So, you married her under false pretenses. Didn't you think she had a right to know?
Would you have a problem with her seeing other men? Why/why not?
My Discrimination Against Gays
- Thread starter B_black10inches
- Start date
Would you have a problem with her seeing other men? Why/why not?
Some people here appear to be confusing feminine with camp, drag, gentle, caring or bitchy.
If someone could define feminine as relating to a Gay man I would be astounded.
Go on - I challenge someone to really define the word feminine and the word masculine. No examples - just a clear and concise all encompassing definition.
If someone could define feminine as relating to a Gay man I would be astounded.
Go on - I challenge someone to really define the word feminine and the word masculine. No examples - just a clear and concise all encompassing definition.
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2004
- Posts
- 5,842
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 2,611
- Points
- 333
- Location
- Memphis (Tennessee, United States)
- Gender
- Male
I am older than most of you, and I have spent most of my life trying to put a label on what I am. When I was young, I was sure that I was heterosexual, and the mutual masturbation with neighborhood guys was just a rite of passage.
Then I married. After marriage, I developed two very intense sexual and emotional relationships with men. After thousands of dollars of therapy, I finally decided that I was bi-sexual.
Now that I am older and have been through a lot, I don't really believe there is such a thing as gay or straight. We travel through areas of attraction during our life, and those areas vary. At any given moment in time our orientation may move on that continuum between gay and straight. Finally, we adapt to that area that is most comfortable for us. As for me, at present, I only have sex with men, but that might change again. So I guess that I am gay now. But I have, during my life, had sex with women. (Come to think of it, most of my sex has been with myself. Is that gay?) I think people that are highly sexed are attracted to other people who are highly sexed,,,,be they male or female. Then, the most comfortable and natural sex for them becomes standard for them. Those who easily say they are 100% heterosexual may not be as highly sexed as the rest of us.
By the way, I am one of those "masculine" gay men. The first affair I had with a man was with a man who told me that he hesitated to approach me because I seemed so straight. That affair lasted ten years. There are masculine guys out there who are dying to jump in bed with a man. They are just harder to locate.
[post=312065]Quoted post[/post]
[/b][/quote]You are on the high moral ground here. But the sharp reality is that many of us have jobs that would be eneded immediately if it were known that we are gay. Some wives would end the marriage immediately. I myself, don't have any gay relationships because I don't want to cheat on my wife and I don't want to end the marriage.
Telling her the truth would most likely have me packing and becoming divorced and a loss of job. So it is a secret that I share here and no where else that it is men that I am attracted to and the gays here that are attractive to me are not effiminate. Kinkguy, Lex. DMW, Nixxy, Jeep, Ashlar ...do these sound sissy to you? No where close do they do that. I have not been with a guy since before I was engaged to be married.
I doubt I am the only one in this situation. Only many others do have affairs outside of their marriage in secret. Don't know the solution for them. They most likely aren't going to change.
- jonb,
70% of people cheat at least once, Freddie. Those of us in the working class tend to get it out of our system when we're younger, while the bourgeoisie is kinda creepy with their cheating, picking partners who might have been born during their freshman year in college.
The best answer, of course, is to be open with her about your bisexuality.
The best answer, of course, is to be open with her about your bisexuality.
Lex
Expert Member
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2004
- Posts
- 8,253
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 118
- Points
- 268
- Location
- In Your Darkest Thoughts and Dreams
- Sexuality
- 99% Gay, 1% Straight
- Gender
- Male
- Lex,
My wife and I have had and will continue to have several discussion about our marriage. She is content with our realtionship as a "closed loop Mixed-Orientation Marriage." There are online support groups that she has joined and we both do research as this is not a path either of us was prepared to walk down. All we know s that we will walk it together. If she ever felt that I wasn't giving her something she needed, she knows she could approach me. She has said that if I ever got to the point where I stopped having sex with her, she woud get a boyfriend, although that would not be her first choice.
She is my family, not my possession. I know that nothing and no-one can topple what we have built together. Plus, you can't miss what you can't measure.
The only thing I "assumed", correctly, was that you knew you were bisexual when you married her. So yeah, you married her under false pretenses. I didn't say you didn't love her. Now I know that sounds judgmental, but I don't think marriage should be taken lightly. That's just me though.
Lex
Expert Member
- Joined
- Jun 11, 2004
- Posts
- 8,253
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 118
- Points
- 268
- Location
- In Your Darkest Thoughts and Dreams
- Sexuality
- 99% Gay, 1% Straight
- Gender
- Male
- Lex,
I didn't know I was bisexual. I didn't take my marriage lightly. I have been married for over 8 years now and plan to be married to her) until I die. There were NO false pretenses. I loved her, wanted to marry her and have her bear my children. If not for the accepting and loving nature of my wife, I dont know that I would have ever matured to the point where I could have taken a long hard look at myself and what I need in order to feel like a complete person. I suffered from depression my entire life and can only now see that at least SOME of that sadness was not understanding who I am. I hope that makes this a bit clearer for you.
I'm sorry that things aren't so black-white and that everyone doesn't just wake up from day one knowing who they are, etc. Etc. I can only speak to my own experiences. I would not trade a minute of it allor change a thing. I am proud of where I am as a man, husband and a father.
I'm sorry that things aren't so black-white and that everyone doesn't just wake up from day one knowing who they are, etc. Etc. I can only speak to my own experiences. I would not trade a minute of it allor change a thing. I am proud of where I am as a man, husband and a father.
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2004
- Posts
- 5,842
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 2,611
- Points
- 333
- Location
- Memphis (Tennessee, United States)
- Gender
- Male
I have never cheated on my wife. Nor have I come close to it. She on the other hand had an emotional affiar with a former boyfriend that almost ended the marriage some years ago.
If I had any intention on acting on it, yes I should tell her. But why tell her that. When we married we agreed that our past history was not the business of each other. Neither was it the business of each other what fantasies go through our heads. My suspeision is that she realizes more than she lets on. But in the south, some things are unspoken. To speak of them makes it worse, not better.
Are you suggesting that all hetrerosexual people tell their spouses every time they see another person of the opposite sex attractive? No that won't work.
I'm not sure where you are putting me, I would love to have the finances of the bourgeoisie. The only part I have of that is education. I am on social security disabiity. My wife doesn't make very much money. So no we are not part of any rich crowd. Oh the rich enjoy hearing me play the piano. Got to go to one of their parties at Christmas this year and go paid for it. I was hired help. I play the Christmas religious and secular well without a book. Been hired help several times at their parties. Don't get invited though unless they need a pianist.
So Jonb, don't worry. I might let you know you are handsome if I saw you. But I have no plans to hit on you are anyone else my son's age when they are in their twenties. After age 30, that is a little different. But college kids are still kids to me.
And inappropraite.
Though it is all right for Jana to hit on the college boys on this site. I am sure it is not all right for me to do so. Jana has a daughter the age of these college age kids.
I love Jana. I certainly am not attacking her at all. I think she is a great wonderful person.
Sorry this is the third thread one directly attacking me and one making what I consider a major put down.
And I'm not sure, but you seem to be putting me with the bourgeoisie. Not sure. So I will not say anymore. But I am a bit pissed at comments directed at me today. Had I read yours first...... but I didn't. Still I am giving you the high road on this one because you come across as very sincere at the beginning. I am just confused about why you made the statement about the bourgeosie unless you were comparing me to them. Though your comment about "being born their freshman year in college" appear to be directed at me.
And reading the comments to Lex doesn't help at all though you didn't make any to Lex. But I am sure that the comments made to Lex are meant for me as well.
- jonb,
Freddie: I wasn't saying you were making any advances on me. Just noticing a class difference in terms of cheating. People who come from money generally don't follow the same rules you or I do.
Lex: You're right. It's not so black-and-white. Some people are never turned on by either sex. Some people are turned on by both sexes but for whatever reasons deny their attraction to one (usually the same) sex. For the rest, there's always gender monogamy. And might I add for the fiftieth time that if it weren't for 19th-century psychology which was just a secular version of the Christian obsession with sex which in turn stemmed from the need for a large proletariat, this binary wouldn't even exist.
Lex: You're right. It's not so black-and-white. Some people are never turned on by either sex. Some people are turned on by both sexes but for whatever reasons deny their attraction to one (usually the same) sex. For the rest, there's always gender monogamy. And might I add for the fiftieth time that if it weren't for 19th-century psychology which was just a secular version of the Christian obsession with sex which in turn stemmed from the need for a large proletariat, this binary wouldn't even exist.
I'm feeling really bad right now. I know when I brought up this topic & how I talk about it would be bad for some folks. But I wanted to say the truth about my prejudices because I've sure enough had lots of prejudice directed at me in my life. DC_Deep's saying some right things. The more I read what you all say, the more I'm realizing that I'm living in a place where I'm doing myself more harm than good. And I think hurting other people too. I don't want that.
After this last semester at college I moved back to my family home in the neighborhood for the summer to save some money. But being here all the time is terrible for me. All I get is a negative mentality from all my friends & even my family. Even the bruthas I'm having some sex with are telling me a lotta shyt that I don't want to hear any more. My friends tell me gay people are bad & so does my family & the church too. I don't know if I'm gay,but I don't want to hear that I'm no good,because I know I am.
I don't know what happening to me but I don't want to be a liar or a lost guy any more. I've decided to move downtown to live with some friends from college. I can't take what happening to me. Then I read that thread about dads caring about their kids. All I could think of was my own daddy & how I wish I could talk to him right now. I know he'd be able to help me with all this shyt.
So I'm sorry if my post hurt people's feelings or I said all the wrong things. I'm doing the best that I can & it aint easy.
[post=312214]Quoted post[/post]
B10i,
I was moved by this post because of your honesty and vulnerability. So, I thought that I would respond.
First, I think that you are making the right moves. So, don't worry too much.
Realizing that you have an internal conflict is a good first step. You are a young man. There will be many issues that you will sort out as your self awareness develops. Being able to identify the conflicts in your soul is an essential skill.
Be honest with yourself. The next step, being honest about yourself with others, will eventually come naturally.
I don't think that anyone can offer you a template for successful self-discovery. However, I think that living at home can make it very difficult to efficiently and effectively integrate your feelings. Folks at home will push all of your buttons, for better or worse. You will probably find that sorting out your guilt will be MUCH more difficult in that environment. I would recommend living on your own in a place where you don't have a history.
Of course, you may have no other practical options. If this is the case, I would recommend that you avoid contact, to the degree that it is feasible, with folks who cause you to feel guilty or who cause you to be less honest about yourself than you would like to be.
Set attainable goals that move you in a positive direction. For example, get therapy if it is an available option, be honest with one person on a face-to-face basis, allow yourself to be vulnerable with someone that you can touch. I applaud your honesty on line, but "live" honesty is a useful step. If you have done that, great; do it more. Surround yourself with people who have similar feelings and manage to be "real". They provide a healthier example than some of the folks around you.
Also, resist the temptation to label yourself. It is not useful. Dee was precisely correct about the value of labels. But by his own reckoning he has also been the victim of labels. I can assure you that there will be folks who are driven to tell you that you are gay and don't know it, that you are straight and are going through a phase, that you are going to be fucked up if you are bi, etc, etc. These well meaning folks can push you AWAY from self discovery because they push too hard. Thay can be irritating at the very least and totally counter-productive at worst. I have known several people who were harmed by this kind of aggressive preaching when they were in their 20's. In fact I was one of them. Ironically, I eventually became guilty of pushing too hard myself; sort of like ex-smokers who preach about the harmful effects of smoking. thankfully, I matured beyong that.
Finally, you don't need to know exactly where you will "end up" when you take your first step. Just take your first step with integrity....and keep walking.
Sorry for the long fucking post............
peace,w
[/quote]
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2004
- Posts
- 5,842
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 2,611
- Points
- 333
- Location
- Memphis (Tennessee, United States)
- Gender
- Male
They don't follow the smae rules we folow on anything and for a reason. They don't have the same consequences. Complete and total financial security gives freedoms that most of us don't have.
And in high society, some things aren't spoken. And woemn stil are addressed as Mrs. John Q. Doe not Ms. Sally Doe. So, these wives who have no professoinal career and the extention of their husband and so they have all their high society parites and look the other way while "John" is haveng his way with another woman, man, and/or the dog and as long as it is "not mentioned" and "not recognized in the community" then ALL is well.
And not that you might not be a good one to make advances to if I had a chance. You are a bit young for me. And I am in that group that can't "afford" to make social blunders like that and survive. I'm over in the poor group where a divorce would put me literally in a shack somewhere with a window air conditioner that won't cool and a small stove that won't keep the cold out. A path not a bath. (You have to be a certain age to understand that one. (Outhouse) And an indoor hand pump. Yes, I remember a few of those from childhood. You young guys from the city will never figure that one out. But it is a well with a hand pump. No just turning on the faucet and just one temperature - cold. The classy country folk had one inside. The unforutnate ones had to go outside for water and tie the pail to a rope and drop it down the well and then retrieve it. No, I don't want to return to the good ole days that my grandparents went through.
For me things just keep getting worse & worse. I'm just hoping it'll be cool sometime soon.
I think you should stop making presumptions about anyone based upon behavior just as you would not want to be judged as being 100% gay if someone should happen to view one of your homosexual acts. Probably we are all on some sliding scale between homosexual and heterosexual in our inner feelings and wherever we usually sit on that scale could slide a bit or a lot one way or the other if the right, very unusual and provocative circumstances present themselves and then probably slide back again. Lots of big dicked guys who view themselves as 100% heterosexual let other men suck them because a big one is a very desirable commodity for dick fans. You seem to be very adaptable in your sexual preferences, let others do the same and direct your efforts to being more adaptable in your views of your fellow man.
Care to elaborate at all? What exactly keeps getting worse and worse?
[post=316455]Quoted post[/post]
[/b][/quote]I've moved out of my family home, left my friends, & my girlfriend doesn't know what's up with me. I'm living with some college friends downtown & I'm close to being broke. I don't know waht to do next.
I've moved out of my family home, left my friends, & my girlfriend doesn't know what's up with me. I'm living with some college friends downtown & I'm close to being broke. I don't know waht to do next.
[post=316538]Quoted post[/post]
[/b][/quote]Is there any chance for you to get a job to help make ends meet?
Going out on your own will likely prove to be a good thing if you can make ot work. peace,w
Black10, the first thing is to get some work. Focus on that, first and foremost. Once you have some income, then you have some really tough decisions ahead. But you need to have that stability of being able to support yourself, without depending upon friends and family.
Once you have that established, then you need to sort out your priorities, what is most important to you in your life. Hopefully, your health & happiness will top the list. Figure out how important your friends and your family are to you - of course, that is easier said than done. How much do you love them, and how much do they love and respect and care about you? If the friends will turn away from you after finding out some of your deeper secrets, then they are not really friends, find new ones. If you think they will stick by you and support you no matter what, hang on to them, and get everything out in the open. Then tackle the family problem. Coming out to my family was one of the hardest things I ever did, but now, it was one of the best things. There were some in my family I was sure would reject me, but they didn't. By the time I made the decision to come out completely, I was prepared for the worst, and (much as I hated the idea) I was prepared to tell them "I'm still the same person you have loved all these years. If you can't accept who I truly am, then I no longer acknowledge you as family." Scary? Yes. Difficult? More than anything else I had ever done. Necessary? Absolutely. But I was lucky, my family still saw the person, not the orientation. Most embraced me, a few didn't like it but accepted it.
With your girlfriend, that is something you will just have to work out. Do you love her enough to have a heart-to-heart talk? Does she love you enough to listen and work things out with you? The bottom line is that among all these people, the ones who reject you are not worth keeping around you. You need to have friends who are truly FRIENDS.
The last thing I want to mention to you is this: under all circumstances, protect yourself, disease-wise. Whether with a male or female, whether the sex is oral or anal or vaginal, whether you are giving or receiving, be careful and use protection. I know that most of the literature out there says that oral sex is low-risk for HIV transmission, but I'm not sure I believe that. It just takes one tiny abrasion in the mouth or on the cock to transmit the virus - and a little beard stubble against the cock can do it, even brushing the teeth can cause scratches on your gums that you don't even notice. And there are lots of other diseases that are much more easily transmitted. Never trust anyone's word that he or she is clean, just protect yourself. I know that wearing a condom when you get a blowjob is not popular or desirable, but it is necessary if you want to stay healthy. And remember, anyone who tries to convince you not to wear a condom has probably had sex with many others, also without a condom. You can't tell by looking, most of the time.
I hope some of this has been helpful. I really do want the best for you, but only you can decide what that is.
Once you have that established, then you need to sort out your priorities, what is most important to you in your life. Hopefully, your health & happiness will top the list. Figure out how important your friends and your family are to you - of course, that is easier said than done. How much do you love them, and how much do they love and respect and care about you? If the friends will turn away from you after finding out some of your deeper secrets, then they are not really friends, find new ones. If you think they will stick by you and support you no matter what, hang on to them, and get everything out in the open. Then tackle the family problem. Coming out to my family was one of the hardest things I ever did, but now, it was one of the best things. There were some in my family I was sure would reject me, but they didn't. By the time I made the decision to come out completely, I was prepared for the worst, and (much as I hated the idea) I was prepared to tell them "I'm still the same person you have loved all these years. If you can't accept who I truly am, then I no longer acknowledge you as family." Scary? Yes. Difficult? More than anything else I had ever done. Necessary? Absolutely. But I was lucky, my family still saw the person, not the orientation. Most embraced me, a few didn't like it but accepted it.
With your girlfriend, that is something you will just have to work out. Do you love her enough to have a heart-to-heart talk? Does she love you enough to listen and work things out with you? The bottom line is that among all these people, the ones who reject you are not worth keeping around you. You need to have friends who are truly FRIENDS.
The last thing I want to mention to you is this: under all circumstances, protect yourself, disease-wise. Whether with a male or female, whether the sex is oral or anal or vaginal, whether you are giving or receiving, be careful and use protection. I know that most of the literature out there says that oral sex is low-risk for HIV transmission, but I'm not sure I believe that. It just takes one tiny abrasion in the mouth or on the cock to transmit the virus - and a little beard stubble against the cock can do it, even brushing the teeth can cause scratches on your gums that you don't even notice. And there are lots of other diseases that are much more easily transmitted. Never trust anyone's word that he or she is clean, just protect yourself. I know that wearing a condom when you get a blowjob is not popular or desirable, but it is necessary if you want to stay healthy. And remember, anyone who tries to convince you not to wear a condom has probably had sex with many others, also without a condom. You can't tell by looking, most of the time.
I hope some of this has been helpful. I really do want the best for you, but only you can decide what that is.
surferboy
Expert Member
- Joined
- Jan 12, 2005
- Posts
- 2,976
- Media
- 17
- Likes
- 108
- Points
- 193
- Location
- Sunrise, Florida
- Sexuality
- 90% Straight, 10% Gay
- Gender
- Male
They might be bi. But you, and yer friends, need to like, accept who you are. If you enjoy being blown by dudes, and they enjoy blowing you, then none of you are straight. It's one thing to be straight and experiment, but it sounds to me like it's beyond expermentation with you and yer friends.
Way to go with the stereotyping. A lot of gays don't act "weird." And I don't know of an fems trying to act masculine, because it's not something you can hide. Also, who are you to tell someone they're "acting" like they're something else? Maybe that's them. Just because you a lisp doesn't make you fem. People wanna have sex with who they wanna have sex with. Just leave them be. It doesn't concern you, yah? People are attracted to who they're attracted to. A gay realtionship doesn't have to be one fem and one masculine.
And just what are the "characteristics" of being gay? Being totally fem? Being into fashion? That was a very ignorant thing to say. Just like straight people, there are no set-in-stone characteristics other than the sex yer attracted to. The only characteristic gays have is that we like men.
Similar threads
