massive stock sell off monday

Discussion in 'Politics' started by B_Marius567, Jul 24, 2011.

  1. B_Marius567

    B_Marius567 New Member

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    debt talks have failed look for a massive stock sell off monday. the tea party thinks not thing bad will happen :mad:
     
    #1 B_Marius567, Jul 24, 2011
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2011
  2. Jason

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    The US problems on their own may cause a miserable Monday for the markets.

    But don't forget the euro crisis. The "solution" of Thursday is:
    a) a default, even if Merkel and Sarkozy want us to call it a "negotiation".
    b) cannot possibly work as the Greek default is only 21% while Greece needs 65%.
    c) does nothing for Spain and Italy and does not solve Ireland and Portugal.
    d) in any case much of it has to be implemented by 17 national parliaments.
    This is also likely to lead to a dire Monday.

    Maybe there will be sudden progress on these problems. Maybe the markets had taken them into account Friday. But really Monday looks dire.
     
  3. TomCat84

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    My prediction: The GOP lets the U.S. default for the first time in its history. The DOW's plunge the next day rivals any in its history, then the corporate masters of this country call up their henchmen, the members of Congress, and the next day the debt limit is raised. Republicans have massive losses in 2012, and Obama is re-elected in a landslide. Democrats regain the majority, which they again dither away.
     
  4. B_crackoff

    B_crackoff New Member

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    Well it's only 109 down in grey trading. The Ftse's down 34, & gold is up 16.

    I would advise that any massive sell off - at this stage - would be a short term buying opportunity. A budget will be agreed. It's as much Obama as the House. Gridlock is democracy in action.

    That said, even Reagan's 1st admin had a top tax rate of 50% in pretty tough times, & they'd been there at least 50 years from the 1st depression.

    I've gotta say - if they don't want the end of the temporary tax cut, those bastard rich better start spend, spend, spending domestically. The US is not their own personal piggy bank.
     
  5. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    find another crisis to blame on the tea party. Dow futures are down less than 1%.

    :rolleyes:
     
  6. TomCat84

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    Right, so this brinksmanship is the fault of Obama. If he would only go along with what the Tea Party wanted, then there would be no problem?
     
  7. Jason

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    The markets are surprising.

    The reason appears to be that there is near certainty that the USA will find a solution (though possibly with just minutes to go). All the trading seems predicated on this belief. I hope everyone is right. This is a horribly dangerous game. If it goes wrong the consequences for the whole world are dire.
     
  8. eieddie

    eieddie New Member

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    If this country re-elects Obama in a landslide, we have bigger problems than the national debt!
     
  9. spoon

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    i don't know what to think about this. my uneducated guess is that they will agree to sign something before the deadline, because, our elected government policy makers could lose money, and, god forbid their stocks/investments aren't worth much.
     
  10. Jason

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    Yes.

    This has gone beyond finance or politics and has become an article of faith, almost a religion. Americans - pretty much all Americans - believe absolutely that it is impossible that America will default. It just can't happen. Therefore the markets are not even factoring in the possibility. It seems credible that the modest falls today have more to do with the continuing euro saga than the potential catastrophe starting in America. If that is the case then American (blind) faith has defied logic.
     
  11. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    kind of a wild interpretation of my post, dontya think?

    I will concede that yes - Obama is stepping all over himself.

    They will come to an agreement, each side will make concessions and the world will continue to turn.
     
  12. dandelion

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    Watched obama on tv just now (yes, even possible in the uk). He seemed entirely sensible. But then so did his opponent who had a go afterwards. It struck me that Obama was explaining to the US public the facts of the situation, which I had gathered from reading posts here. This suggests the US public needed to have the facts explained. Oh dear.

    I think Obama has no choice but to stick to the democrat solution, including raising taxes. As he pointed out, the republicans are not minded to compromise and have set things up to re-run the entire issue in a few months. I do not see that Obama could or should do anything except stand firm. I would think that to give in would be to destroy himself politically, never mind the economic consequences. The republicans seem to be of the view that there should not be state taxation or state social services. I think the first is absurd, and the second unacceptable in a modern society. There needs to be a solution to this deadlock, and if it requires US default and harm to the economy to resolve it, so be it. (besides, the fuss ought to help the debt problems in europe, so I shouldnt complain about that.)
     
  13. parr

    parr New Member

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    Yea, it's always the tea party's fault, isn't it. Next thing they will blame them for bad weather.
     
  14. Jason

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    There seems to be utter conviction in the US that the crisis will be solved at the eleventh hour.

    There are problems with this view. We should now be seeing markets falling, and this would act as the wake up call for both parties to get their act together. But this isn't happening, so the matter seems political rather than economic, and the politicians want to be able to argue they have won and the other side has lost (or at least the other side is responsible for anything that goes wrong).

    The danger is that the politicians get so entrenched that they don't make the necessary agreement. Or some catastrophe in the next few days derails confidence in the USA - say earthquake, volcano, terrorist attack, war, euro crisis.

    I would like to lock senior US politicians in a room and tell them they cannot come out (or be fed!) until they've agreed.
     
  15. Ldnn

    Ldnn Member

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    Yes largely the problem isn't practical but it's about 'Who authorised the debt increase'.

    Both sides seem practically resigned to the actual limit being increased, they're thinking about the next election instead of the good of the country.

    Half my problem with the democratic system in both the UK and the US is they're too concerned with how things look.. instead of how they actually run the country. I'm not going to re-interate the entrenched positions, but they need to actually learn to negotiate, and while I agree the TP seems pretty entrenched and unable, it's unlikely to get a bigger piece of PR - either good or bad.
     
  16. Thedrewbert

    Thedrewbert Active Member

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    The Republicans have to field someone who isn't entirely batshit crazy first. If you want Obama out then vote for a reasonable candidate in the primaries... not the one with the most sparkle, fire, and brimstone.

    The biggest mistake the Republicans are making is running these utterly unelectable people. Don't tell me Romney is it, he is so starched white shirt that he makes Sen. Kerry look like Gene Simmons.
     
  17. D_Davy_Downspout

    D_Davy_Downspout Account Disabled

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    Everybody in the market knows that this is political drama bullshit and nobody is going to crash the world economy for tiny spending cuts.

    It's very telling, though, how easily the public is manipulated by the media the politicians repeating the same crap as if it's deadly serious. This is how the average person gets fucked by their government.
     
  18. hypoc8

    hypoc8 Member

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    Exactly!
     
  19. dazedandconfused

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    The problem is Ron Paul could win the general but not his primary...
     
  20. lurker37160

    lurker37160 Member

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    Will you share some of what you are smoking?
     
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