Married Woman Situation

Sklar

Superior Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Posts
1,640
Media
25
Likes
3,494
Points
368
Location
Everett, Washington, US
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
jeffblack said:
You know, if the married couple is ok with having an open marriage, then does that still make it cheating?

That's a tough one for me, Jeff. One the one hand, it is cheating and should be wrong. On the other hand, if the other person knows about it and is ok with it, then it's not wrong. I just don't understand it is all.

Why bother with the marriage/relationship if it's going to be open? Why not just be two people who enjoy sex with different people? Why go through the pretense of a realtionship?
 

jeff black

Expert Member
Joined
Mar 2, 2006
Posts
10,432
Media
3
Likes
175
Points
193
Location
CANADA
Sklar said:
Why bother with the marriage/relationship if it's going to be open? Why not just be two people who enjoy sex with different people? Why go through the pretense of a realtionship?

Well, as I said earlier, people don't go into a marriage thinking it is going to be open. they drift apart, have children, and lose the Spark they once had. We all know of it, the one that has them eye-fucking each other across the table. It isn't easy to get back, and as a result, both parties may agree to open their relationship up.

They could have children, or not be able to split financially. Perhaps, they still care for each other and have everything EXCEPT the sexual chemistry. Would you leave your best friend because the sex sucked? No, you would make due, because you care for them.:rolleyes:
 

DC_DEEP

Sexy Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Posts
8,714
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
Sklar said:
That's a tough one for me, Jeff. One the one hand, it is cheating and should be wrong. On the other hand, if the other person knows about it and is ok with it, then it's not wrong. I just don't understand it is all.

Why bother with the marriage/relationship if it's going to be open? Why not just be two people who enjoy sex with different people? Why go through the pretense of a realtionship?
You are confusing several different issues here. Sexual gratification should never be the sole reason for having a "relationship." Being married or in a relationship should be because you love that person. If you have ever masturbated, you should know that sexual release does not necessarily have anything to do with love.

The whole concept of fidelity/cheating is based on mutually understood rules.

A lady I used to work with went to a company party with her husband. They both danced all night, but never with each other. The next day, several women were asking her "weren't you jealous when he danced with other women? Wasn't he jealous when you danced with other men?" She very casually answered, "We dance to have fun. I can dance with him, at home, any time I want. When we are out, we dance with other people. I know who he's going home with, so what is there to be jealous about?"

If you don't understand how an open relationship works, it does not mean that it's wrong, it just means you don't understand it. For me, the honesty is what's important. And I am confident that my partner and I have a strong enough relationship that neither of us will have sex with another person and suddenly "fall out of love." We both just enjoy involving other people into our sex life, not our love life.
 

Sklar

Superior Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2006
Posts
1,640
Media
25
Likes
3,494
Points
368
Location
Everett, Washington, US
Sexuality
100% Gay, 0% Straight
Gender
Male
You do a grave injustice to this issue, DC_DEEP by equating cheating with someone sexually to a married couple going out and dancing with different people. Using that logic, if you go out to the movies with a friend, you are cheating on your partner.

Remember, the whole reason for this thread is that the woman hungnate banged was married and her husband doesn't know.

I've already admitted that I don't get the open relationship thing. If the relationship has downgraded to being best friends with benefits (and apparently benefits on the side too) why stay in a stagnant relationship?

Yes, sex ISN'T the main reason for a relationship. But when the sex is bad or there is cheating going on, it becomes a BIG issue in the relationship.

Sticking ONLY with the cheating aspect of it: There is a profound lack of trust. I can't be friends with people I can't trust LET ALONE have a relationship with one.

And I don't think anyone else should, either.

Also, DCDEEP, you never answered my question on why stay in the relationship? Why not be two people who enjoy sex with different people and be more of friends with benefits than tarnish the marriage vows?
 

DC_DEEP

Sexy Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Posts
8,714
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
Sklar said:
Also, DCDEEP, you never answered my question on why stay in the relationship? Why not be two people who enjoy sex with different people and be more of friends with benefits than tarnish the marriage vows?
I'll see if I can be more clear and concrete this time. Sklar, this is not a personal attack, please don't interpret it as one.

I don't even know where to start with why I love my partner. I just love him. We have many common interests, and we have many individual interests. We have a very active and satisfying sex life. We have a very active and satisfying social life. We enjoy being together. We are in love. I care more about him than anything else in the world. For both of us, sex is not an all-or-nothing situation. Sex and love can go together, but are not the same thing. If you cannot distinguish between the two, that's fine - for you and your partner. If either or both of us have sex with a third party, it does not mean that we love each other less, or that either of us loves the third party - just that we had sex. And for us, it is all in the open, it is all honest, there is no cheating involved. Our relationship is not a pretense.

With my dancing example, I was just saying that not everyone is jealous. Some people do things outside the home that they cannot do inside the home. If that's dancing with other people, fine. If it's having sex, fine. As long as no one has to lie to anyone else to do it.

If my partner goes on a business trip, and tells me he is going to meet up with someone he knows from online, that's fine with me, and he is not cheating. If he goes on a business trip, and meets up with someone but tells me he didn't, that is cheating and we would definitely have it out.

We don't know the situation of the "married woman" in the original post. I have known couples who marry strictly for the legal benefits, and each has a lover with the other's knowledge and consent. You run into trouble when you try to fit every other person into your mold of the way things should be. If you do something with your partner's knowledge and consent, no one is hurt, and no cheating has occurred. If you do things that you have to hide or lie about, that is cheating, and there is no excuse for that kind of behavior.

Just curious, have you ever, even once, in your life, had sex with a person with whom you were not in love?

p. s. "tarnish the marriage vows" is very offensive language.
 

B_big dirigible

Experimental Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2005
Posts
2,672
Media
0
Likes
12
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
Sklar said:
Remember, the whole reason for this thread is that the woman hungnate banged was married and her husband doesn't know.

Where in the original post is there anything about what the lady's husband does or does not know? All that's stated as fact is that there is a husband in there somewhere.
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
I certainly agree with you guys that lying and sneaking around sucks. Fortunately I never dealt with that in my marriage but a good friend of mine did (she was the perp. as well as the victim) and I know she believes it wasn't worth it. Better to get a divorce than stay together and cheat, EVEN if you have kids. People who think they can keep secrets like that forever are probably wrong, and you'll do more damage to your kids by staying in a bad marriage and lying than by divorcing.

But really I see another issue here I think. In the issue the poster brought here, clearly the married woman is wrong, but is the poster wrong for going along? Clearly he might get into a sticky situation, but does he have a moral responsibility to cut it off now that he knows she's married?

My first instinct says yes but really I have a hard time holding him responsible for her cheating. Unless he himself has lied to someone I'm not sure I fault him. Of course I see the other side which is we're all responsible for how our actions affect other people, but then again I believe in individual responsibility. It is a tough moral issue and clearly no easy answer.
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
big dirigible said:
Where in the original post is there anything about what the lady's husband does or does not know? All that's stated as fact is that there is a husband in there somewhere.

Obviously most marriages aren't open which is probably why we all assumed the woman is sneaking behind her husband's back. But big dirigible is right - I took another look at the original post and based on that info we don't know for sure that that's the case. Whether or not, this is still an interesting moral issue I think.
 

DC_DEEP

Sexy Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Posts
8,714
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
stud_hunter said:
But really I see another issue here which is a pretty big one. In the issue the poster brought here, clearly the married woman is wrong, but is the poster wrong for going along? Clearly he might get into a sticky situation, but does he have a moral responsibility to cut it off now that she knows he's married?

My first instinct says yes but really I have a hard time holding him responsible for her cheating. Unless he himself has lied to someone I'm not sure I fault him. Of course I see the other side which is we're all responsible for how our actions affect other people, but then again I believe in individual responsibility. It is a tough moral issue and clearly no easy answer.
stud hunter, do you think the golden rule would apply here as a measure of ethics? Do unto another man's wife, as you would have him do unto yours?
 

Ethyl

Legendary Member
Joined
Apr 5, 2006
Posts
5,194
Media
19
Likes
1,707
Points
333
Location
Philadelphia (Pennsylvania, United States)
Sexuality
99% Straight, 1% Gay
Gender
Female
Run, don't walk.

That's my gut response after reading about your dilemma.

But there are lots of questions that need to be answered before making a decision. She's married, but is she separated/thinking of divorce? Is there an arrangement between the woman and the husband? Ultimately, what does she want from you? If she sees you as nothing more than a "fling", do you want that and can you handle it, if so? Are the potential complications and repercussions stemming from an affair worth your time, energy, physical and mental health?. Just a few points to ponder.
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
DC_DEEP said:
stud hunter, do you think the golden rule would apply here as a measure of ethics? Do unto another man's wife, as you would have him do unto yours?

That is a simple point but I've given it some thought and I have a hard time disputing it. I think there are lots of situations where we don't follow the golden rule, some worse than others. In the end I don't think sleeping with her is the worst moral thing he could do, but you're right, I guess there's no question it's more moral for him not to based on courtesy for the husband, assuming of course that she's sneaking around.
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
mercurialbliss said:
Run, don't walk.

That's my gut response after reading about your dilemma.

But there are lots of questions that need to be answered before making a decision. She's married, but is she separated/thinking of divorce? Is there an arrangement between the woman and the husband? Ultimately, what does she want from you? If she sees you as nothing more than a "fling", do you want that and can you handle it, if so? Are the potential complications and repercussions stemming from an affair worth your time, energy, physical and mental health?. Just a few points to ponder.

You are correct MB, what kind of relationship they're having is important, not just the woman and husband but the woman and poster. It really seems that if it's just a sexual fling, it's not worth it. I mean, I don't care how great her body is, this is a lot of hassle to go through.
I think the take home message is he needs way more info other than that she's married.
 

Wonderboy

Experimental Member
Joined
May 1, 2006
Posts
855
Media
0
Likes
10
Points
163
Location
High Above The Mucky Muck
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
This is another reason for me not to get married.

If someone is going to spend all that money, and say those supposedly holy vows...what's the point in cheating and disqualifying all that you've been through?
Marrying for money? That's fucked up too.

Anyway, there are older women who aren't married. Get into them.
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
Wonderboy said:
This is another reason for me not to get married.

If someone is going to spend all that money, and say those supposedly holy vows...what's the point in cheating and disqualifying all that you've been through?
Marrying for money? That's fucked up too.

Indeed.
When I got married, I did it because I was in love, and through the 16 yrs until it ended there was never any cheating as far as I know. Yet still I have no interest in ever getting married again. I think I see myself eventually :biggrin1: in a monogamous longterm relationship, but I have no interest in marriage. I think you wake up every day and decide if you want to be with that person. If you stop wanting to be with that person you leave. All marriage does is box people in.
 

DC_DEEP

Sexy Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Posts
8,714
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
stud_hunter said:
That is a simple point but I've given it some thought and I have a hard time disputing it. I think there are lots of situations where we don't follow the golden rule, some worse than others. In the end I don't think sleeping with her is the worst moral thing he could do, but you're right, I guess there's no question it's more moral for him not to based on courtesy for the husband, assuming of course that she's sneaking around.
You are right, of course. And believe it or not, I really actually do follow the golden rule, almost without exception in any given situation. It's not always convenient or comfortable or profitable, but you know what? There's very little that I do that can "come back and bite me in the ass." I don't do things that I know I will feel guilty about. I just do not do things to other people that I would not want done to me. Yeah, I know, I'm in the minority, but that's just the way I'm wired. In the end, honesty is easier than deceit.

Funny thing, years ago an uncomfortable situation developed between some of my friends. A single guy started having a sexual relationship with a married woman, all in the same circle of friends. The single guy, at one point, started being jealous of the woman's husband. How nervy is that?
 

stud_hunter

Experimental Member
Joined
Feb 12, 2006
Posts
811
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
163
Location
CA, USA
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Female
DC_DEEP said:
You are right, of course. And believe it or not, I really actually do follow the golden rule, almost without exception in any given situation. It's not always convenient or comfortable or profitable, but you know what? There's very little that I do that can "come back and bite me in the ass." I don't do things that I know I will feel guilty about. I just do not do things to other people that I would not want done to me. Yeah, I know, I'm in the minority, but that's just the way I'm wired. In the end, honesty is easier than deceit.

Funny thing, years ago an uncomfortable situation developed between some of my friends. A single guy started having a sexual relationship with a married woman, all in the same circle of friends. The single guy, at one point, started being jealous of the woman's husband. How nervy is that?

As for the golden rule, I certainly think that's noble and you're right, living that way probably allows a clean conscience.
As for the single guy being jealous of the husband, I think it's only natural. He wanted her to himself, and he knew that the husband the advantage of being married to her and living with her. Do you think if our original poster here decides to end his fling, he's going to be jealous of the husband for having access to this "hardbody"? I think so.
 

SurferGirlCA

Cherished Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2004
Posts
1,242
Media
0
Likes
478
Points
303
Location
Los Angeles (California, United States)
Sexuality
99% Straight, 1% Gay
Gender
Female
hungnate said:
Anyway I don't know anything about the guy like if he cheats or if he's the perfect husband or whatever. Either way, she told me she wants to get together again and I told her sure but now I can't stop thinking about this. On one hand I think maybe I should bail and on the other hand like I said she's got a serious body on her and I'm thinking I should just let her make her choice and go for it.
Just keep in mind that she has already said she wants to have sex with you again. Therefore, her response to any questions you might ask her about her husband or their relationship may be filtered through that perspective - i.e., she wants sex with you, so if she thinks telling you "he doesn't understand me" or "he's ok with me having sex outside the marriage" or "I'm sure he cheats, too" is going to help with that, who knows if what she tells you is true?

My attitude about this question on "is it ok to help someone else cheat in their relationship, since I'm not the one doing the cheating?" is really simple:

How would you feel if you were the bf/husband in this instance?

If you've never been in a committed relationship with someone who betrayed that, consider yourself fortunate. It's not a nice feeling.
 

DC_DEEP

Sexy Member
Joined
Apr 13, 2005
Posts
8,714
Media
0
Likes
93
Points
183
Sexuality
No Response
SurferGirlCA said:
Just keep in mind that she has already said she wants to have sex with you again. Therefore, her response to any questions you might ask her about her husband or their relationship may be filtered through that perspective - i.e., she wants sex with you, so if she thinks telling you "he doesn't understand me" or "he's ok with me having sex outside the marriage" or "I'm sure he cheats, too" is going to help with that, who knows if what she tells you is true?

My attitude about this question on "is it ok to help someone else cheat in their relationship, since I'm not the one doing the cheating?" is really simple:

How would you feel if you were the bf/husband in this instance?

If you've never been in a committed relationship with someone who betrayed that, consider yourself fortunate. It's not a nice feeling.
Ha, SurferGirl, you paraphrased my last couple of posts, but said it more eloquently. Thank you. (You RAWK!)