McCain and Obama First "Debate" Last Night

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Freddie53, Aug 17, 2008.

  1. Freddie53

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    7,285
    Likes Received:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The South, USA
    On CNN There was a "debate between Obama and McCain. It wasn't a true debate because each candidate had one hour with the very same set of questions. Obama was first. At the end of his time, McCain came to the stage, the two met, gave a slight hug and a firm handshake and then Obama left the stage. McCain was in a room so that he could NOT hear how Obama answered the questions.

    Pastor Rich Warren hosted the event at his church. Apparently Warren is personal friends with both men.

    The purpose of this event was to give each man a chance to share about faith; how he makes decisions and that sort of thing.

    I was surprised. This type of event clearly showed each man in his own style, personality etc. I saw who both men are more than any other time I have seen them on TV.

    What I learned was that:

    1. McCain is a "Bushite." If you really don't like Bush, then you won't like McCain.

    2. Obama showed that he is a deep thinker who really answered the questions that were asked. McCain chose to give a political spin on his remarks barely touching on the question numerous times.

    3. McCain showed that he is very impulsive and a extreme quick thinker. Both can be good qualities, but both can get a person or nation is a lot of trouble.

    4. Obama showed that he is very spiritual, has a real relationship with Jesus Christ. I don't see how anyone with any intelligence could come away from that interview still believing the heresy that Obama is a Muslim.

    5. McCain showed that his first allegiance is to America. He made that statement. He does believe in God. His slant though is a little different. NOt saying he is wrong. Obama's statements about faith were more in line with my thinking, very much so.

    6. On the subject of evil the two mens answers were different. The choices were no evil, defeat it, contain it or eliminate it.

    McCain's answer was to eliminate all evil and then he gave his examples of how to go about it. More war as evil is the problem in Iraq, the nation of Georgia, not the southern state Georgia and a few other examples.

    Obama said that the total elimination of evil was up to God, but that we can be soldiers in that fight to eliminate evil where ever we see it. But his examples were poverty, aids epidemic and other examples that weren't about politics or starting wars.

    7. On abortion, McCain said human life begins at conception. Obama said that he didn't know where human life (as in having a soul) begins and that was I don't remember his words, but I remember my perception was that was in God's domain. I agree wholeheartedly. (The medieval church thought life was in the seed as in the sperm. That is why they taught masturbation was wrong. It was taking life. I hope that is not next on the ultra right wing religous agenda!!!)

    Obama want to reduce abortion by making adoption easier, providing heath care and other help to women so that it makes it economically easier for the woman to keep the baby and raise it and not be in poverty.

    McCain only offered making the abortion choice a crime.

    8. The question was asked, "What is rich." Give a numerical number.

    Obama reply was $250,000 a year. McCain refused to give a number saying we all are rich if we have a job and are happy. McCain is against having the rich pay more because they have more.

    9. Comments to several questions revealed that McCain is solidly behind the Republican agenda. The agenda that has swelled our national debt to heights unknown.

    10. TAXES.

    McCain wants to reduce them some more. That will only swell our national debt to China even more. Someday we will pay dearly for that mistake.

    Obama. Obama has a plan to increase social security taxes starting in about 10 years. While this wasn't pointed out in that interview the Republican commentators are calling that a tax increase. If that isn't done then social security will not be able to pay out the benefits. Everyone knows that. That is the time I will really be needing social security as I will be to old to work provided I am even alive.

    What Obama did promise is there would be no tax increase for people who make less than $250,000. And some tax reduction for some people under $250,000. Closing some loops that some corporations and people use to get out of paying taxes would be closed as the working man can't take advantage of those.

    11. The question of privacy was asked. Both men were in favor of the right to privacy. I don't remember Obama's resonse as it didn't stand out in my mind. McCain said he was for right to privacy but with modern technology we needed to be able to monitor phone calls from out of the nation and gave other examples. I realize we have to take actions to protect our nation. But I am very skittish when politicians start talking about taking away our privacy. Bush's record on this (Patriot Act) should be unconstitutional.

    SUMMATION

    I know some of the Obama people here will curl just a little as this comment as I am going to compare Obama to Bill Clinton. Obama has that deep thinking and humble genuineness that Bill Clinton has. Obama is not only bright. He is brilliant. If Obama is elected, we can see things done pretty much like they were in the 90's balanced budget, and all the good indicators going up and the bad indicators going down. I don't mean that he will do exactly what Bill did then or Bill would do now. The result will the same. Both men are of a new school of Democrats.

    I came away from the interview a solid Obama backer. I had some doubts before last night.

    I had hopes that McCain was a different Republican. He is in that he doesn't make up his mind based on what a party tells him to do. That is admirable. I respect him for that. But McCain is solidly Republican through and through in his soul. That will tell us that we can expect more war, huge national debts, middle class dwindling, poverty increasing, but the rick getting richer and richer.

    Some lingering thoughts that I might vote for McCain went down the tubes last night. I was a solid Hillary Clinton supporter and was still angry that Obama "took" this away from her. The anger disappeared last night.

    If McCain wins in November he will be a war president for eight years if he lives that long. America will be the world's bully. If we don't watch it, the rest of the world will turn on us, cutting off everything the Republicans have allowed to be resourced out of the country. The rich will still be getting rich of the few goods that are allowed in at high prices.

    The Great American Moment in history when we saved the world from Hitler will long be forgotten. The Republicans are for the most part wanting to built an American Empire, not just military alliances for security

    If Obama is elected, the continuation of the outsourcing of jobs will be reversed. With the enormous debt, Obama can't change too much in eight years, but at least he can get the bad indicators going back in the right direction as good indicators in solving our nations problems.

    A POINT TO PONDER NOT MENTIONED IN THE DEBATE

    One thing not mentioned is that the percentage of black males incarnated in our prisons and the number of black males who are unemployed or make very little don't have a present day hero. As a school teacher, I firmly believe that Obama has the opportunity to be the role model that this young men need to try to get out of the cycle that has been repeated. Boys really need heroes. Heroes have a major impact on a person's behavior. Obama has a great chance to be just that super hero to millions of black males throughout our nation.

    FOR THOSE WHO BYPASSED THE MIDDLE. OBAMA WON THE INTERVIEW "DEBATE" HANDS DOWN.
    I made my decision last night to support Obama. All lingering doubts disappeared quickly.


    I have great respect for McCain as a person, but I can't vote for him. His vision for America is just too for away from mine to do so.
     
  2. Elmer Gantry

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    1,503
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    546
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Melbourne (VIC, AU)
    I watched that as well and, while Obama's performance was admirable, I came away with a gloomy despair that no matter which team you guys vote for, no one will be better off for it.
     
  3. Gl3nn

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2008
    Messages:
    1,457
    Likes Received:
    2
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Somewhere in the universe
    I think he uses the religion a bit too much in his answers.

    But i'd vote for Barack... if I were American
     
  4. uniqueusername

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2006
    Messages:
    221
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    I saw that debate, and I thought Obama came off looking indecisive and weak. The abortion question was a great example. McCain gave a contrite, unambiguous answer: Life starts at conception. There is no question at all about where he stands. Obama, on the other hand, said that that dcision was "above his pay grade." That's bullshit. If Obama is to be the President, he has to MAKE a decision. "I don't know" doesn't help anyone.

    But there's more to it than that. Had Obama answered "at conception," as McCain did, he would have alienated his strongly liberal base (but made great strides toward winning over white Evangelicals). Had he answered "at birth" or "sometime during pregnancy," he would have been booed and hissed by the strongly Christian audience at the Saddleback Church. We know from his voting record that his actual position on the matter is the latter; he was one of the most pro-abortion Senators in Illinois and the federal government. He was not trying to pass the buck to God; he was trying to sit on the fence and not commit to a position. In that respect, he has a lot in common with President Clinton (minus Clinton's gift for extemporaneous speaking). Freddie, this may have made him look good in your eyes, but I suspect you've been looking for reasons to like Obama and dislike McCain since Obama was nominated. If that is the case, I suggest you keep a more open mind.

    Clinton was NOT responsible for balancing the budget in the late 90's. He was simply in the right place at the right time. When Newt Gingrich and the Republicans took over Congress in 1994, they instituted several spending cuts and welfare reform. THAT is what caused the surplus.

    Furthermore, the Republicans tried to push through a Balanced Budget Amendment that would have made it constitutionally IMPOSSIBLE for the government to ever deficit spend again. Clinton opposed it, and used his influence on a few key Senators to defeat the amendment. It lost by one vote in the Senate. Were it not for Clinton, the Bush administration would not have been able to spend nearly as much as they have. Is that the kind of leadership you're looking for from Obama?
     
  5. Guy-jin

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2007
    Messages:
    3,835
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    669
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Planet Earth
    Switch the word "Obama" for "McCain" and the word "McCain" for "Obama" in this sentance and read it back to yourself.

    Funny how that works, isn't it?
     
  6. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2007
    Messages:
    10,516
    Likes Received:
    7
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Boston, MA / New York, NY
    Damn... didn't know this was on. Was too busy watching the Olympics and that cute Michael Phelps. Hopefully they show a replay, but the summary was well documented and informative. Thanks, Freddie! :)
     
  7. D_Bob_Crotchitch

    D_Bob_Crotchitch New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2006
    Messages:
    8,498
    Likes Received:
    18
    It doesn't matter who gets elected, the country is screwed. Taxes will be raised to help fund the ever growing dependence on the government. More and more people are going to need assistance, and people will still keep running down to buy imports. Imports hurt not help your country.
     
  8. Elmer Gantry

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    1,503
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    546
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Melbourne (VIC, AU)
    Do they make plasma screen TV's in the USA?
     
  9. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2007
    Messages:
    7,002
    Likes Received:
    12
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    Your fears about a presumed continuing American belligerence under McCain are echoed elsewhere, on occasion by some very thoughtful people.

    Were that the possible outcome of a McCain Presidency, I would entirely agree with you, and, yes, some of McCain's statements seem to support that concern.

    However, I feel the greater danger now is poised the more flighty, liberal internationalist policy outlines that Obama articulates pose the greater threat.

    The actions that led us into the incursion in Iraq, for example, and the character of the diplomacy surrounding that action, that you are ascribing to the Republican Party, rest entirely on Bush's inner circle, not the larger party.

    Likewise, with the careful selection of a more responsible and thoughtful team, McCain would avoid that sort of adventurism.

    Would the fundamentally different outlook that Obama espouses, recognize the real dangers for the nation that lie ahead?

    I fear not.

    I don't think Obama recognizes, or even has any hint about the strategies being pursued and implemented by the PRC, Iran, or the Russian Federation.

    If he does, I have to hear about it.



     
  10. Freddie53

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2004
    Messages:
    7,285
    Likes Received:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    The South, USA
     
  11. Skull Mason

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    3,101
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Dirty Jersey
    I'm not sure how one could come away from something like this with any better idea of what a person is really like. I could get up on stage in front of a crowd of people and put on a front, and no one would know that I'm Skull Mason the sex crazed slayer of the poonanny.

    Obama fronts a lot. So does McCain though, but at least he seems to be steadfast with his shit (whether I agree with it or not- and I don't). Obama was up there fronting. He is the mad fronter. He fronts like he isn't fronting.
     
  12. Elmer Gantry

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2006
    Messages:
    1,503
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    546
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Melbourne (VIC, AU)
    And he was fronting like there was no tomorrow.
     
  13. Northland

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2007
    Messages:
    6,082
    Likes Received:
    4
    ...and so ends your delusional topic title of "Debate". It was a set of questions plain and simple. Debate would involve some sort of back and forth, a give and take. (and yes, I am aware that you indicate that it was not a true debate. Point being that the title of your topic would have been more honest had you stated Questions and Answers.)
    Hogwash! To truly find both men as who they are, you'd need a hidden camera in a setting apart from the public eye. The two knew they were on television in front of an audience and that brings about some level of change (and not just the sort that Obama keeps crowing about),
    McCain is a Republican; however he has crossed the political aisle a number of times-why does it bother you so that someone could truly have that ability?
    Yes of course-Obama had no political agenda to place out there:rolleyes:.

    And the supposed Deep Thinking which you attribute to Obama can also place the nation in peril. If one spends too much time thinking, golden opportunities exit.

    Yes, I can pull off the spiritual show as well. As to beng a Muslim, what's your problem with that? Don't say it's not, it clearly is, as is evidenced by your bringing it up.
    Faith alone isn't going to lead the nation and in a nation filled with agnostics and atheists as well as the God fearers and tree worshipers, McCain has a better connect to the people (which is good since he doesn't have much connection anywhere else).

    I must admit that when Obama used the poverty and AIDS examples I was impressed, he clearly understood the question much better than McCain. Score one for Obie.

    I agree with both men. I agree with McCain on when life begins, from the moment of conception (a single cell is an energy form which equates to being life-this is my view.) I agree with Obama on his idea of making adoption easier (and how about less costly? Maybe Uncle Sam could step in and foot part of the bill on the adoption costs,)

    Regarding abortion, I see no reason to make it a crime. It should be a right which any woman can take advantage of. Should the government foot the bill? Within reason. Anything beyond three would seem excessive as far as government paying. (Please note, I am personally against abortion; however, I believe in the woman's right to choose)

    Interesting-you make mention of McCain's view on taxes; but negelect telling how Obama is on this. (and I think Obama needs a reality check if he is placing the rich level at $250,000. That would be a high wage for most people. Hell, there are families of 5 or 6 or more living decently on half of that. I live in New York City, one of the most expensive places in the world and live on less than 25% of that amount and feel quite well off.

    I also appreciate McCain's approach of getting spiritual for that moment by indicating that true wealth comes from happiness.

    Oh. Let me see now, McCain is backing the Republican agenda and he is running on the Republican ticket? How odd:rolleyes:. (and why no mention of how Obama clings to the Democratic platform? You are showing your bias through omission.)

    How sweet-I am talking to the Obama Social Security plan. Isn't it sweet how he plans to have it kick in ten years hence? Let me see now, that would mean two terms of a Democrat, most likely followed by a Republican (these things tend to follow historically) which means in 2016 a Republican would be elected and then in about 2019 the Social Security tax, er, um, deduction, would increase just shortly before the stage was set for the 2020 elections (candidates start poling their heads out of the ground in the year prior, which would be 2019). Still think Obama isn't being a full-blooded politician? (and call it a tax or a deduction, it's still a smaller paycheck taken home)


    I haven't bought this promise of no new taxes since George the First said: "Read my lips, no new taxes." we know where that went. No politician can make an honest promise about taxes because there is no crystal ball or magical tarot deck to tell what the next several years may bring.

    Your selective memory on Obama is worrisome to say the least-you may be suffering from selective memory loss (happens to politicians as well).

    As to McCain and the Patriot Act, I support the Patriot Act and considering how much and how many times I have been targeted by it, I believe that says a great deal about how important many of us (American Citizens) find it to be.

    I do not have much belief in either candidate at present and am only tepidly leaning towards Obama. A great deal of the weight towards tipping the scale completely for me will hinge upon the Veep candidate that each man selects.
     
  14. Trinity

    Trinity New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2006
    Messages:
    2,682
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Female
    LOL.

    No one...not pundits...not even Obama backers believe Obama won that debate. In fact, most believe Obama made serious gaffes, missed an opportunity to gain in the evangelical vote, looked indecisive and cliche' philosophical providing pat answers. In other words Obama appeared to be full of it.

    I actually heard one person on CNN say...Obama has to prepare better for the next debate.
     
  15. Guy-jin

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2007
    Messages:
    3,835
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    669
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Planet Earth
    Oh good, an even hand here to tell us how it is.

    Why do people even bother with these threads? There's no discussion of any worth in them. It's always the same people with the same stances bagging on each other. None of you ever change your mind.
     
  16. ClaireTalon

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    1,947
    Likes Received:
    2
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Puget Sound
    Uhhh... oh god, what an amount of text. Wish I could write that much. Just let me throw in some comments, ok?

     
  17. D_Bob_Crotchitch

    D_Bob_Crotchitch New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2006
    Messages:
    8,498
    Likes Received:
    18
    Whether he realizes it or not, Rick Warren put that church in a precarious position. The IRS has ruled that churches cannot be used for political campaign purposes. If it had gotten a little bit out of line, and he or the leaders openly expressed who they support, the church could have been slapped by the IRS. They can have their own opinion as private citizens but not while on duty.
     
  18. mista geechee

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2005
    Messages:
    1,103
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    charleston, south carolina
    So McCain was in a sound proof room while Obama answered the questions first?

    But wasn't it later revealed that McCain wasn't even in the building ? I mean cmon'...some of those answers sounded nothing like whaw McCain would say on the fly.

    I'm no conspiracy theorist, I'm just saying.....
     
  19. D_Bob_Crotchitch

    D_Bob_Crotchitch New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2006
    Messages:
    8,498
    Likes Received:
    18
    mg, you are too intelligent to believe that crap. Eat more pizza and charm the ladies.
     
  20. sargon20

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2006
    Messages:
    11,369
    Likes Received:
    2,099
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Atlantis
    Yada yada yada...all the talk about the candidates masks a huge ideological difference.


    • Do you believe government has a role in society or
    • Do you believe government just needs to get out of the way of business and let business 'provide' for the country.
    The Bushies and the conservative movement have been at war with government since Reagan. If you think we need more of the same vote McCain. If you think we've had enough vote Obama.

    If you think their personal beliefs mean anything more than the 'D' or the 'R' after their name means you haven't been paying attention.
     
    #20 sargon20, Aug 18, 2008
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2008
Draft saved Draft deleted