Married But can't tell her i like to JO with guys

[NY4Curious]

I don't believe it's a requirement of a good, close and production marriage to have mates share the intimate details of their employment, the confidences of patients and clients, and other areas that are exclusive to either of the partners. I think those who are telling this guy he "must" tell his wife of his mutual masturbation experiences and fantasies are just trying to have him stir up more trouble for himself than either he or his wife may be prepared to deal with. He says she'd be hurt for the rest of her life, and he knows her better than any of us do and if that is his perception of her, I'll take that a face value.

It would be wonderful if every ideal could be applied to every individual on earth, but human nature does not allow for this. Discretion is the better part of valour, and as long as his same sex fantasies hurt neither of them and don't affect their marriage, I don't see why it's important at all he "confesses" to her. Better he uses his secret sex life to grow stronger for her and uses it as a stimulant for their sex live to continue to be fulfilling and exciting.
While all people should have equal rights under the law, all things are not equal in the course of human events. Life just isn't fair guys, never has been. Let him live his life the way it works for him. That's all that matter, that it works for him.

 

[jerkforfun]

While your advice is a little brash, Calambo, it seems to be my only PRCTICAL solution. The ideal doesn't always fit with the REAL. Ideally I'd be compeletely honest and exposed to her. This doesn't take into account the effect it'd have on her, though. If I had a best friend that i saw daily I'd consider telling him/her, but I'd have to be sure he/she won't go through life uncomfortable with me and I'd have to trust him/her not to tell my wife.

Do I want to bear my soul to her? Yes. Can she handle it? Not all of it. I don't think so, yet, anyway. Not worth the risk. Cuz if she wants a divorce, she wouldn't allow it (and I'd never want one) until the kids are grown.


Yes. It's possible she'd be like "oh if u want to jerk it with your buddies it's no big deal" - but I kind of doubt it. I think I can control myself. Maybe Jo in front of him without touching him? Idunno sounds like splitting hairs. Cumming in the presence of another is probably her definition of cheating - again making me deceitful. Ahrghhhhh! It'd be so nice to be one of those 100% guys. Gay or straight. Society structured us that way.

 

[Corius]

O. K.,JERKFORFUN, it may be the ideal that married folks have no secrets from each other but I dare to say that after 58 years of marriage, I still think to hold to that notion is foolish.

There are some things in life which you share with no other person. That is what being an individual also includes. When I married I still had in my mind the wonderful relationship (which lasted for more than two years) I had had with a beautiful Swedish-American who was not just physically beautiful, but wonderfully endowed, a patient, enthusiastic, and devoted lover, and a gentle man in all respects.

But, back then we males had all been programmed to accept the idea that we would settle down in marriage. Indeed, my first experience with sexual communion with a lady convinced me that I would one day be a married man. Yet, I was happy and faithful in two relationships with men before I finally married. I do admit to myself that I miss m2m sex and even at my age I do allow that were I free I might willingly again be a sexual partner to a man.

I ask you, JERKFORFUN, would I feel better and would my wife really be helped to know all this about me? I honestly do not thinkk so. In my mind I deal with those animal urges (which include both sexes) by being shamelessly promiscuous. Would my wife really be helped to know of the satisfaction I get from my occasional solo sessions which over the years have alllowed me to fuck hundreds and also to be fucked by hundreds. I rely on my brain to keep my animal urges in check.

JERKFORFUN, I know that when I see a sexually attractive person, my mind can quickly endow that person with a cock, tits, vagina, asshole and I do do just that often it seemed "without thinking" and my whole system goes to work and before I know it, I know that my cockhead has received a bit ot wonderful lubrication, lubrication which I know I must hurry to a restroom to sop up--but not before I have experienced the minor delight of running my index finger through that wonderful stuff and around my cockhead. Do you really think my wife would be helped in knowing what a sensuos fellow she is married to? Frankly, I really don't think she has ever been in any doubt.

When my wife tells me that I never cease to amaze her and that she is still expecting to learn something new about me, I am complimented. I feel the same toward her. I have never asked about her sex life prior to our marriage and she has never asked about my sexual history although she has met and enjoyed the company of every singel one of my former sex partners. I am very sure that she has figured out that these persons (three men and two women) were more than just friends to me. She knows that two of these friends have been in discreet long-term gay relaitonships. I really doin't think my wife is such a dimwit that I have to draw pictures for her.

I say it over and over again, that one ought to come to appreciate the sheer wonder and beauty of human sexuality in all of its manifestations and to constantly in awe of the mystery of human sexual relationships.

In this world I may not ever have all that I want, but I do have all that I need for my happiness as a sensuous human being.

 

[DavidXL]

Jerk4fun - I am in the same boat as you. I had very, very limited experience with guys before I was married (i.e., only a few mutual JO situations). I was good at suppressing it until about 3 years ago, when I started jerking off from time to time (about once a month) with guys at the gym. I wouldn't touch other guys or let them touch me, because I didn't want things to get carried away. At first, I felt guilty about it. Now, after rationalizing it, I don't. With no touching, it's not much different than watching porn. Doing it once a month like this has been pretty much enough for me.

The danger when you allow touching is how quickly and easily things can get carried away. For the last 7 or 8 months, I jerked off pretty exclusively with this one super hot guy at the gym about once a month. When he reached out to give me a feel, I couldn't help myself, he was that good looking. Last night, we met outside the gym and we had sex (not intercourse, but everything else). Stupid, I know. The funny thing is, our encounter was pretty good, but not great. It made me realize that I really do prefer sex with women and that I'd rather just jerk off with guys and not go further.

Good luck with everything - it's certainly not easy to be in this predicament, not fully in one camp or the other.

 

[HungThickProf]

DR...why so?..as soon as u tell your secrets..they are no longer secrets...do u think the wife will not share this info w/her friends/family??...u think she will not throw this up everytime he is late from work or even home depot?...in a short time everyone of thier COMMON friends will know his secrets....should Jerk even then tell wife he is hangin at a DICK site?....sure if he wants outed and divorced...Sorry DR,...i can tell U are not married...This guy can read all the support info he wants...ask a longtime married guy...I bet the advice is....SHUT THE FUCK UP.....

Well, I'm sorry, but I don't agree. If his wife is the type of person who would do any of those things, then he maybe he shouldn't be married to her. Because that doesn't sound like a person you'd say "I do" to, but a bitch from "Mean Girls". We all have secrets. And what I find to be a little bit funny is the fact that I've spoken to a lot of married men on this site in the past. Most of them have this attitude that's like "I'm my own man, and I don't give a shit about what people think of me." And I'm willing to bet as much as they all love their wives, the only reason they ever got married is because of pressure from their families, or because they believed it was expected of them.

And no, Calambo- I'm not married. I was man enough to tell the truth- to myself, and my family. I enjoy being myself, and I love never feeling like I have to hide anything; no lies to keep up with. And my dad was gay- I know how it can effect a family. And as I've said before- it's not the truth that does the damage, it's the lies.

And sure, you may have to build trust back up with your wives after such information is given to her. But that wouldn't have to be done had you told the truth to begin with.

 

[HungThickProf]

So, I spoke to my mom about this, and she gave me an interesting point of view. She told me that if my stepfather told her that he enjoyed such things, that would be end of it for her. She said that if he told her that he was bi, she would want him to do him- meaning, just be who he is, and live his life. She then stated that it's different strokes for different folks, and some women are okay with it- she has some friends who prefer bisexual men. So, what we agreed upon- even if you're bisexual- if you're married to a woman, then you should not have any sexual encounters with men- because it would be the same as having them with a woman- you chose a woman, and that's it. Two guys jerking off together is different from jerking off to porn because you both are sharing an intimate moment. Period. With porn, there's no connection- that person doesn't know you, and you don't know them- and the only intimacy you have is with yourself.

So if you're married, you're in that relationship until you part ways, either it be divorce or death. You may do as you please, but infidelity is infidelity, no matter what gender- and there's just no justifying it.

 

[jerkforfun]

NYC, and everyone, thanks for your input. Dr Dante thanks for consulting your mom on my issue. I think you both are right. Synthesizing advice i dont necessarily like but agree with, the consensus seems to be: 1)don't meet up in secret, b/c intimacy is to be shared with wifey only (but where does male bonding become too intimate??)
2) Solo is ok with some porn or something.
3) don't tell her about your occasional arousal with dicks unless you think she can take it.

Do you agree?

 

[HungThickProf]

NYC, and everyone, thanks for your input. Dr Dante thanks for consulting your mom on my issue. I think you both are right. Synthesizing advice i dont necessarily like but agree with, the consensus seems to be: 1)don't meet up in secret, b/c intimacy is to be shared with wifey only (but where does male bonding become too intimate??)
2) Solo is ok with some porn or something.
3) don't tell her about your occasional arousal with dicks unless you think she can take it.

Do you agree?

You're welcome! I'm very open and honest about myself (with discretion of course in public- but like I said- I am who I am, and people like me for it). I had no problem asking her input. Now please understand- after having a gay dad/her late ex- she can still feel a little scorned. Had that situation never occurred, she may feel differently. It wasn't her being told the truth, but discovering it- that was the biggest blow.

But to hit on your list.

1) Male bonding is okay. You can have a bromance with someone, just make sure it doesn't get physical. Sometimes that connection is really what we seek.
2) Solo with porn is totally okay. It's what gets you off- and all men masturbate. So do women.
3) That's completely your call. The road to honesty, comfort, openness, and sexual freedom is long and it's not always easy to travel- but you eventually get to your destination. And no matter what anyone says- sexual urges are part of who you are. You'll always have them, it's just about what you choose to do with them.

 

[NY4Curious]

I think the most important thing that any two people have to realize in order to have a successful relationship, is what works between them (spoken and unspoken). When someone says "I asked and they said..." It just doesn't cut it for me, because no two people are alike, no two people share the same life experiences and no two people have the same history of loves, hurts or insights and conclusions.
What works for you and your wife is good for you and your wife, and perhaps no one else, but it does work for you.
I really resent the people who don't know you and your wife and the nuances and unspoken agreements you have who tell you, you must tell her everything. No, you must tell her what you wants and needs you to tell her.
Please understand I am not advocating you have a full fledged affair with either a man or a woman behind her back. That would be dishonest and hurtful. But the shared glances and touches of two strangers in the night have little or nothing to do with your relationship with your wife. They have to do with you, and you get to have a private personal fanatasy or two, too (as does she, it does go both ways). Always think would you want her to tell you, what you have the urge to tell her.
That ought to give you a clear idea of what and what not to say.

 

[HungThickProf]

I think the most important thing that any two people have to realize in order to have a successful relationship, is what works between them (spoken and unspoken). When someone says "I asked and they said..." It just doesn't cut it for me, because no two people are alike, no two people share the same life experiences and no two people have the same history of loves, hurts or insights and conclusions.
What works for you and your wife is good for you and your wife, and perhaps no one else, but it does work for you.
I really resent the people who don't know you and your wife and the nuances and unspoken agreements you have who tell you, you must tell her everything. No, you must tell her what you wants and needs you to tell her.
Please understand I am not advocating you have a full fledged affair with either a man or a woman behind her back. That would be dishonest and hurtful. But the shared glances and touches of two strangers in the night have little or nothing to do with your relationship with your wife. They have to do with you, and you get to have a private personal fanatasy or two, too (as does she, it does go both ways). Always think would you want her to tell you, what you have the urge to tell her.
That ought to give you a clear idea of what and what not to say.

Good advice, however, you are telling him that is okay if he "touches" a stranger in the night. No matter how you see it, that's an affair. It doesn't matter if he lets someone stroke his dick, strokes their dick, or does whatever- once that line is crossed, it's crossed- no matter how far you go. He already has one secret he's questioning- the last thing he needs is another. It's one thing for him to feel this way, acting out on it is a completely different story. And when he said "I do", it had everything to do with his relationship with his wife.

And would he want to know this information about his wife? Considering where he stands- I'm sure he would- it would take a load off of him. And we can't say whether or not he would feel this way if he was in her shoes and didn't have these urges, because these urges don't represent who he is, but they are in fact a part of him, and have had an effect on who he is today.

 

[helgaleena]

Women can't jack each other off.

False :tongue:

 

[jerkforfun]

Thanks NY4curious and Dr. Ur discourse is very helpful. I should note, Dr, that I have ALREADY jacked with other dudes (I even tried sucking but thought it "sucked") so I basically already cheated. This led to much guilt and me swearing to myself I won't do it again. But that urge comes on strong sometimes. And the male bonding that comes with a mutual jerk off is so completely different from the intimacy I share with my wife that I rationalized it away as not cheating -- "it's not like I am in love with the dude"

But I agree with u that such rationalizations have no place. So again I resign to solo and porn. But how to get the male bonding part - without taking the opportunity to jack off with a guy as it presents itself (we're watching porn, or it's a crazy day at the gym shower) I just don't know.

 

[NY4Curious]

One place where I differ from Dr. Dante is I'm not bothered by the idea of an affair. I'm not a puritan. Sophisticated people for time in memorium have had affairs. I have few middle class values. An affair is an affair, nothing less, nothing more, it has nothing to do with comittment or long term relationships. It has to do with having an affair be it for a night, for a week end, a week or a year. It's not your primary relationship and as long as you don't loose respect for your primary relationship it cannot hurt it.
I don't think you should feel any guilt about strangers in the night Jerkforfun, rather I would feel guilty about opportunities for pleasure missed. But then I'm in, and have been for over thirty years, a very open relationship that respects the space of each other outside the relationship as "private space" that has nothing to do with us as a couple.
I believe in pleasure, not guilt. I think that's where the difference in point of view is.

 

[HungThickProf]

Jerk(as a verb of course),

If having an affair is something that you feel you can do, then that's your choice. Just remember that if you're caught, your consequences will be far worse than anything that could potentially happen if you were to tell your wife what you enjoy and what you have done in the past. Just something to consider. My mom caught my dad in the act and was prepared to take his life (she didn't, of course). There can be a lot of pain there. With that pain being a possibility, ask yourself how much you love her, yourself, and your marriage. If it was to end because of that, how is it going to effect your life?

 

[helgaleena]

"That male bonding thing'-- is it worth being unfaithful as you define it? How much of the feeling has to do with intermingled guilt? Would it be less sweet somehow if your wife were there, cheering you on, or would it be even more wonderful?

You will never know unless you tell her the truth. It's fifty-fifty whether she will be threatened by you wanting sex with a male or not. And let's not split hairs, JO is sex. But if she is NOT threatened, since it involves no rival female, you would have to give up feeling guilty. It might take all the 'forbidden fruit ' cachet away.

Either way, the love life of a married person always is a matter for the spouse as well.

 

[NY4Curious]

Both of you are obsessed with guilt. Even you have a spoken or unspoken agreement that you have private lives, you can't be caught doing anything, since caught implies you are going into the forbidden zone.
Any feeling of guilt would only result with your perception of what you were doing was wrong.
I am not a puritan, I'm a proud hedonist, as is my mate. We respect this in each other and enjoy ourselves both as a couple and as individuals. Guilt is not part of our lives, only pleasure. I know that's shocking and shameful to many, but it sure is a lot of fun to us.
When trouble makers say, "how can you allow her (or him) to do that." The first answer is always, "but we always come home to each other" (and have for nearly forty years). When we're told "But you're loosing control and power over your mate", our happy answer is, "We are not interested in controlling and having power over each other, we're interested in respecting and enjoying each other and each other's achievements."--Difficult, you bet! But no more difficult than wearing the straight jacket of conventionallity.
The phrase there is no freedom without responsibility, applies to every aspect of our lives, political, economic and sexual. What I see in many of your responses is terror over the possibility of no responsibility (your own or your mates). Without a great deal of self respect and responsibility, a relationship such as I am in is totally impossible. I consider myself many times blessed and very fortunate to have found a person who not only was able to develope it, but who also had the desire to develope a relationship based on mutual freedom.

 

[HungThickProf]

Both of you are obsessed with guilt. Even you have a spoken or unspoken agreement that you have private lives, you can't be caught doing anything, since caught implies you are going into the forbidden zone.
Any feeling of guilt would only result with your perception of what you were doing was wrong.
I am not a puritan, I'm a proud hedonist, as is my mate. We respect this in each other and enjoy ourselves both as a couple and as individuals. Guilt is not part of our lives, only pleasure. I know that's shocking and shameful to many, but it sure is a lot of fun to us.
When trouble makers say, "how can you allow her (or him) to do that." The first answer is always, "but we always come home to each other" (and have for nearly forty years). When we're told "But you're loosing control and power over your mate", our happy answer is, "We are not interested in controlling and having power over each other, we're interested in respecting and enjoying each other and each other's achievements."--Difficult, you bet! But no more difficult than wearing the straight jacket of conventionallity.
The phrase there is no freedom without responsibility, applies to every aspect of our lives, political, economic and sexual. What I see in many of your responses is terror over the possibility of no responsibility (your own or your mates). Without a great deal of self respect and responsibility, a relationship such as I am in is totally impossible. I consider myself many times blessed and very fortunate to have found a person who not only was able to develope it, but who also had the desire to develope a relationship based on mutual freedom.

I understand what you're saying, and you and your partner do you own things. That's cool! That's your call, and it's apparent that there's an understanding there. In his situation, there isn't. From what he knows of his wife, he's terrified to tell her that he likes to masturbate with other men- I don't believe this would just be one those "eh, he always comes back home" situations. And the reason that you and your partner have no guilt about what you do is because you're both aware that the other is plugging or getting plugged by some stranger in the night. So you're telling him that he shouldn't have guilt about his actions, but his relationship is not like yours. His wife isn't having a little tickle with some hot man she met in the line at Starbucks. And if she is, he truly doesn't have a clue about it. It's just not the same.

 

[blooeyz]

dear jerk.........just a few words....DENY....KEEP YOUR TRAP SHUT....DENY...hope this helps...wives never understand...NEVER......happy jackin bud!!!

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:
best advice yet

 

[HungThickProf]

:laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2::laugh2:
best advice yet

Oh, ewww.