My Greatest Flaw, and How I'll Break Up With It

AlteredEgo

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Regrettably some of my fiercest, most compassionless criticisms have been toward close family members — and it's usually nailing those traits of weakness or stupidity I admonish myself for. It's like they are outing me by association, exposing my weaknesses to the world. ...

This is a regret of mine as well. It's why I want to stop being this way. Family is very important to me (friends are family too.) and I don't want to alienate the people I love.

WHy as human beings are we like that?

I think it's just as rawb says. We expect to be forgiven by the people who love us. Clearly, they've already accepted us. So, we expect them to accept our bullshit too. They will accept it. We can get away with it. We shouldn't get away with it, we shouldn't do it, and we should all try to cut it out.

I think there is a difference between intelligence and deliberate ignorance. Perhaps that is what bothers you, Altered and Mme? I could see that being irritating considering something can be done to alter it.
Yes there is! Certainly willful ignorance is by far more agravating than woeful stupidity, but both drive me batshit nuts, for sure.

I agree with your position on stupid questions. My father is a master at crafting these.

My grandmother asks the same questions nine milion times. She's not confused or stupid. She asks the questions because she knows I'm impatient, and that repitition irks me. She also does it to try to get me to give a new answer sometimes. That's one form of stupid questions.
 

AlteredEgo

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At the risk of sounding presumptuous, I'll recommend a book. Illusions, The Adventures of a Reluctant Messiah by Richard Bach. It's an extremely short fiction and easy to find cheap in used bookstores.

Actually, I HAVE this book! I also have a Khalil Gibran boxed set. Sadly, both are packed up in my boxes of books which never got unpacked because I never really got settled when I left my old bedroom and moved into a different room. The bookshelves finally went up before Christmas, and before my birthday, I swear I'll unpack my books.

edit- I can't shut up tonight. Embarrassment IS a form of fear. There are only two pure states of being, love and fear. We go through gradient percentages between the two, and those are the full range of emotions. Love and fear are opposites, not love and hate, which are not. Hate is a form of love, only corrupted.

Embarrassment being a manifestation of fear makes sense. I fully agree with you about hate. Hate is frustrated love. I've only ever hated one person. I knew for sure when I hated him that what I'd been told about hate was true. Have you been sitting at a ouija board channeling my mother? (That's who gave me the books, by the way.)
 

Lex

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Expecting people with insight who are willing to share to be quiet means that one would rather wallow in ignorance. Fuck that noise.

I speak with conviction and stand behind what I say.

I know I can come off as a know it all.

My opinions and worldview bother you?

Tough shit.

Find something YOU believe in and then grow the backbone to live the life you say you believe in.

Grow a set or get out of the way.

Wallow in cowardly ignorance in someone else's lifetime.

And stop being a hypocrite.

My story can help people and I like to help people.

What about you?
 

AlteredEgo

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AlteredEgo -- I am SO muthafucking with you, babe.

What kills me is how when you say something sharp, how much easier it is for people to dismiss you as stressed or arrogant or whatever than to actually consider that what you are saying has merit, even as it disproves their stance and behavior.

Whatever.


Lex, who does not suffer fools lightly, either.

I find that the same people who dismiss what I'm saying rather than just rejecting the delivery are the ame ones who claim I only think people are stupid when I disagree with them. I wish they could be in on conversations I have with my friends where all sides are up in arms because we are on opposite sides of an issue. I don't agree with you or Mme. Z about Spoogecicle, but you're still both brilliant. I think my boyfriend needs to stop sucking the president's cock, but he's brilliant too. I think I do listen to what people are saying and try to find the logic. If I can find it, I think we just disagree. If I can't, and I conclude that the logic is completely fucked, or no logic was ever applied, than obviously, something stupid is happening. And, wherever something stupid is happening, someone stupid is in the middle.

The problem stems from labeling eveyone that one happens to disagree with a fool or fucktard or worse.

Open minded consideration of issues is more productive and thought provoking than is personal attack, which is offensive, hurtful, and tiresome.

POint taken. Still, perhaps you should look deeper when someone tells you you're a jackass. I know I do. Obviously there is some reason for them to arrive at that conclusion. Just have a quick peek in the proverbial mirror to check if you've been a jackass, or if there is some validity to the perception. It's not always the other person. Sometimes it's you. Then, if you aren't a jackass, you celebrate your dopeness. If you are, however, you have to decide whether or not you think it's okay to be a jackass.

Perhaps the problem is that you believe everyone who disagrees with you is closed minded. I used to make that mistake, and a while back I damaged an amazing relationship with this misperception. You need to drop that like a hot potato if that is how you see things.
 

DaveyR

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Interesting thread this one.

I have to admit to being pretty intolerant when it comes to family. It's something that I am very aware of and try hard to fix. I am worst I think with my Mother who I can honestly say would win a the world championship in nagging. My parents came over to Tenerife from the UK to stay with us at Christmas and I decided to try a different approach.

I told myself that the only person that can make me angry is me whatever the situation. It is me who decides how to react to a situation at the end of the day. What a difference during this visit. We never had a cross word or raised voice. I have always blamed my Mother for the arguements we have had in the past. Maybe I was wrong about that theory.
 

AlteredEgo

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Expecting people with insight who are willing to share to be quiet means that one would rather wallow in ignorance. Fuck that noise.

I speak with conviction and stand behind what I say.

I know I can come off as a know it all.

My opinions and worldview bother you?

Tough shit.

Find something YOU believe in and then grow the backbone to live the life you say you believe in.

Grow a set or get out of the way.

Wallow in cowardly ignorance in someone else's lifetime.

And stop being a hypocrite.

My story can help people and I like to help people.

What about you?

SOmething prompted this. What happened?
 

D_Bob_Crotchitch

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What goes around, comes around. Choose your words carefully for you may have to eat them. A person who sows kindness, patience, and understanding is a giant in the midst of mere mortals. It will come back to you many fold. Sow love and reap it back many fold.
Now, where is marshmallow man? I have some sowing to do with that one. :rolleyes:
 

Lex

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I find that the same people who dismiss what I'm saying rather than just rejecting the delivery are the ame ones who claim I only think people are stupid when I disagree with them. I wish they could be in on conversations I have with my friends where all sides are up in arms because we are on opposite sides of an issue. I don't agree with you or Mme. Z about Spoogecicle, but you're still both brilliant. I think my boyfriend needs to stop sucking the president's cock, but he's brilliant too. ...
As MZ says: "If we are both always in agreement, one of us is ultimately unecessary."

SOmething prompted this. What happened?

I dislike when it is suggested that the intelligent should be humble to appease the insecurities of the less-evolved.

I am good, babe.
 

Lex

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Interesting thread this one.

I have to admit to being pretty intolerant when it comes to family. It's something that I am very aware of and try hard to fix. ...

In my world, family does not get more chances to abuse or fuck me over than does any other person. Just because you are my cousin, don't expect to be able to steal from me, use me, abuse me, or take me for granted.

Family should not be given special consideration in this regard, IMO. Why would the people closest to you treat you the worst of all? Why would you allow them to?
 

AlteredEgo

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when/where/how does humility enter into this discussion? i don't think it's necessarily a case of one being arrogant as much as maybe one lacking the ability to admit you just may NOT know everything and allowing that to temper your revulsion at those fellow humans who share your sin.

even the nugget of wisdom you are so certain of being lord and master over and so incredibly generous as to share with the lower forms of life you are doomed to be surrounded by may not be entirely correct. we have our theories, we have our musings we KNOW in our hearts, we have some facts and figures and names and dates we can pull out of book we read, but in the end, even Newtonian physics isn't entirely correct. maybe this acknowlegement can temper your outright distain for the asshat you've allowed to ruin your day.

btw AlteredEgo, absolutely masterfully written OP... thanks for it.

also (i can't shut up), why does it feel like every word i type is misspelled???

I have to disagree (after careful consideration, I assure you). I am not under the impression that I know everything. Were I to be so stupid, I wouldn't be asking any questions, and certainly I wouldn't be able to admit to any flaws. No, I never have thought I knew everything. Back in high school, I mistakenly believed I knew a lot. Before I hit my 20's I was sure I didn't know very much at all. I'm bright. I may even be a genius. I know where to find information. But I really don't know anything. That much I know for sure. I think Mme. Z was right on point with fear. Your words obviously come from the heart, and from a desire to help someone who has asked for help. I thank you for heeding the call. And, I thank you for the compliment.
 

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In my world, family does not get more chances to abuse or fuck me over than does any other person. Just because you are my cousin, don't expect to be able to steal from me, use me, abuse me, or take me for granted.

Family should not be given special consideration in this regard, IMO. Why would the people closest to you treat you the worst of all? Why would you allow them to?

I totally agree with you on that one Lex but my situation was the opposite. I was being much more intolerant with family than I would be with anyone else.
 

D_N Flay Table

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I have many many flaws..
the ones I dislike like the most, tend to be physical,
but also, I tend to be jealous, errr.. scratch that .. I am more prone to envy.
I am very hard on myself a lot of the time, typically over things I cannot control, or things that have happened in the past that I wish I could change.

I just try to improve my self a little bit everyday..

but I am not sure that anyone can ever reach 'perfection' because it is such a relative term.
 

AlteredEgo

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What goes around, comes around. Choose your words carefully for you may have to eat them. A person who sows kindness, patience, and understanding is a giant in the midst of mere mortals. It will come back to you many fold. Sow love and reap it back many fold.
Now, where is marshmallow man? I have some sowing to do with that one. :rolleyes:


I agree. This is why I want to make some changes.
 

madame_zora

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Expecting people with insight who are willing to share to be quiet means that one would rather wallow in ignorance. Fuck that noise.

I speak with conviction and stand behind what I say.

I know I can come off as a know it all.

My opinions and worldview bother you?

Tough shit.

Find something YOU believe in and then grow the backbone to live the life you say you believe in.

Grow a set or get out of the way.

Wallow in cowardly ignorance in someone else's lifetime.

And stop being a hypocrite.

My story can help people and I like to help people.

What about you?

The cool thing is, EVERYONE'S stories can help people, if they tell the right ones. When we tell our stories of "I had this issue, this is how I dealt with it, and this is what happened as a result" it helps other people struggling with that issue to get an insight into what someone else has done about it, it helps to feel less alone.

Most people don't want to be the first in line to expose themselves. Thanks for being that unlucky bastard for so many of us.

There will always be an abundant supply of those who expose nothing, but feel free to cap down the ones who have been brave enough to share because they "haven't lived up to their expectations". Fuck that. Nobody owes others compliance. If you need compliance, that your problem.

Being bluntly honest is not a personality flaw. I wouldn't give up that part of my personality for anything, any one, or any principle. For me, it is my highest principle. I seek to NOT use the truth as a battering ram, believe it or not, but it would feel false to me to dance around something if it was my honest opinion.

BUT, everyone responds to things differently. Not everyone will like me, or Lex, or any other poster all the time. For everyone out there who's a "really nice guy", there's someone else who thinks he is an ineffectual twat-waffle. I speak the way I like to be spoken TO, as I suspect many of us do. I like direct language, it's the only thing that will get through the layers of innattention.
 

madame_zora

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I find that the same people who dismiss what I'm saying rather than just rejecting the delivery are the ame ones who claim I only think people are stupid when I disagree with them. I wish they could be in on conversations I have with my friends where all sides are up in arms because we are on opposite sides of an issue.

I just had to respond to this because Lex and I have been talking about this too. MANY of the people I am friends with hold very differnt views from myself, and that doesn't diminish my respect for them at all. I respect seekers of all kinds, regardless of their conclusions. I do NOT respect people who are lazy with their minds.

Does it bother me when someone rejects a whole post I've put time, effort and thought into because it sounds too harsh? Yes! It doesn't bother me enough to change to whole of who I am to accomodate them though. If they aren't willing to read my words and realise that they are just my words, then we aren't likely to make it to a place where I would value their friendship anyway. I don't need wimpy friends, I have no use for them. Sorry, that's just how it is.

I don't agree with you or Mme. Z about Spoogecicle, but you're still both brilliant.

I also wanted to address this. There's no compelling reason why you would agree with us on Danny, you really didn't know him. Had I joined the board only a few months before that kind of stunt, I'd probably have felt similarly, I can't say. I wrote about this in another post about assigning value. He hadn't "earned" a place of value in your life, so there's be no reason to put much into working it out with him. I don't expect others to feel as I do, all of our reasons for doing things are based on our own lives.

I think my boyfriend needs to stop sucking the president's cock, but he's brilliant too. I think I do listen to what people are saying and try to find the logic. If I can find it, I think we just disagree.

And if we just disagree, then neither of us has to be wrong! But, even if one of us IS wrong, and even if it's me, so what? The sky isn't going to fall in, and I just might learn something. I think about Danny again here- I was wrong, and boy did I learn a lot. I had to apologise a LOT, take shit from people a lot, and still love someone who was a friend in need. It would take a lot of pages to describe the lessons I've learned from this person, but even in the bad times, he is a teacher.

If I can't, and I conclude that the logic is completely fucked, or no logic was ever applied, than obviously, something stupid is happening. And, wherever something stupid is happening, someone stupid is in the middle.

I applaud you for being able to have a boyfriend with whom you hold such dramatically different views, personally I don't think I could do that. He'd have to be one HELL of a lay! I wish I could plaster that last one amid the bumper stickers on my car.
 

dostoy

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There are probably three reasons you are least patient with your family. One, you can't believe you are 'living with the enemy' when it comes to core disagreements in value. Two, you are afraid that their existence will reflect poorly on you and others will perceive their 'flaws' as your 'flaws' (misbegotten idea that ontogeny recapitulates phylogeny). And three you're just an asshole.

I'm an asshole.

I always used to amaze myself how much more I accepted my friends than my family when they were no more or less perfect than each other.
 

B_Hickboy

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That twinge in your intestines
Expecting people with insight who are willing to share to be quiet means that one would rather wallow in ignorance. Fuck that noise.

I speak with conviction and stand behind what I say.

I know I can come off as a know it all.

My opinions and worldview bother you?

Tough shit.

Find something YOU believe in and then grow the backbone to live the life you say you believe in.

Grow a set or get out of the way.

Wallow in cowardly ignorance in someone else's lifetime.

And stop being a hypocrite.

My story can help people and I like to help people.

What about you?


What are you seething about?
 

madame_zora

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What are you seething about?


I know this one, we've been talking about it. He's seething about the fact that when we phrase something very directly, people disregard the content of our words and only address the tone. Kind of like this.

Everything you need to know about what's pissing him off is right there in print!
 

B_Hickboy

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That twinge in your intestines
I know this one, we've been talking about it. He's seething about the fact that when we phrase something very directly, people disregard the content of our words and only address the tone. Kind of like this.

Everything you need to know about what's pissing him off is right there in print!


You don't sound direct, you just sound worked up and aggressive. I generally tune out such communications.

You may not want to believe that the way you say something matters, but it does. The term and tone of your posts are part of the content.