," though. I don't have much use for goose-stepping sycophants on either side.
     
  8. Axcess

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    I know that this question is far more complex than it seems but I think that it is a good topic for a discussion. I agree that is very complex because the relatively of both terms. I have to go to work soon so I will have a fair input of this topic tomorrow.
     
  9. Phatdick

    Phatdick New Member

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    Oh well it don't matter now , with Nader joining in the Race that will insure that McCain will be the next president ..Another Republican
     
  10. Bbucko

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  11. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    I dont see what this has anything to do with the discussion in this particular thread.
     
  12. DC_DEEP

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    You didn't miss anything, js. It is out of left field.

    Did you know that all known species of cats, wild & domestic, carry the gene for tiger-stripe fur?
     
  13. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    In this day and age the true meaning of conservative and liberal has been bastardized by people on the extreme ends of both political spectrums. The religious right has effectively hijacked the conservative movement and made it being a conservative into a bad thing. The same goes for the extreme lefties- they are more socialist than liberal in their thinking and have somehow come to epitomize the face of liberalism. There are true conservatives out there (in fiscal policy and the views on the role of government) who cannot stand the conservatism being espoused by the religious right. On the other end of the spectrum there are true liberals who are open to change and progressive in their approach to government, who fall way short of being socialists. To me this is the ever growing pool of independent voters.
     
  14. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    Duly noted. :biggrin1:
     
  15. B_Hung Jon

    B_Hung Jon New Member

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    I don't think that the kind of capitalism we have in the USA is compassionate for all people. I think it needs to be changed.
     
  16. DC_DEEP

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    That's a fairly good summation of my previous post...:biggrin1:

    Maybe another interesting related topic is, why would anyone espouse the neo-conservative ideology, and how do people come to determine which philosophy fits them better.

    Yes, but there can be conservative capitalists and liberal capitalists.
     
  17. B_Hung Jon

    B_Hung Jon New Member

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    DC_DEEP, thanks for the comment. I look at our society and I see that most people aren't capable of becoming independent businessmen or women, don't have the drive or intelligence to succeed financially. I think for the dominant culture to constantly impose the "American Dream" on the population is just a marketing tool to sell us stuff. I don't know if it's liberal or conservative, but I think that all citizens should have a safe and clean place to live, have a healthy environment, and good health care. I think these should be rights. So instead of the top 1% of people owning most of the wealth, laws should be enacted that will balance this equation. Obviously something is wrong if there's this kind of inequity. And it doesn't have to be socialistic.
     
  18. DC_DEEP

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    I would get so slammed if I posted my thoughts on this, Jon.

    Not everyone can or should be an independent business person; not every job description fits that need. I do find it exceptionally interesting, though, that the "necessary-ness" of most jobs is inversely proportional to the potential for greatest income. What I mean is, some of the most important jobs pay the least, and some of the least important jobs pay the most.

    For instance, everyone loves his favorite quarterback, but could this country survive better and longer with no football and lots of teachers, or with lots of football teams but no schools?
     
  19. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    I reject both of these labels and reject labels in general, especially when people try to apply them to me. My personal political beliefs are all over the political spectrum, with views that include very "liberal" positions, very "conservative" positions, some very "libertarian" positions, and some that are just plain off the political map. I sometimes describe myself as a moderate or centrist, but again, that's another inadequate label when it comes to accurately describing me complete with its own baggage. I don't mind the label of moderate as much as these other labels though because to me personally it connotes someone who is able to be realistic, not beholden to idiotic and infantile partisanship, able to compromise, admit mistakes, revise opinions, etc. Someone not completely biased that sees everything in black and white.

    The negative connotations that go with the label of "moderate" I could do without, though. I'm not someone who can't make up their mind, I'm not someone with no opinions on anything, I'm not a habitual fence-sitter, I'm not under-informed, I'm not politically unaffiliated due to apathy or ignorance, and it's not that I'm afraid to take a stand on anything or say what I believe in.

    I think both major political parties in the United States are corrupt, backward, inefficient and ineffectual. I also think they are far more similar then either will admit. I would be loathe to ever cast a vote for either a registered Republican or a registered Democrat. I also don't see how the list of things that either party is supposed to stand for is necessarily wholly congruous. There are many issues out there that don't seem to me like they are liberal or conservative issues, yet in Washington EVERY stupid thing gets placed in one of two camps. It's absurd.

    I have more views today that would be described as "liberal" than I used to. I was raised by my father who is a stalwart Republican (even though he used to be a hippy, but I think just because it was trendy. Now instead of getting his ideas from John Lennon he gets them from Fox News). When I was a child and still thought like a child (and therefore thought like most political pundits) I considered myself a Republican as well. I was also raised as a Christian, and when I was a child I thought of myself as a Christian. As I got older, I started thinking for myself and forming my own political and spiritual ideology and forming my own sense of identity. I stopped listening to Rush Limbaugh around 1999, stopped liking Bill O'Reilly around 2002, and accepted that Bill Clinton really wasn't that bad of a president around 2003 or so. To my credit I never cared for Hannity.


    Anyway, long story short and to answer the OP: I'm none of the above. Why? I think for myself. If you attempt to categorize or label me, you will inevitably be WRONG. If you want to know where I stand on an issue, you're going to have to ask me and wade through a nuanced and detailed answer. Reality is not binary.
     
  20. ZOS23xy

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    I have picked upon a number of the right wingers in here (some of them now banned) for completely blind sidedly supporting Bush. And when I picked two or three specific topics of many that the current president has yet to answer for, they were ignored, or I was dubbed a "hippie liberal" (among other things), which is a way of saying "go away".

    I'm not a total liberal, nor am I a conservative. The check list of conservative views that makes you able to air your voice on the Rush Limbaugh show is not mine.

    The issue of US versus THEM, as played out in Rush Limbaugh's world is pretty dimly unintelligent. Another person on this board (also banned) seemed to listen to right wing show folk to the point that she downloaded their programs onto her iPod so she could always hear them.

    Dunnno. I've made up my mind by life experience, not because someone has given me an opinion to accept.
     
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