Narth

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by B_Stronzo, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2005
    Messages:
    4,730
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Plimoth Plantation
    aka "Weird Sceince" :scared2:

    National Association for Research and Therapy of Homosexuality

    I read through it (it was downright painful) and I've decided a "sister" site needs to be created called:

    National Association for the Research and Therapy of Moronity :rolleyes:


    The lengths to which some will go to in overt arrogance to make such obnoxious and condescending assumptions.....
     
  2. Lordpendragon

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2004
    Messages:
    3,880
    Likes Received:
    1
    BENEFITS OF MEMBERSHIP

    Membership is open to all individuals
    interested in furthering the work of NARTH.
    1. All members receive our NARTH Bulletin, a 3 times-yearly publication which will keep you abreast of developments on the issue of homosexuality. including legal and ethical issues, the latest scientific research. book reviews, challenges from the psychotherapeutic professional organizations, and in-depth interviews with psychotherapists.
    2. Qualified licensed psychotherapists may join our nationwide referral list.

    3. Listserve Access. Professional-level members who have joined in the Full Member category are keeping in touch on the Internet. Join their "Listserve" and communicate directly by e-mail.

    NARTH is the only such organization uniting professionals of many disciplines and religious backgrounds. Categories of Membership

    Seems too good to miss. I have a student id card now and it's only ten bucks.
     
  3. DC_DEEP

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    9,029
    Likes Received:
    12
    I started to reply, closed that window, thought about it again, and felt I had to say something, but (CALL GUINNESS!!!) I'm just speechless. Honestly, I didn't click the link - I didn't have to. I know these types from years of exposure.

    All I can say is, just simply, "sigh."
     
  4. Lordpendragon

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2004
    Messages:
    3,880
    Likes Received:
    1
    "Only in America" my friends - well maybe Iran and other places like that - at least they don't hang you - yet.
     
  5. joyboytoy79

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2006
    Messages:
    8,557
    Albums:
    4
    Likes Received:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    DC-ish
    I tried to read some of their “informative literature” (read: propaganda) but I couldn’t bear it. The “cure” for homosexuality is quite simple: stop considering it a disease. These people boil my liver.
     
  6. Lex

    Lex
    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    Messages:
    9,536
    Likes Received:
    16
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    In Your Darkest Thoughts and Dreams
  7. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2005
    Messages:
    4,730
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Plimoth Plantation
    They coincide almost perfectly Lex. They just can't have it.

    I'd never heard of NARTH before yesterday when I decided (in a moment of the "not good kind of" self-abuse) to go into Yahoo's Christian Chat.

    Okay okay I'm a trouble maker.

    But the first line I entered in that chat was: "Thank God more and more Christians realize their error in marginalizing all decent gay and lesbian people by condemning them".

    There was a lull for about three minutes then came the "I don't condemn them but God does" sort of response. It finally escalated to the posting of URLS. The most offensive was the NARTH one presupposing that they have the right to foundational assumption that it "needs curing". :rolleyes:

    I realize the futility of my presence in such a chatroom but it's always good to know what the enemy's chatting about. I had every Bible verse they could scrounge up hurled at my gay ass ... and many misquoted and changed wording of those applicable quotes to further their cases.

    "Did you know they sit at our schools to indocrtinate our children?" said one Kansas mother of three. She's the one who copied and pasted the Narth URL to support her contention.
     
  8. Lex

    Lex
    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2004
    Messages:
    9,536
    Likes Received:
    16
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    In Your Darkest Thoughts and Dreams
    I thought so. Sad, really.

    Ask them to prove to you that God condems us. Tell them to find the exact scriptures. Ask them why a God of love would condem. Ask them why they call God a HE when WOMEN create life. Ask them (even if he does condem us) why they need to fight God's battles when God promises to fight OUR battles?

    Then, send them Advil in the mail.
     
  9. DC_DEEP

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    9,029
    Likes Received:
    12
    No, not futile. Frustrating at times, but not futile.
    I'm glad I'm not the only one who realizes this. It's why I periodically read the Westboro Baptist Church website, even though it truly turns my stomach.
    I usually hurl twice as many scriptures back at them, and ask them to reconcile their views with scripture... they usually cannot, and they usually get flustered and angry.
    "Did you know that christians sit at our schools and not only indoctrinate, but lie to our children, and threaten and coerce them to christian beliefs?" would be my response.
     
  10. Ethyl

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2006
    Messages:
    5,476
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    495
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    Philadelphia (PA, US)
    Duuuuuude. You've got better things to do than irk Christian housewives online with your very presence. :tongue:

    I've wondered if the elimination of homosexuality from the DSM-IV as a mental illness has fueled the more common "immoral" stance of today. Think about it: Homosexuality is much easier to dismiss if labeled a mental illness. The social stigmas of mental illness still prevail in the twenty-first century despite the strides made in research and treatment. But take away that social stigma of faulty wiring and suddenly homophobes are in need of another way to inflict fear and fill the gap for the stigma. Enter immorality. Now instead of homosexuals not having a choice (because they're not "right in the head") they have a choice and aren't choosing properly, according to their hetero detractors.

    Convenient, eh?:rolleyes:
     
  11. D_alex8

    D_alex8 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    8,602
    Likes Received:
    11
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Germany
    The things you do for fun while LPSG is down. :rolleyes:

    I had encountered NARTH a few times in the footnotes of grim pseudo-scientific articles that sought to counter homosexuality in the past, and digging around at that time, it was interesting to discover that said articles based themselves either entirely on NARTH sources, or on sources written by NARTH members for other (almost exclusively online) "journals" [their terminology for their propagandistic bullshit, not mine].

    Anyway, from where I'm sitting, Lordpendragon's "only in America" phrase couldn't ring truer... since NARTH's pronouncements are considered 'hate speech' under German laws pertaining to gender and sexual equality, and quoting from them in a positive way in any (academic, in particular) publication could lead to serious repercussions for both author and publisher.

    And all it took for Germany to become so enlightened was the liquidation of tens of thousands of gays, transvestites, and others in the concentration camps, followed by a further quarter-century of struggle to get the identical anti-gay laws that were used during the Third Reich softened, prior to their total repeal in 1994. Easy, huh? :rolleyes:
     
  12. DiegoID

    DiegoID New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2006
    Messages:
    94
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    NARTH and the Ex-Gay movement (IE Exodus) are the biggest threat to the Homosexual Christian today. I've been reading the Narth blogs and the opposing Ex-Gay Watch blog for about three weeks now. I feel really sorry for the gay Christian who has to endure the Ex-Gay pressure from their religion. The lies and misinformation that NARTH proposes is horrible, and really damaging to the psyche.

    I'm not saying that Ex-Gay therapy is 100% bad. If someone really doesn't feel like becoming an "out" gay Christian, and they do want to change their sexuality. I say go for it. If I'm to believe their propaganda the Ex-Gays are well adjusted, and happy in their new "Straight" life. I'm still not convinced that in the long term these Ex-Gays are really happy.

    My own personal coming out experience, on the whole wasn't that bad. My church on the other hand didn't handle it well at all. They got me in front of the whole congregation, and "Exorcised" the gay demons out of me. This didn't sit too well for me. It forced me to come to the realization that I am gay, God made me that way (It certainly wasn't my choice.), and that My church (Assembly of God) and so called Christians were not helping. I couldn't reconcile being Gay with being part of their Christianity. I lost my faith during this time, and have had a chip on my shoulder regarding all Christians since then.

    I think that it's the repression of being in the closet that causes the greatest harm to the individual and to society. (See Rep. Mark Foley). I just try to be a well adjusted gay guy. I'm also out to prove that the drug addicted, circuit party, group-sex, bathhouse stereotype really doesn't apply to a large majority of homosexuals (Hell I don't know one lesbian that fits that stereotype).




    For equal opportunity Linkage:



    http://www.narth.com
    http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_nart.htm
    http://www.exgaywatch.com/blog/
     
  13. B_Stronzo

    B_Stronzo New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2005
    Messages:
    4,730
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Plimoth Plantation
    I see, much to my chagrin (say ONLY with proper French pronunciation), that you MB and alex too have found me out. It's not only when LSPG is down either!!:tongue:

    Sometimes I'll wander in when not much of anything is going on here (LIKE LATELY!:mad:) and just watch the exchanges of holier-than-thou-isms. Just moments ago I was in an exhaustive volley with a 34 year old heterosexual self-proclaimed "born again" who said (God YOU GUYS WOULD HAVE HIM FOR LUNCH! :eek: ) "the vagina alone was designed to receive a man's penis".

    When I asked him about the propensity for men to bum fuck their women he said "in God's plan there's no excuse for premarital sex for any reason. Anything (including oral sex) is the work of Satan!!"

    When I told him that was opinion he kinda went berserk. :redface:

    Well of course.

    It wasn't long before he said "much less than ten percent of the over-all community is homosexual. That's been greatly exaggerated to support the homosexual agenda"

    The one question he could not answer was "when, dear sir, do you think that fourteen year old boy precisely "chooses" [his word] to be interested in members of his own sex sexually?" I asked it easily three times since he was so emphatic it was "choice" and "not part of God's design".

    Nevertheless... that question seemed to stop him cold in his tracks.

    Last line?

    "I have important things to do. I cannot be bothered with an ungodly man and I need to change my baby's diaper. May you find God's grace".

    Cool huh?

    Now I'm Godless.... :33:

    And hey! Don't call me GRACE!:mad:
     
  14. madame_zora

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2004
    Messages:
    10,252
    Likes Received:
    2
    Location:
    Ohio
    Sadly Alex, humans have shown over and over that we are far too stupid to just accept each other without bringing ourselves to complete shame first.

    As I see it, there is one major thing that seems to separate people- those who see connections between events and those who view each event as separate and unrelated. The second group will see no similarities between other horrors of the past, because that would force them to admit that their current dreadful behavior is unacceptable, and going to produce no good result. They are able to reconcile their beliefs with things that don't make any sense at all historically because they can extract a phrase or two from the Bible to support hatred, even though that is clearly not the intended purpose of the book.

    I can take the hurling of insults and the alarmist's claims that I'm a "conspiracy theorist" for one simple reason- I'm right. I don't care how anyone feels personally about my claim, I know in the end it's right to consider people different from me as equals. I KNOW this because it's obvious, and it needs no further verification from a supreme being. For those who don't see it, they probably never will, and I'm just happy that one day they'll die and humankind will move on.

    All things are not equal- some are actually better. It's better to give love than hate, better to show acceptance than ridicule (or violence), better to grow inside oneself than to remain stagnant. It is better to overcome fear than to live in it, better to take a chance and be wrong than to take no chances at all. We "conspiracy theorists" may be annoying, but please find an historical precedent where the hate regimes have emerged victorious, to the benefit of the culture they condemned.

    Hate and judgement are always wrong. Go check the mail, you just didn't get your letter yet. Now, run outside and kiss a fag.
     
  15. dannymawg

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2006
    Messages:
    1,121
    Likes Received:
    3
  16. fortiesfun

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    Messages:
    4,692
    Likes Received:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
    If I recall this right, Lex, I think NARTH was actually founded as the breakaway group from APA which refused the accept the results of what was a pretty bitter fight at the time. Their religious convictions have developed over time as fewer and fewer legit types were willing to be associated with them.
     
  17. D_alex8

    D_alex8 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2005
    Messages:
    8,602
    Likes Received:
    11
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Germany
    Well, in that case, I guess I'm gonna have to be the one to reiterate categorically that such pseudo-therapy is 100% bad. From all I've witnessed, it messes with people's minds, and generally sends them into an even more frenzied form of 'hyper-closeted behavior' than they were in previously. While before they were "merely" trapped in a state of self-loathing, while exploring their natural desires behind closed doors, by attempting "Ex-Gay" shit, they will heighten their desire for keeping a 'totally hetero' exterior, and will in turn fall even deeper into self-loathing when they inevitably fail, thereafter adopting even more of a mask for the world which believes they have been "straightened out" successfully. :rolleyes: "Ex-Gay" is an ugly form of self-repression, and of socio-cultural repression, dressed up in part as religion and in part as medicine, when in fact it is nothing but hatred.

    To say you've been through crap is an understatement, and I think you've been incredibly open in bringing this to the boards. The only demons involved there were the 'personal demons' they managed to drive into you through their actions, and which clearly still haunt you in your quest to find a comfortable place in this world to be your natural self. The fact you still give any credence to their behaviors, and those of "ExGay" organizations, indicates you have a way to go yet in exorcizing those personal demons imho, although I truly hope that you will in time.

    Equal opportunities need not apply for hate organizations, as far as I'm concerned. While it's useful to see the enemy's entrenched views by keeping up-to-date with the goings-on on such sites, a large part of me still reacts with the same disgust that I would feel from seeing links to neo-Nazi and Holocaust-denial sites posted in a discussion of the Third Reich. It's not merely another viewpoint, it's an abhorrent viewpoint based purely on a pack of lies and wilfully distorted data.

    *hugs DiegoID after this rant, since his post really was incredibly powerful as a personal account highlighting some of the dangers to which this thread alludes... I just needed to vent my spleen a little too* :wink: :hug:
     
Draft saved Draft deleted