Miss USA 2009 Controversy

[Wyldgusechaz]

I have rarely read a more specious assessment of a given situation in my entire life. What color is the sky in your world?

You...are a complete moron.

Oh yeah? If I were a anti gay marriage publicity hack, here is what I wouild do:

Barack Obama candidate platform - BostonHerald.com

I linked that to show the dolts on this forum that the most liberal president in history is in full agreement with Miss California.

Question for the President of the United States: Mr. President, do you support the answer that marriage is between a man and a woman Miss California gave a gay rights advocate when questioned about her beliefs on gay marriage on a televised beauty pageant?

Our President is in the exact same camp as Miss California. Lets see if any gay advocates ambush the leader of the free world with that question. Or do they only bully young women to look like they are doing something for the gay marriage movement? Thats what it looks like to me and I bet I could spin this really well, corner the spokespeople for Obama and make Miss California look heroic by getting her supported by our President's own values.

Still think its specious?

Edit: You watch how this goes. This is like manna from heaven (pun)for the religious right. Perez Hilton fucked up big time.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Interesting that he asked the contestant from California - whom Perez knew was active in church and attended a Christian college.

He probably ruined her career in modeling/entertainment.

Let's see; what was the alternative - she lies and says she supports gay marraige and then ostracizes the very community that she lives amongst?

My answer would have been, "I don't encourage marriage for gays or straights. It strips you have your individuality and independence."

Assigning rights, vows, promises, et al., that are unnatural and fundamentally flawed greatly.

Oh, stop it with the conspiracy theory bullshit already.

And Wyld: To actually suggest that Perez Hilton is some kind of reflection of homosexuals just further proves just how out of touch you are with society. Honestly... a LOT more than just gay & lesbian people are showing support for gay marriage and equality these days. And Perez Hilton, a self-imposed celebrity who made a name for himself by creating a pink blog and drawing over paparazzi photography, is NOT making anyone look bad but himself. And you, because obviously you seem to think he represents all or at least the majority of gay men.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

just goes to show -- with libs around, there is no freedom of speech or thought

everyone is required to recite chapter and verse from the little red book

No, there IS freedom of speech. But it comes with a price, especially if you put something out there that people disagree with.

Just because it's free doesn't mean it's also "drama free". BIG difference.

 

[xthehotsex]

Her state, California, did vote to repeal gay marriage.
And she was not completley honest. Apparently, she has a family member who is a gay rights activist.
Thats what she gets for lying.

And she got cheers and boos for here answer. It was a lose, lose.
She should have said something like, "Well, I believe that states should follow when they are ready. We are all in the process of changing. Change takes time, and every state has the right to vote how they feel about the issue. That is what being an American is all about."

The question was if she believes that states should follow, not what she personally believes. But its hard to... hard.. to.. such as maps... difficult, um.. I mean... such as maps... to thinks when you are... um... thrown off by a question.

haha, good job.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

Oh, stop it with the conspiracy theory bullshit already.

And Wyld: To actually suggest that Perez Hilton is some kind of reflection of homosexuals just further proves just how out of touch you are with society. Honestly... a LOT more than just gay & lesbian people are showing support for gay marriage and equality these days. And Perez Hilton, a self-imposed celebrity who made a name for himself by creating a pink blog and drawing over paparazzi photography, is NOT making anyone look bad but himself. And you, because obviously you seem to think he represents all or at least the majority of gay men.

I know who PH is. I know he does not speak for gays and lesbians. But HE decided to pick a fight on TV. He needs to be denounced publicly by GLAD.

Look at the online comments from the very first google link I found.

'God was testing my faith,' says Miss California after Perez Hilton calls her a 'dumb bitch' in gay marriage row | Mail Online



Damn I am always right, and incredibly prescient........................again. The burden I bear.

She is getting support from all over the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gays lose. Pitiful.

 

[B_starinvestor]

Oh, stop it with the conspiracy theory bullshit already.

Their resumes, personal data, college attended, hobbies, etc. are all right there for the judges and viewers to see. I guess it was just a coincidence that he asks a devout christian about gay marriage.

I guess that publicity whore got the free pub he set out to get - unfortunately at the expense of a young adult that expended months/years of her life preparing for this event.

....steamroll anyone in your path to achieve free publicity and headlines, a la Howard Stern, Linda Tripp, Jessica Hahn, the Duke rugby hooker and other pillars of society.

 

[Principessa]

Personally, I don't think they should have allowed that question to be asked, if only for the fact that it's guaranteed to divide a crowd in half and there's no real way to treat the subject politely without pissing someone off. The fact that Miss USA chose Perez Hilton as a judge does indicate how much of a joke this pageant has become lately. That's like selecting Gilbert Godfried as a judge for a poetry slam.

Agreed! Perez Hilton is a poor representation for the gay community. They could have at least gotton Isaac Mizrahi or Lance Bass.

I didn't hear any boos. ..and who cares? They shouldn't ask her opinion and expect only one answer.

Exactly!

 

[houtx48]

could be our next Anita Bryant..................... exactly what i was thinking at the time. Star is right there are plenty of ways to get around the question, pull a politician talk for five minutes and say nothing.

 

[Flashy]

okay, i have now seen the exchange and read the transcript.

I fail to see exactly what this rather dumb, yet, at least truthful (she coud have lied) girl has done wrong other than voice views on a controversial topic that you know you are going to get killed on one way or another.

So she believes marriage "should be" between a man and a woman. Big deal. That is what she said she believes in...she did not say she believed that gay marriage shouldn't be legal.

to be quite honest, as she stated here: "Out of all the topics I studied up on, I dreaded that one, I prayed I would not be asked about gay marriage."

so she clearly knew that her view was going to get torched no matter what side she was on...and she was either going to come off as a godless pro-gay agenda heathen to the religious nuts on the far right, or an intolerant, anti-gay, reactionary to the nuts on the far left.

you cannot win on that topic, no matter how diplomatically she could have put it, and let's face it, most of these girls are not exactly intelligent enough to come up with a brilliantly diplomatic answer to any controversial political question.

What should be noted, is, from what i have read (listed below is the answer she apparently gave), she *NEVER* voiced her opinion as being pro-laws outlawing gay marriage...she simply stated what she thought her definition of "marriage" meant.

--


'Well, I think it’s great that Americans are able to choose one or the other. We live in a land where you can choose same-sex marriage or opposite marriage And you know what, in my country, in my family, I think that I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman.

'No offence to anybody out there, but that’s how I was raised and that’s how I think it should be - between a man and a woman. Thank you very much.'
--

She obviously stated that she feels it is "great that Americans are able to choose one or the other" (which technically they are not, and that is the root o the political issue and controversy at hand)

so what has she done wrong...she has her opinion of what it means, but i do not see her saying that she does not believe people should not be allowed to choose, even if those words are not actually correct.

while she is not going to be mistaken for a Jeffersonian Orator with the line "We live in a land where you can choose same-sex marriage or opposite marriage"


she clearly, even though she does not in fact have a clue what the national and state laws are regarding gay marriage, clearly believes we live in a land where we can choose.


--




besides...what do you expect when you ask this question of a pageant contestant
'Vermont recently became the fourth state to legalise same-sex marriage. Do you think every state should follow suit. Why or why not?'




--


twenty minutes before these girls were in bathing suits, and now they are supposed to be scholars in federalism and states rights?


the question itself is absurd...do you think every state should follow suit? it is not as simple as that. not every state *CAN* follow suit. There are legal processes to follow, votes, procedures, vetos etc.


they can't just follow suit...that is a stupid question, asked by one stupid person to another stupid person.


he could have phrased it as "do you think all states should be required to put a referendum forward, or a vote on legalizing gay marriage etc." but instead he asked her if other states, with different populations, and ratios of progressives in the population should "follow suit". The question itself is retarded.




If he had a brain he would have asked that, and if she had a brain, she could have said "I think it is up to each of those individual states to go through the legal procedures and votes and referendum process so the people can choose for their state what they feel is the best course of action on this important issue"

bingo. Dumb controversial public question answered, dumb controversial public opinion avoided.

-

she may be an airhead, but she stated her opinion, right or wrong and even with her opinion being that of man-woman marriage as her belief, she never once said she was against the right to choose "opposite marriage" (in her oh-so eloquent words) in our land.


give the kid a break...she's in a retarded beauty pageant where you are judged on negotiating a swimsuit and an evening gown, she is not appointing supreme court justices.

 

[BiItalianBro]

Oh, stop it with the conspiracy theory bullshit already.

And Wyld: To actually suggest that Perez Hilton is some kind of reflection of homosexuals just further proves just how out of touch you are with society. Honestly... a LOT more than just gay & lesbian people are showing support for gay marriage and equality these days. And Perez Hilton, a self-imposed celebrity who made a name for himself by creating a pink blog and drawing over paparazzi photography, is NOT making anyone look bad but himself. And you, because obviously you seem to think he represents all or at least the majority of gay men.

Miss USA...Miss America...they are on their last legs and they know it. It is a stop-loss ploy by mixing an old school 'beauty contest' with reality/trash TV. They knew EXACTLY what they were doing by putting PH on the panel and are getting the reaction they were praying for.

 

[Flashy]

frankly, i thought this take on the controversy was rather brilliant

Charles Karel Bouley: Dear Perez: Miss California Gave The Right Answer For The Moment

 

[Bbucko]

You know, we're on the same side of the marriage equality debate. I find anything short of full equality between a straight marriage and a gay partnership to be discriminatory. Part of me questions why we have chosen to perpetuate a tradition that was founded on securing rights to another human being like some piece of property, but that's another topic.

But I am a staunch advocate of open dialog, and I give people much more credit to recognize ignorance and prejudice when they hear it than you do. I think reactionary, discriminatory opinions are best dealt with in full sunlight: it's the best disinfectant, after all.

well thanks for the personal insult...ouch!

Your use of the word "reactionary" seems to imply that those faced with driscrimination based upom sexuality have reached an adequare level of equality and that those who actively look for further equality are actualy overacting...


Some news for you. We have not reached anywhere near a level of adeqaute level of equality.

Day to day we are faced with discrimination in so many ways - at work, at law, by government policy to name a few..and until rights are equal at law (and who gives a flying fuck about religion) then keeping the issue upfront is the way that MANY types of discrimination, social injustice, etc have sucessfully been tackled over the years...how can attitudes be changed, and values that pass on evolve, if issues are kept in the closet...like some on this website...

get of off your high horse...if feel like ur equal in society then good for you...some of us dont.....

First of all, I didn't insult you. When I want to insult someone, the result in a pronounced limp for several days <insert appropriate emoticon of immunity>.

As JBT pointed out, we seem to differ on what is acceptable dialog when attempting to promote social change. When you wrote...

It would be nice if these views did not lead to discrimination and vilification and worse. The fact is..they do.

good on perez for this question and even better for Miss USA pageant for their stand....

and as perez said...what a dumb biatch!

...you more than imply that expressing views leading to "discrimination and vilification and worse" should not be considered acceptable. I completely disagree. I believe that the repellent nature of such views means that they lose much more than they gain each time they're expressed. Again: sunlight is the best disinfectant.

Though I usually tone it down (somewhat) around here, in other places I'm considered a subversive, provocative radical. As an Anarchist, I take that as a compliment. But even at my worst, I would never attempt to silence my critics and opponents. In a free society, that is simply not how the game gets played.

 

[queerunity]

I think Perez Hilton is right when he says that Miss USA is supposed to unite and inspire, not divide. This wasn't the CPAC beauty convention, she is in the wrong.

 

[JustHangin']

Who are we to say what her opinion should be? If u agree or not with her, it is still AN OPINION, it is subjective to each individual person. She was not asked a fact and answered incorrectly... I feel sorry for those who cannot accept other people's opinions.... Which I guess is what all the Pro-Gay-Marriage people who are PISSED OFF want, to people to accept their opinions and way of life, right? How ironic...

In any case, who expects all beauty pageant contestants to answer controversial questions like they have a degree from Harvard Law?

What pisses me off the most is the stupidity of Perez Hilton. If you see his webpage he has been going ON and ON and calling names to Miss California, ONLY for being true to herself (which takes A LOT of balls)... Which I guess she has more than him cus he has completely lost his cool and is acting like a spoiled brat...

It is sooooo easy to "love" democracy when the thing/idea/person u want is picked, but when the adversary wins, u want a recount or call fraud....

In this era, Democracy gives people the right for their opinion... And I have a lot of respect for those who respect another human being's ideals even if they are not the same as yours....

 

[vince]

I think Perez Hilton is right when he says that Miss USA is supposed to unite and inspire, not divide. This wasn't the CPAC beauty convention, she is in the wrong.

Then why did he ask a divisive question? The girl was bound to be pilloried no matter what opinion she gave. She should told him it was not an appropriate question for the venue and that it is none of his business

 

[swordfishME]

Lets not blame Ms. California or Perez Hilton for this....I would not be surprised if this had been rehersed. This is just Miss USA trying to stay relevant.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Then why did he ask a divisive question? The girl was bound to be pilloried no matter what opinion she gave. She should told him it was not an appropriate question for the venue and that it is none of his business

Of course, if she would have said that then she would have appeared to be rude, also affecting her process in the contest. Yeah, it sucks that she doesn't believe in gay marriage. However, there's plenty of people who don't and some of them are on this very board. A better question, one that doesn't aim to divide people, should have been made.

And someone needs to tell Perez Hilton (and anyone else that glorifies him) that running a blog of bitchy banter and bad Photoshopped paparazzi art does not make you a star.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

I know who PH is. I know he does not speak for gays and lesbians. But HE decided to pick a fight on TV. He needs to be denounced publicly by GLAD.

Look at the online comments from the very first google link I found.

'God was testing my faith,' says Miss California after Perez Hilton calls her a 'dumb bitch' in gay marriage row | Mail Online



Damn I am always right, and incredibly prescient........................again. The burden I bear.

She is getting support from all over the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Gays lose. Pitiful.

And what did I, as a "gay", lose exactly? Please be specific.
Respect? Well, people like you never respected us anyhow so there's no loss. The religious right? Same thing. Most middle-aging straight men, especially ones with bigoted beliefs? Ditto. And last time I checked, it seems as if no new legislation was passed cutting the loss of anymore gay rights all due to some trifling queen on a beauty pageant. Life for me or for any gay man I know didn't come to a screeching halt. There were no picket signs in front of GMHC from the bible belt or anti-gay marriage groups telling us to "Suck It". Really... it's like nothing of any real importance happened at all.

Seriously Wyld... if I had to put something out there, we didn't lose a damn thing. However, you did gained a pretty spokesperson who has a heart as dark as yours. And the fact that she would rally behind hatred and prejudice makes her outer beauty that much more flawed. But go on ahead, act as if this some kind of victory for you and your kin. Considering how states are becoming more accepting to the gay & lesbian community as a whole and how the conservative voice is becoming more and more muted by the visuals of bitterness and negativity, you guys NEED a victory... regardless of how shallow and feeble it is.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

And what did I, as a "gay", lose exactly? Please be specific.
Respect? Well, people like you never respected us anyhow so there's no loss. The religious right? Same thing. Most middle-aging straight men, especially ones with bigoted beliefs? Ditto. And last time I checked, it seems as if no new legislation was passed cutting the loss of anymore gay rights all due to some trifling queen on a beauty pageant. Life for me or for any gay man I know didn't come to a screeching halt. There were no picket signs in front of GMHC from the bible belt or anti-gay marriage groups telling us to "Suck It". Really... it's like nothing of any real importance happened at all.

Seriously Wyld... if I had to put something out there, we didn't lose a damn thing. However, you did gained a pretty spokesperson who has a heart as dark as yours. And the fact that she would rally behind hatred and prejudice makes her outer beauty that much more flawed. But go on ahead, act as if this some kind of victory for you and your kin. Considering how states are becoming more accepting to the gay & lesbian community as a whole and how the conservative voice is becoming more and more muted by the visuals of bitterness and negativity, you guys NEED a victory... regardless of how shallow and feeble it is.

I am for gay marriage 1000%. I have only about 50 posts saying that same thing.


You are dumber than a stick. One stupid queer.

 

[B_VinylBoy]

I am for gay marriage 1000%. I have only about 50 posts saying that same thing.

You are dumber than a stick. One stupid queer.

And this is coming from a forum bigot who somehow thinks I was trying to make a statement about gay marriage with my rebuttal. LOL!!

You're the one thinking that gay men are "losing" something all because idiots with your exact mindset are rallying behind a wannabe beauty queen all because she's for preserving the sanctity of marriage. Doesn't matter if you're 1000% or even 10,000% behind gay marriage or not. With your continued failure of simple forum post comprehension, watching you judge someone on their intelligence is just like watching Perez Hilton judging a beauty contest. Completely irrelevant.