Losing Your Best Friend to Marriage

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deleted3782

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My best friend from 9th grade meant the world to me through high school. Even though we lived 475 miles apart through college, we remained close through letters, telephone, and occasional visits. That all ended when he got married. Wife comes first. She wanted kids, so they had three in about 4 years. His first son is named after me. I see him now every five years at school reunions...and when we see each other, its like no time has passed, we just pick up where we left off. But with his wife and kids, there is no time for us as friends. None at all. Saturday is his birthday, and I will send him an email. Its just something you have to deal with. He married the woman, I presume it was his choice to do so, so be glad he found someone he wants to be with.
 

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Make yourself her best friend and confidant. Get her to the point of liking you so much so that she tells you everything. You can hate her, despise her, fuck her for all who cares. But listen up and listen good. He will always take her side, defend her and he will dump you as a friend before you even know what happened if she wants it.

My good friend married a shrew who hated me from the get go. Dis-invited me from their wedding to which I was to stand up to as a groomsman.

I did not see him for three years after their marriage. We finally bumped into each other at a social event to which he exclaimed, "where have you been for the last three years"

I started to explain, and I immediately backed off and made up a story how busy I was with graduate school and other non-truths. He then calls the hag over, and as she is rolling her eyes, he "re-introduces us" I'm thinking, give me a puke bag. So she goes away for the moment as he and I reconnect, rehashing old times. I invite myself over for a beer, and over the course of a year he and I resume where we left off nearly 4 years earlier. I'm around much more and slowly start to work her. Slowly! It took me 5 years, but it's to a point where she confides in me and i could care less. She could drop fucking dead and i would step over her cold body to leave the room! How I did it? She's a bitch. She talks about everyone behind their back. I let her dish to me as much as she wants. I do not add to her rants, I just listen, smile and say things like, "oh really?" "you don't say" "she did what?" and so on................................... When I'm around him we're old friends. He doesn't realize what she did, or tried to do, but I do and will never forget.

So my best advice: Make her think she can't live without you being HER friend. Then you can still be his friend.
 

SpeedoGuy

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I do occassionally do things alone with my friend but the conversation is always strained because his partner is such a big part of his life and it is awkward excluding him from any meaningful conversation. The talk gets superficial and we just have this odd conversations like we are strangers talking about the weather or current events.

Sounds like you are a bit lonesome at the loss of a long time friend. I know that awkward feeling.

Its painful losing a long time friend due to changing circumstances. It can leave a person with a very bleak outlook on life for some time afterwards.

Chances are your friend feels the same distance and awkwardness you're feeling. Sooner or later you're probably going to have a discussion about it and I think its fair game for you to objectively state why you are uncomfortable with his partner. I don't mean to say that you should frame the discussion as an "either him or me" ultimatum but its completely reasonable for you to state your distaste for the partner. True friends should be able to do that without recrimination or rancor.

Hope that makes sense.
 

CUBE

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Oh this can be so painful. I had some straight friends that had a spouse that couldn't really handle the "gay friend." I tried to keep making it work. At one point a few weddings seemed more like funerals as I new it was goodbye. I know the friend is also responsible for the outcome and not all the spouses fault but it certainly can hurt. I think many singles feel this way when they are now friends with a couple...straight or gay. Sometimes my strongest fantasy is not sexual...it is just to have my buddy back for one of our days of fun. True, things change...and of course this hasn't been all my friends but I totally understand what people are going through. I wish them well even if they are not around anymore. Good thread.
 

jason_els

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My one friend married an Irish girl and I couldn't make it to Ireland for the wedding so I didn't even know her before they tied the knot. He invited me over for a week to their house there so my first time meeting her was for a week long stay. Talk about pressure! It was rough. I brought a present and was on my best behavior and when I arrived at some god awful hour in Dublin I find this woman standing there. Turns out my friend couldn't come so sent the new wife instead!

I'm beat, jet lagged, unshaven, probably not smelling too sweet either. We start talking and talking and talking. Turns out she's the coolest wife. She's a school principal, very, very, smart, and is thrilled that she's meeting me for the first time. She could not have been sweeter or more charming. I lucked-out in that one.

Two other, longer friends though... it's been tough as essentially they disappeared after they got married and yes, the one bitch disinvited me from the wedding too.

I will tell you something though. My best friend from boarding school emailed me about a year ago from totally out of the blue. Over the years I tried getting to know him again but it didn't work. Now, 20 years later, he's interested again. Why?

When we were in school, I met him on the very first day of school. He was good-looking, smart, and had a billion-watt smile punctuated by his sparkling eyes. If Charisma was booze, he'd be Everclear. We became friends really quickly though we weren't much alike. I'm laid back, he's driven. I can't dribble a basketball, he's a jock. He's good-looking, I'm lucky I'm allowed around heart patients. He's very private and exceptionally careful about trusting other people even a little, I'm way too trusting, always hoping people will rise to their better natures. Whenever I was around him, I felt like I was a better person. He pushed me to go out and do things and, to this day, there is almost nothing in the world I wouldn't do for him. But I also know he respected my intelligence, my academic success, appreciated my overt affection, and platonic fidelity. Beneath all the positive things I saw in him, as it turned out, were a lot of negative motivations in him causing him to be who he was. Much of who he is consists of trying hard not to be like those who caused him a lot of pain as a child.

We're rebuilding slowly and it is rough as he has 3 small children, a growing business, and he lives 80 miles away. After all this time though, we picked-up right where we let off. There was no, "remember when...," crap. We just filled-in the blanks and then went straight back. All through it though, was the constant thread of how he has a happy home and a lot of money, but how his social life in upscale suburbia is too empty.

Life has taught him that there are a lot of flakes, scammers, and people who will always remain aquaintances. My friend has made a lot of money and the more he makes, the more suck-ups he encounters. He and his wife make the rounds of parties and country club and yacht club and chamber of commerce and charity groups. As he said, "My cell phone has over 300 numbers in it and only 2 of them are people I trust." When he said that the look on his face reminded me of some of his darker days years before and I then knew why he had called me.

As I've discovered, this kind of thing isn't rare. Friends, real friends, go away for a while and then come back after life teaches them that the insular family-based world of suburban life doesn't have everything. Maybe it's mortality knocking, a realization that life really is too short, I don't know. What I can say is to try to keep things up, send out a few Christmas cards, drop and email here or there, but don't be surprised if you don't get anything back immediately. At some point in time life will them to take stock and realize just who really matters in the world and who doesn't. Don't be surprised if you turn out to be one of those people.
 

yhtang

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Make yourself her best friend and confidant....<snipped>....
So my best advice: Make her think she can't live without you being HER friend. Then you can still be his friend.

Wow, this is oen good way out, but it needs patience. This ploy could possibly surpass any in Sun Tze's "Wiles of War."
 

earllogjam

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So my best advice: Make her think she can't live without you being HER friend. Then you can still be his friend.

That would be torture. I'm not great at hiding my feelings and usually wear my emotions on my sleeve for the most part so this probably won't work for me. I'm not sure how anyone can do this actually. Most people can see that you aren't genuine pretty quickly.

Chances are your friend feels the same distance and awkwardness you're feeling. Sooner or later you're probably going to have a discussion about it and I think its fair game for you to objectively state why you are uncomfortable with his partner. I don't mean to say that you should frame the discussion as an "either him or me" ultimatum but its completely reasonable for you to state your distaste for the partner. True friends should be able to do that without recrimination or rancor.

Hope that makes sense.

Well, I'm not sure having this discussion will actually change anything. The problem is with me and his spouse. I've been best friends with him for over half of my life, and many things we just understand without any conversation. He knows the situation well and has chosen his spouse over his circle of old friends, can't blame him for that. That is his decision and I respect that.

What I can say is to try to keep things up, send out a few Christmas cards, drop and email here or there, but don't be surprised if you don't get anything back immediately. At some point in time life will them to take stock and realize just who really matters in the world and who doesn't. Don't be surprised if you turn out to be one of those people.

At this point in our friendship I don't have the will or inclination to continue any contact with him as it is just so awkward. And on some level I feel betrayed.
 

jason_els

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Well, I'm not sure having this discussion will actually change anything. The problem is with me and his spouse. I've been best friends with him for over half of my life, and many things we just understand without any conversation. He knows the situation well and has chosen his spouse over his circle of old friends, can't blame him for that. That is his decision and I respect that....

At this point in our friendship I don't have the will or inclination to continue any contact with him as it is just so awkward. And on some level I feel betrayed.

I spent a lot of time thinking about this last night. On reflection, I should have been more honest and gone into more detail. The more I read of what you've previously posted here, it dawned on me I was being perhaps too facile.

If you can't blame him and respect his decision then you have no right to feel betrayed. Sounds like you have a lot of heartache trying to make yourself believe something you don't truly feel. Confront your anger and forget trying to understand anything at this point. You think I wasn't angry or disappointed? Didn't spend years wondering what I did to fuck it all up? I loved this guy and he didn't love me any more. That's traumatic no matter how you consider it and it takes time to work through it all.

People get married and they go through a period where they think letting the spouse outrank all other people in every area of life is what married people do. Part of it is reassuring themselves that they are married, another part is trying to fulfill an ideal. Relationships that don't go beyond this stage aren't happy ones because nobody can be everything to anyone forever. Whether your friend's husband realizes it or not, and as has been pointed out by a wise soul, I wager there's jealousy. An attempt by the husband to keep you away out of insecurity. Whether you realize it or not, you're a very handsome man. You're outgoing, kind, and have a good sense of who you are. I'm not surprised your friend's husband is jealous or fearful. Nor am I surprised that you feel marginalized. Jealousy works both ways.

All I know is that he will always be a brother to me. And my door will always be open to him, always.

That about says it all though doesn't it? Is this the same guy you'd go around testing lawns with your bare feet? The same guy who was proud of you for leading those scouts out of the woods?

As I see it, you've got two choices. Either suffer in silence or work to continue the relationship. Pop a Xanax, call your friend, and get together. Tell him how you feel and why. I could have done that, should have done that, but didn't because it was too awkward. Part of me was blaming myself and another part of me felt like this is how things were supposed to be. I was wrong on both counts. If this guy is worth the honesty, and he sounds like he is, then don't let what would never gone unspoken before go unspoken now.

It sucks being a gay or bi guy with married friends of the same sex. There's always an unspoken fear in the spouse that you two might become romantically involved; a question of sexual attraction. If you really want awkward, try telling your friend's spouse that you're a friend and a friend only and have no designs or desires for your friend beyond the same friendship you've enjoyed for years. It takes some serious hairy hangers to do that but I felt I had to. It nearly made me throw-up but I went and did it anyway. Half way into the conversation the spouse lightened-up considerably, relaxed, actually smiled, and all the while I was being told that such a thing wasn't a concern, body language was telling me something completely different. As I saw it, in the current situation, I had nothing to lose. Either I was going to lose a friend or else I was going to confront the situation and work it out. If my actions helped, then great. If my actions were wrong, then I wasn't losing anything I hadn't already lost. The realization that I had to act terrified me. In the end, the tension between myself and the spouse loosened considerably.

It's an old chestnut and a very true chestnut. Life is too short. That's a big consideration when gay or bi people decide to come out. If you can do that then you can do this. None of us are so perfect that we don't need friends to tell us when things aren't right. If the level of trust between you two is what you say it is, then you don't have much choice. He may not come around now, or he may. Whatever he decides, you'll have stated your position, he will know how important he is to you, and even if he walks out he'll know that you still love him and, he will know, as you say, your, "...door will always be open to him, always." Sometimes our friends disappoint us. If your friend is really your friend, no matter what his immediate reaction is, those words will mean the world to him in the long run. He may just need time to come around to them. From what I've read, you're a good man and despite your anger, frustration, disapointment-- despite everything, give him that grace. From what I've read from you, I know you can.

Somewhere in your life as a gay man you decided not to let convention silence the truth. Gather your strength and do that again. Don't live with the same regret I did with my best friend. Regret of that magnitude is a cancer I don't wish upon anyone.
 

earllogjam

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jason els,

Thank you for caring so much to write something so thoughtful. It means a lot to me. Yup, it's the same guy I tested lawns with bare foot. He wasn't in the same scout troop however.

It certainly is an odd dynamic to have a platonic friendship between 2 gay men and dealing with each other's romantic attachments and dealing with jealousies. I thought about this a lot and I came to the conclusion that I WILL deeply regret loosing this friendship if I do nothing. But the thing is that it takes 2 to tango and have a meaningful friendship. It just isn't sustainable any other way. I can't force a friendship. He just has other priorities in his life now and like you said and I think he just needs a little time to come around. But in the meantime I do think I need to bite the bullet and make some amends with his spouse in a good faith effort. And although my friend and I have an implicit understanding, I need to remind him that the door is and will always be open. I will know him throughout my life, regardless of where life takes each of us, that is a given. But I also realize he may NOT come around and this may very well be the end to the friendship as I know it. That has been gnawing away at me for a while now because that is the direction it is headed and it scares me because I have grown to expect and rely on that friendship.

Thanks for your perspective jason els, and for sharing your wisdom.
 

jason_els

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jason els,

Thank you for caring so much to write something so thoughtful. It means a lot to me. Yup, it's the same guy I tested lawns with bare foot. He wasn't in the same scout troop however.

Most welcome. :smile:

But the thing is that it takes 2 to tango and have a meaningful friendship. It just isn't sustainable any other way. I can't force a friendship. He just has other priorities in his life now and like you said and I think he just needs a little time to come around.

For now, yes. He's still a newlywed trying to balance his life and live in a new paradigm. Try to have patience. Only he can work out his marriage. You know when people first get together they go through an exclusionary phase where they go into seclusion from their friends and family to bond and become a couple. The same process repeats again at marriage because they go from being a couple to being husband and husband. Marriage really does change the nature of relationships. It's a new experience for them together and they need time to work on the show before it opens to the public.

But in the meantime I do think I need to bite the bullet and make some amends with his spouse in a good faith effort. And although my friend and I have an implicit understanding, I need to remind him that the door is and will always be open. I will know him throughout my life, regardless of where life takes each of us, that is a given.

That's good. As he's going through an unsteady period it will be comforting for him to know this. If it's a good marriage, in time he and his husband will have things worked-out. They will find a way to balance expectations with responsibilities without smothering each other.

But I also realize he may NOT come around and this may very well be the end to the friendship as I know it. That has been gnawing away at me for a while now because that is the direction it is headed and it scares me because I have grown to expect and rely on that friendship.

Yes, that's possible. My father is 70 and he has a classmate from boarding school who got involved with the mafia and while they skated on charges of illegal dumping of toxic waste on this guy's land, he had the book thrown at him and is now in prison, his wife divorced him, and he lost his job and reputation. The legal costs bankrupted him so his classmates put together a legal defense fund and the one classmate who lives nearby visits him every week in prison.

My uncle, who is the same age, has had a friend of his from boyhood drive through once a year for the last ten years and my uncle allows him to park his RV on the farm for a few days. They have a great time together and he showed-up out of nowhere.

My mom went to boarding school with Jane Fonda. As an Emma Willard girl, my mom's no pushover but she was sure Jane wouldn't remember her or bother much. Instead they spent their reunion together having a blast. For all the people she knew in the world, she was most comfortable and open with her friends from long ago.

In each case, and there are others I know of in people not so mature, people were taking stock of their lives and wondering who in those lives really mattered. Emily Gibbs asked the Stage Manager, "Do any of them realize life while they live it? Every minute?" He replies, "No, no they don't. The saints and the poets: they do, some."

I'm not a poet and I'm certainly no saint but I have a very keen sense of life as it passes, earnestly trying to learn the wisdom of the old and the young. I feel time acutely. If I have learned anything is that some really do, "lose the race to rats. Get caught in ticking traps," (sorry to sound like a Zagat guide) while others manage to keep focused on what really matters in life, and that's love. Corny, but true. He may leave for a while, he may come right back, in the end though, whether you make the first move or he does, you'll come back to each other. Just keep that candle in the window because somewhere in him, he knows you really do love him no matter what. Time may come when he realizes that the candles you and others keep, will guide him home.

Thanks for your perspective jason els, and for sharing your wisdom.

Your servant sir. :hug:
 

TheRob

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well if he's really your friend, and he's happy, then u should be happy for him and chill the fuck out...

?
right and if a female friend is with a guy that beats her but she says she's happy you should be happy for her to?
cmon now


I feel your pain man I rarely like my female friends b/f's
I just think they could all do so much better
 

allmale

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Yeah, it sucks when they get married and they completely change, a 180 degree turn, that you know their wives/husbands/SO insisted on. I can deal with it, mostly, I'll probably still be around to talk if they want but I no longer really get into details. What I cannot stand, and I mean CANNOT stand, is when your former best friend and or wife/husband/SO insist on telling you what's wrong with your life, and how YOU ought to change. Like I have to change with them. Then I firmly remind them that not everyone follows the same path in life, it usually ends after that.
 

D_Tintagel_Demondong

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One of my beer buddies, who has been engaged for about a year, has set a date. Not only am I going to lose yet another friend to a domineering, overly-protective wife, but she really henpecks him. It's horrible. He's a 6'4 muscular guy and she's tiny, but he is terrified of her and at her beck and call.

I have never tried to interfere with a relationship before, but I am afraid that I must have to have a talk with him. I think that either: he'll get pissed off at me and we'll have a fight; she'll find out and tell him to never speak to me again; I'll be seen as a meddler.

I've strongly considered the fact that I am being selfish, but I am genuinely concerned for his future.
 

F_Man

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It's your sacred duty as a man and a friend to try to prevent the upcoming disaster.

In no time will she get herself pregnant and then withdraw from sex, or use limiting it to tighten her control:) A little femme finger can be mightier than a big mantool:)


One of my beer buddies, who has been engaged for about a year, has set a date. Not only am I going to lose yet another friend to a domineering, overly-protective wife, but she really henpecks him. It's horrible. He's a 6'4 muscular guy and she's tiny, but he is terrified of her and at her beck and call.

I have never tried to interfere with a relationship before, but I am afraid that I must have to have a talk with him. I think that either: he'll get pissed off at me and we'll have a fight; she'll find out and tell him to never speak to me again; I'll be seen as a meddler.

I've strongly considered the fact that I am being selfish, but I am genuinely concerned for his future.
 

B_Bonky

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I don't think it's anybody's duty to save an idiot from his own idiocy.
 

earllogjam

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One of my beer buddies, who has been engaged for about a year, has set a date. Not only am I going to lose yet another friend to a domineering, overly-protective wife, but she really henpecks him. It's horrible. He's a 6'4 muscular guy and she's tiny, but he is terrified of her and at her beck and call.

I have never tried to interfere with a relationship before, but I am afraid that I must have to have a talk with him. I think that either: he'll get pissed off at me and we'll have a fight; she'll find out and tell him to never speak to me again; I'll be seen as a meddler.

I've strongly considered the fact that I am being selfish, but I am genuinely concerned for his future.

Rex, your friend has a new life with someone he loves dearly. She has to be the most important person in his life now. I'd say just give him time to adjust - it's only been a year... I would however talk to him but don't speak negatively about his wife. That puts him between a rock and hard place because he has to choose and most likely he'll choose his wife.

I feel for you guy. It's rough to loose a good friend cuz they are harder to make when you get older it seems.