I deal with lots of equipment and think Toshiba's are the best with Dell a close second.
Having said that, I'd still encourage you to spend the token amount necessary to get Consumer Report's opinion.
You probably also own an IPod and think that an MP3 player with a flash drive should cost more than $150 dollars, don't you?
Silly rabbit.
Apple drains its user-base dry with overpriced items marketed very slickly.
... No way of using widely-available mass software. I think Apple still hasn't gotten past the mentality of those times.
You probably also own an IPod and think that an MP3 player with a flash drive should cost more than $150 dollars, don't you?
Silly rabbit.
Apple drains its user-base dry with overpriced items marketed very slickly.
Macs are awesome but...they are overpriced. Since the parts are now identical to the ones in a PC laptop they would sell so much more if they were even in price. I got my 17" HP DV8327US with 160GB sata HDD, Nvidia 7600 Geforce2go 256MB video, Intel Core Duo 1.66, 2GB ram for 1100 with a rebate. that incuded firewire, wireless a/b/g, bluetooth, dvd burner with lightscribe you, IR remote even to watch movies! (with built in altec lansing speaker) it is truley awesome - and it came with XP professional...
If I could have gotten a similiarly equipped mac for that I would have.
a word on viruses, the big reason there are so many for windows and so few for mac's are...windows is THE os. Becuase it is soooo prevelant it is the darling of the hax0r community. They love to write viruses for it to prove how unsecure it is. If mac had won the os wars in the 90's it would be MAC OS covered in viruses.
We get it...but, you're not clearing up any misunderstandings you're merely evangalising.:tongue:
Do you also remember the times when Apple/Mac computers in shops had a sheet of paper put somewhere close to them, titled "Software usable with this computer..." and a list of 20 or 30 word processors, spreadsheet editors, database software and service programs? No way of using widely-available mass software. I think Apple still hasn't gotten past the mentality of those times.
Hey, at heart I am a rebel. And I can think of 100 more effective and efficient ways to be a rebel than by owning Apple products.
Having some expensive toy that is limited in its compatability defeats the purpose of having said expensive toy.
And you PC lovers arent? I just wanted to make the point that having a MAC doesnt mean that you won't be able to use anything from anybody else unless they also have a MAC. I've had a mac for 2yrs now and I've never run into a situation where I was like damn if only I had a pc I could be doing this or that.
dong20 said:I've nothing against MACs other than cost. Besides the fact they look funky they no longer do anything any better than Wintel machine can and at lower cost so I don't see what the fuss is about. Moving to the Intel platform was a smart move for Apple (I hope)
......
I don't think anyone is 'MAC Bashing', I certainly didn't mean to. All I said, or at least meant to say was I don't see the fuss. I have used, managed and repaired PCs and MACs for ten years or more and I prefer PCs in almost all aspects other than visual appeal.
Granted there was a time when DTP etc was firmly entrenched on the MAC for good reason but, and I'm trying to be objective I don't believe that is the case anymore. If it were then MACs would be more mainstream and DTP software releases for MAC would precede those for Wintel not the other way around.
In my opinion the backlit keyboard was the best thing ever invented, I LOVE IIT! The new magnetic adapter is also the best thing invented, oh I could just go on and on about how amazing macs are.
Who knows perhaps he'll change his mind after reading up.......oh the MAC side....
ONCE YOU GO MAC YOU NEVER GO BACK
Things have changed, just because they don't want to whore out theirselves like microsoft doesnt mean that there's something wrong with them. For every PC program out there, there's a MAc equivelant that does the same thing if not better and easier.
In the end everybody has their preferances. It's like telling a gay guy that girls are better for this reason and this reason. Its not going to make sense, I was just putting the idea out there that perhaps this person may consider a MAC before just shutting them out. I wasn't expecting everybody to turn on me and basically tell me macs suck and that I'm some poser for having one. Sorry for having an opinion I'll just keep my opinions to myself since nobody wants to give them a chance. So yea PC's are amazing and I'm just going to go sit in the corner now with my MAC that is incompatible with the rest of the world.![]()
dong20 said:I agree I DO like the backlit keyboards, but it's not worth £800 - £1000 IMO. I get it that you like MACs, so do I, I just prefer PCs. It's not an either or which you seem to be painting it as.
On evangelising:
Now, tell me, where did I say PC=Good and MAC=Bad or that they are incomptible with PCs. They're not, it's nearer the reverse actually. As far as I can see I'm only saying:
- The Price/Performance ratio for MACs is higher than PCs,
- repairs can and often are more expensive because,
- spares are expensive,
- some software is not as widely available or as current,
- claims that they are 'better' for certain tasks or just 'better' simply don't stand up under objective scrutiny.
and
Now that sounds pretty evangelical to me....:tongue::smile:
It's little to do with whoring, it's choice. Though I grant you the playing field isn't level and Apple are as responsible as Microsoft. The range of software available for MACs for most applications doesn't compare that on the PC platform. That's nothing to do with PCs being better, it's purely economic. In short, Apple screwed up in the 1980s or this conversation could be reversed.
Err, that's what I said, it's personal choice:
All I'm trying to do is speak from personal experience, like yourself. I didn't turn on you, I didn't say don't buy a MAC because they're rubbish (actually I believe I said I liked them), I merely said that they are expensive for their performance, have expensive accessories and in many respects a narrower software base and I stand by that 100%. I made no negative comments about their performance per se. Perhaps some simple truths may seem like an attack it's not one.
In the final analysis, market forces play a role; if MACs were that good they would be more popular thus there's no right or wrong here only personal preference. I have mine, you have yours.:smile:
I never said you said anything, the whole once you go mac you never go back is a joke, just like once you go black you never go back. The whole software thing I guess that gets more into what you're doing and what you need the computer for. For most people that buy a computer they're using it for pretty basic things and would care less how much software is available as long as they can do what they need. For me I have the adobe suite and a few other artistic programs that assist me and the basic programs, besides those programs I really don't have anything I'm going to be looking for that is going to make a big difference whether or not it's available. Dong I wasn't attacking you personally, in fact I realize what you said it's just so many people out there are preaching that MACS are like the worse thing to ever come along and telling people not to get one based on things they don't know. Being that I've had a PC before the mac I can make a comparison and tell it how I see it.
I find it unbelievable how deep and unbridgeable the gap between mac users and pc users can be. It's just computers we're talking, nothing to get fierce about.....
I know and I agree with you. I was being pedantic....Now once Apple iron out the inevitable bugs from using Intel and they drop their prices 20% I'll reconsider.:biggrin1:
It is perverse isn't it. From a professional perspective I have additional considerations but if it works they pay me either way.:smile:
In the final analysis, market forces play a role; if MACs were that good they would be more popular thus there's no right or wrong here only personal preference. I have mine, you have yours.:smile:
The are that good (better, in fact, and if you'd just LIVE with one, you'd agree), but they aren't as popular because Microsoft made it easy for any old hack to throw together simple business programs over a decade ago, thereby encouraging large corporations -- who buy fuckloads of computers that often merely serve as single-purpose tools anyway -- to purchase Wintel boxes to run those custom programs.
In my twenty years of using computers, I have never needed to run Windows. And, I have often listened to friends & coworkers complain about their Windows computers, and have never had to live with the problems they encountered. I have never reinstalled my OS, I have never owned an antivirus program, my computer's security has never been compromised, and I have never had a problem that I couldn't handle before the end of the afternoon. I have never called tech support, either.
(peeves: MAC is not a computer; MAC stands for Media Access Control, and is a networking term. Mac/Macintosh/etc is not a company, it is an operating system that runs on computers built by Apple Computer, Inc.)
OK... time for me to put in my 2¢:
I have a Mac. I love it. I've had it for almost a year and it has never once crashed. On occasion (mostly if i have 20 or more aps open) it will freeze up for a minute or so. I've never had to purchase or run virus protection software (to date there are 3 Mac viruses... each is only a 'nuissance' and doesn't cause any real or lasting damage). My machine is able to open ANY file you throw at it. With GNU software, i get most of my PC friendly aps for free.
I paid $850 for an iBook G4 14 inch with a 60gb hard drive. I beat the shit out of the thing. It still runs like a champ. I have a regular sized memory slot that can take another 2 gigs of ram, and i can plug any perifery device into it I want to add further storage space.
Rewind a little bit:
I had a Gateway Solo. I loved it. I had it for less than 6 months and the hard drive fried. It was still under warrenty so i got a new hard drive. Every time i loaded new software, or even updates of existing software it caused more and more system instability. The thing would crash ALL THE TIME. Blue screen of death. Yuck. New software was expensive, and often didn't do what i wanted it to do.
My mother paid $2,350 for a Gateway Solo 2000 with 2GB hard drive. The last time it Blue Screened it died completely. Nobody can figure out what is wrong with it, but it's so far obsolete that they don't really care.
I've also had desktop PCs. They always got bogged down with spy-ware, add-ware and viruses within the first 2 months. The mac simply doesn't do that. For me (an avid internet junky) the lack of viruses and instability headaches more than makes up for the percieved difference in cost.
The are that good (better, in fact, and if you'd just LIVE with one, you'd agree), but they aren't as popular because Microsoft made it easy for any old hack to throw together simple business programs over a decade ago, thereby encouraging large corporations -- who buy fuckloads of computers that often merely serve as single-purpose tools anyway -- to purchase Wintel boxes to run those custom programs.
My mother paid $2,350 for a Gateway Solo 2000 with 2GB hard drive. The last time it Blue Screened it died completely. Nobody can figure out what is wrong with it, but it's so far obsolete that they don't really care.
(peeves: MAC is not a computer; MAC stands for Media Access Control, and is a networking term. Mac/Macintosh/etc is not a company, it is an operating system that runs on computers built by Apple Computer, Inc.)
I have a Mac. I love it. I've had it for almost a year and it has never once crashed. On occasion (mostly if i have 20 or more aps open) it will freeze up for a minute or so. I've never had to purchase or run virus protection software (to date there are 3 Mac viruses... each is only a 'nuissance' and doesn't cause any real or lasting damage). My machine is able to open ANY file you throw at it. With GNU software, i get most of my PC friendly aps for free.
...
I've also had desktop PCs. They always got bogged down with spy-ware, add-ware and viruses within the first 2 months. The mac simply doesn't do that. For me (an avid internet junky) the lack of viruses and instability headaches more than makes up for the percieved difference in cost.