Losing my Madonna

[B_henry miller]

Not to defend Madonna's cred, but how can a woman who won three Grammys (Ray Of Light), a Golden Globe & Academy Award (Evita), and a world tour that produced 47 sold out shows and grossed over $75 Million be on a downhill spiral? This was from 1996-2003. The Sex book was a bit cheesy, but I remember standing in line at Tower Records after 12AM to get one of the first copies! :biggrin1:

Good point. But bottom line is that Mariah Carey sold more records than Madonna in the 1990s. And Madonna can hardly get a song in the Top Ten in the US these days. It's a rare occurance. In the 1980s, just about every song she released got into the Top Ten. Also, she was once cutting edge. When she was cutting edge the Grammys wouldn't acknowledge her. I think they awarded her after she got soft.

Anyone over the age of 30 knows what I'm talking about. We remember her superstar days in the 1980s. She had a level of stardom back then that just doesn't happen anymore. She and Michael Jackson were "it." (By the way, she never won an Oscar. She has sung songs that won Oscars, but as she was not the song writer she herself did not get the award.)

 

[Mr. Snakey]

I was never a big fan of her at all. She wont be remembered for her signging or music that for sure.

 

[B_henry miller]

Just 7 posts in & already a load of ignorant nonsense being pissed out. Madonna has never been appreciated in America. Lets get that straight. But the rest of the world still fucking loves her. Mariah doesnt come close to her fame or relevance globally. But in America you prefer bland generic RnB-lite crap to POP music so Bimbo joke Mariah sells more there. Madonnas sex book was a mistake to Americans coz youre sooo prudish about shit like that; the rest of the world just laughed & forgot about it 10 seconds later! Madonna has had huge sales since 1992 and lots of massive hits so why talk nonsense? No-one can maintain the exact same level of interest for 25 years but Madonna is still up there at the very top. Where she belongs.

Madonna doesn't sell as much as she did in the 1980s. That's all I said. Listen, I was a fan since 1982 when I first heard "Physical Attraction" on a black radio station and thought she was a black singer. A lot of people assumed that back then.

About the Sex book, a guy with a picture of his penis next to his posts can hardly be called a prude. I wasn't offended by the book. I just thought it was stupid. I remember seeing hardcore porn people on TV saying that the book was tame and uninteresting. Madonna herself has since mentioned that the only reason she did it was to shock people. No deeper meaning. But it dammaged her career considerably.

 

[B_henry miller]

Life With My Sister Madonna should give everyone an idea what she's really like. Everyone I know who has had a run-in with her has been shocked at what a complete bitch she is. She's a great performer and I like some of her songs. I'm impressed that she's kept her career going this long. Madonna's ability for self-preservation in the business should be a Harvard Business School case study.

The book is very sad. I can't believe what it says about her at her mother's grave. Her brother says that she basically used their mother's grave as a "location" for the Truth or Dare movie. That she acted all sad for the cameras, and then when they were turned off, she turned to her brother and said with a smile, "Okay, now it's your turn."

I agree. I've heard tons of stories of her being a bitch. Not a surprise. I think even she has agreed to that.

 

[B_henry miller]

makes not difference to me guys...mariah doesnt need defending and in my opinion neither does madonna...tehyre careers speak for themselves. but if bashing an artist makes you feel good then, "i aint sayin' a word, to each his own odell"

Exactly. Like either of them give a shit what we say about then on this forum.

 

[B_henry miller]

Oh, shut up. If there's such thing as a "race card," then there's also a "gender card" -- and you're playing it.

I feel sorry for her because I think she is motivated by the death of her mother and the abandonment of her father for her step-mother. It appears to me that at the age of 50, despite having become the most famous woman in the world and most successful female singer of all time, she hasn't come to term with these losses. I think that's very sad.

About her age, there just comes a point when it is sad to see a 50-year-old woman looking "preserved" and hanging around with people half her age in an attempt to look younger than she is. It reminds me of Bubble in Absolutely Fabulous, "And you know, it's pathetic, these older ladies struggling to look 25!"

I suppose I'm disappointed. I remember about 10 years ago the author of Encyclopedia Madonnica theorized that when Madonna got older she would rebel, that she would allow herself to get wrinkles and have a "fuck you!" attitude toward getting older; you know, "Fuck you, I'm not going to hide the fact that I'm getting older. I'm not going to become a Hollywood phoney with face lifts, etc."

But that hasn't happened. She has gotten face lifts, uses botox, etc., and hangs around with 25-year-olds. She's become what she was rebelling against: a conformist. She's conformed to the Hollywood idea that as women get older they attempt to hide their age.

If anyone is "age-ist" it is Madonna for attempting to hide her age.

I suppose I was the stupid one for thinking it would be any different. Trust me. It's just a disappointment to see her now and remember what she was back in the 1980s. There's no comparison. It's sort of comparing "Hound Dog" Elvis with "Vegas" Elvis. They're different people.

:wtf1: Huh? Let me get this straight you are upset because Madonna has the audacity at age 50 to still look and perform as if she were half her age? What a typically sexist male thing to say! Are you sure you aren't a Hollywood director? They have a penchant for overlooking women over 40 or expecting them to look like and portray frumpy soccer moms or grandmothers.

So what, she's 50. Is she supposed to quit her career take up quilting or knitting and perhaps start walking her local mall at 7 AM with the rest of the senior citizens?

As for the Kabbalah if it keeps her on an even keel so be it. I'm not a fan of prosletyzing or or using religious accessories as a way of showing off. I'm also not fond of how so many celebrities have latched on to Kabbalah without actually converting to or studying Judaism. That's a topic for another day.


Perspective on what exactly? Did you think because her name is Madonna she would move to Calcutta and take up where Mother Teresa left off?


:rofl: Really? I hadn't noticed. :tongue: The only thing I find annoying is her very bad, fake British accent.


:lmao: Dear God is that our litmus test for normal now? Whitney Houston and Michael Jackson? :aargh4:

I suppose I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for her because she was such an icon of my youth and so important to my generation, but I just don't find her that interesting anymore. I think I grew up. Sometimes I wish she would too.
She's a working mother with a penchant for marrying men with poor earning potential, and who are clearly beneath her station. Heck, I've got cousins like that. :tongue:

 

[B_henry miller]

Oh, about the Kabballah thing, it's sad. She's sort of become what she was rebelling against in the 1980s: a religious fanatic. Remember when the religious people were up in arms against her? Now, she goes on talk shows and says stuff like, "Now, I see myself as someone who is 'awake.'" Generally speaking, people who say they are awake and enlightened -- aren't. All it usually means is that they've become more egotistical.

Her brother wrote that now she uses Kaballah as a weapon. She has "God on her side" now. I agree.

Also, interestingly, her brother said that Guy Ritchie is homophobic and he sort of indicates that the introduction of Guy Ritchie into her life marked the point at which the gay people in her inner circle were exiled, including himself. I think this is also the point at which she ceased to be interesting. I mean, I find that image of her as an English mother to be so boring. That's when I seriously started to lose interest in her.

 

[Charles Finn]

Madonna will always be special to me but I think she peaked with ray of light

 

[D_Gunther Snotpole]

I've just never really 'gotten' Madonna.
She does many things quite well, and as a total package, she obviously has had unique success.
She was good at finding the leading edge in things and finding gestures that carried her just that further bit along to win leadership of the current wave ... at least 15 and 20 years ago.
But I just can't find someone who has serially adopted so many personas particularly real. (And of course, being real, I know, was scarcely her point ... so I really sound irrelevant when I say that.)
She always gave me the sense of watching a passing parade that I just couldn't connect with.
Perhaps my loss.

 

[B_Austin Blue]

I think her best days are behind her...

Her face looks good for 50 but the rest of her gives her age away. Those arms and hands of hers look like my grandma's. My dead grandma.

She was very hot several years back...but it's not 1990 anymore.

I don't think it makes any difference what people think about her. She's got a shit load of people behind her and hell - she's reinvented herself over and over and over.

At 50 she looks friggin' amazing! Are you kidding me? How many other 50 year old women look as hot and tonned as she does? I don't understand people who say she should act her age - why? If you're hot and having fun - go for it.

Interestingly the UK press slammed KYLIE MINOGUE for being past her age and wearing skimpy outfits for her tour right now. Kylie is 10 years younger than Madonna and has actually outsold Madonna in world-wide sales. I agree that the USA has never appreciated Madonna - they simply don't understand a lot of music. But it's also the way music is setup in the United States. Radio stations just play the usual shit. Sad.

Madonna will keep going until she is bored of it.

I thought 'Hard Candy' was a lame album, but people bought it.

 

[B_henry miller]

I'm not saying she should act her age. But let's face it: a 50-year-old woman in a leotard is not as attractive as a 25-year-old woman in a leotard.

I guess I had thought that by the time she was 50 she would've learned how to actually sing, would write meaningful songs, etc. I thought she would develop more depth. But the opposite seems to be happening. She seems to be becoming more superficial the older she gets. :dunno:

 

[Shelby]

She should grow her pit hair back to draw attention away from her weird looking arms.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Good point. But bottom line is that Mariah Carey sold more records than Madonna in the 1990s. And Madonna can hardly get a song in the Top Ten in the US these days. It's a rare occurance. In the 1980s, just about every song she released got into the Top Ten. Also, she was once cutting edge. When she was cutting edge the Grammys wouldn't acknowledge her. I think they awarded her after she got soft.

It's success on two different levels. One dominated the charts. One expanded their horizons and achieved success in other areas. I agree with you that she's not the dominant force like she was in the 80s, but her stint in the 90s wasn't bad at all despite the lack of Billboard charting singles.

It wasn't until she sang that dreaded "I Love New York" single on "Confessions On a Dancefloor" that I thought she completely lost it.

By the way, she never won an Oscar. She has sung songs that won Oscars, but as she was not the song writer she herself did not get the award.

"You Must Love Me" from Evita won a Golden Globe and an Academy Award for Original Song in a Motion Picture in 1996. I'd have to look up who wrote it, but Madonna does deserve some of the credit since she sang it. Without the right voices behind it, a perfectly written song can sound like crap. Imagine if Mariah Carey, with her incredible Glitter-tastic acting prowless, tried to do this role? :biggrin:

 

[hockeyguy741]

who knew peoples preferances for an artists earlier work or the fact some think she's just ok as an artist/musician would cause such a hostile response from so many.....do we all have to like the same music, food, clothing, colors, live in the same type of home... do you really think she needs your unsolicited never wavering support to keep her carrer alive..oh ya I don't hate madonna, this has gotten to be a pretty boring pissing contest about nothing ..next topic please

 

[B_Sativa]

Amen.Mariah is for soccer moms.You can keep her safe watered down r and b lite shit she cranks out.Mariah has been doing the same act since 1990.Same clothes,etc.Notice you dont see her tour? Cause who would pay to watch Mariah stand still with her right side of her face in a wind machine,Blah.At least Madonna trys new things.And it doesnt take 13 people to write one of Madonnas songs as it does Mariah.Cheers.:biggrin1:

How can these two even be compared? Madonna had hits out in the early 80's, when Mariah was still undiscovered. They r 2 different kind of women that produce 2 different kinds of music. And each can be appreciated in a different aspect of the music world. They r both very talented!!!
She is Madonna- she can not be compared

 

[rawbone8]

Percentage-wise, discussing Madonna is so .... :greddy2:

 

[PussyWellington]

She's a working mother with a penchant for marrying men with poor earning potential, and who are clearly beneath her station. Heck, I've got cousins like that. :tongue:

Just so you know, Guy Ritchie's family are most definitely landowners. He has married beneath him. His family are part of the Establishment.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

this has gotten to be a pretty boring pissing contest about nothing ..next topic please

And where did you think this discussion was going to become? An blissfully insightful, yet analytical dissection of the artistic integrity of an 80's pop icon? I mean, we are talking about a woman whose first number one was titled, "Like A Virgin" and practices extensive masturbation scenes live on stage while on tour. :wink:

 

[Deno]

Vala told me she could always go on this television show were your made to dance with supposed celebrities.

 

[Dominicanboy]

Mariah writes her own songs. Educate yourself before talking.