Obamacare signups pass the 7 million mark

bar4doug

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Not to be nitpicky, and I get what you were saying with the rest of your post, but unemployment benefits are, in fact, taxable income.

Yes I am aware.

And another nitpicky thing. Are you saying they if were gifted the other assets? Because that would actually be completely tax free to the individual. On expensive gifts, it's actually the donor who pays the tax on it, not the recipient, as backwards as that may seem.

I seriously doubt that a corporation will gift shares to their executives. They are all about maintaining share value and reducing overhead, and giving away the store is not in their game plan. I would assume that income derived from things other than their salary are taxed differently. I just am unfamiliar with the mechanics. Is it done with options that are not taxed until they are executed? or some other way?

When you pass around the hat on the schoolyard, what are the odds that one of the kids made more money in a month than any of the other kids would see in their entire lives? When you're within a peer group where everyone's on similar financial standing, everyone contributing a like amount is a reasonable expectation.

The better question would be how much allowance did their parents give their children. Regardless you would never see such diversity in any school district, because it is certain that incomes would need to be fairly equal if their parents all lived in the same school district.

Many peer groups end up dividing up in this fashion as people get older, for the expected reasons.

Jocks versus Preppies versus Metals versus nerds... Usually it's based on habits and hobbies, not money.. at least in school.

Let's say you like to do things that require a certain amount of money on a regular basis, and you want to bring your friend along. If your friend is willing but doesn't have the money to spend, you have three options: spend the money yourself, drop your hobby, or go without your friend. All three of these options can strain a friendship over time.

All depends how you handle it. And what kind of friend you have. From personal experience I find if the friend is willing to participate, he finds a way, because he wants to pay his own way. If the friend doesn't want to participate, I partake in those activities with other friends.

But the American population isn't a bunch of kids with the same amount of money, the things taxes are collected for aren't expensive hobbies, and choosing to leave the people that can't afford it behind isn't an option.

And the American male doesn't come with one size of penis. We are not all created equal. Leaving people behind is a choice. It may not be a nice choice, but it is a choice.

It's not about greed, envy, or any other deadly sin. It's about trying to make the country as a whole work better.

Others may not share this opinion. And in a free society, they have the right to believe what they want. Many are only concerned about making THEIR lives better.

I think we can both agree that the tax system is convoluted as all hell, though. What do you think would work better?

Work better? Depends on what your ultimate goal is.

Personally I'd rather see the states take a bigger role in collecting taxes and distributing the tithes as needed in their locality. The federal government has become such a cluster-fuck that everyone seems to reward their elected officials by sending them back if they come back from the Crusade in Washington with someone elses shit.

I'd take the responsibility for domestic programs away from federal government out of the equation and let the states run them. They'd be forced to run their programs on a balanced budget, and there would be less overhead involved simply because the money would be traveling between fewer hands. Let each state determine the domestic programs they wish to fund.
 

StormfrontFL

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[/B]My response was written to show an example of a situation where a person would choose to stay home and collect benefits rather than work, not to critique the actions taken by millionaires and corporations.
It would depend if you qualify for said benefits. If you do not, then obviously you are going to take that job flippin' burgers.
I did not write in my above example that people are lazy. I wrote that when one factors in several things (gas, lunch, day care, and especially free time lost), it may seem reasonable to stay at home instead of taking the job, because when everything gets monetized, it doesn't pay to work. Again, I wrote this to demonstrate an example why someone would choose to stay at home and not take a job. I wrote that one would need to get pay that is twice the benefit in order to make working the more economical choice when time gets factored in to the equation.



No disagreement from me.. but I can see why someone would choose to stay home to collect unemployment rather than accept a job that nets less when the cost of working that job is factored in.

You'll get no argument from me. I too dislike the idea of an able bodied person not working if something worthwhile is available but it is certainly understandable that working 30-40 hours per week only to receive less than what would be paid out in aid is not going to make someone want to work. As I stated earlier it has been a long held lie told by the GOP and anti safety net zealots that people on welfare are living the good life. I guess that's true if the good life is Ramen noodles, Chef Boyardee, chicken, Bumblebee tuna, and other lower cost foods with a rare treat of actual beef.
 

JTalbain

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I seriously doubt that a corporation will gift shares to their executives. They are all about maintaining share value and reducing overhead, and giving away the store is not in their game plan. I would assume that income derived from things other than their salary are taxed differently. I just am unfamiliar with the mechanics. Is it done with options that are not taxed until they are executed? or some other way?
Ah okay. I believe in that case they are taxed at the lower of the option adjusted basis amount when issued and FMV when exercised.
The better question would be how much allowance did their parents give their children. Regardless you would never see such diversity in any school district, because it is certain that incomes would need to be fairly equal if their parents all lived in the same school district.

Jocks versus Preppies versus Metals versus nerds... Usually it's based on habits and hobbies, not money.. at least in school.

All depends how you handle it. And what kind of friend you have. From personal experience I find if the friend is willing to participate, he finds a way, because he wants to pay his own way. If the friend doesn't want to participate, I partake in those activities with other friends.
That's the point I was making. There's not all that much diversity, generally speaking, when you're talking about the finances of kids on a playground. As you get older however, those financial differences will assert themselves. You might make a point to do things with that friend, but choosing to go with other people is choosing the hobby over your friend's company. If that happens often enough, and as you say you just go with other friends, you're developing more shared experiences and relationships with those other friends rather than the poorer one. It doesn't mean that you'll immediately kick him/her to the curb, but the societal pressure is there, and the convenience of having a group of friends that both likes and can afford to do what you want to is present. That was why I said it wasn't the best or most realistic analogy.

And the American male doesn't come with one size of penis. We are not all created equal. Leaving people behind is a choice. It may not be a nice choice, but it is a choice.
And here's where it starts to get murky. Now replace the expensive hobby with medical treatment. You're now the people with money that can get healthcare when they need it due to having money, and the friend represents those in poverty that can't. As it stands, choosing to move on and leave them behind isn't just an immoral and unacceptable choice to many, it also doesn't make any economic sense. People will get sick and need treatment regardless of what you do. Some medical treatments will happen anyway and be unreimbursed. Those costs are passed on to everybody. An unhealthy workforce is less productive, harming the country's economic output and growth. A non-inclusive medical system which did little to stifle growing costs was starting to strangle the economy. The consequences don't begin and end with the person who can't afford to see the doctor. No man is an island.

Others may not share this opinion. And in a free society, they have the right to believe what they want. Many are only concerned about making THEIR lives better.
They'll continue doing that regardless. And despite all of their bellyaching, they'll continue living here too, even if they can easily afford to move. The rights, safety, wealth, and opportunity found in the US are difficult things to give up. Taxes are a paltry price to pay for them.



Work better? Depends on what your ultimate goal is.
Greater prosperity for the country as a whole. Maximization of GDP through proper utilization of all of our capital, both monetary and human.

Personally I'd rather see the states take a bigger role in collecting taxes and distributing the tithes as needed in their locality. The federal government has become such a cluster-fuck that everyone seems to reward their elected officials by sending them back if they come back from the Crusade in Washington with someone elses shit.

I'd take the responsibility for domestic programs away from federal government out of the equation and let the states run them. They'd be forced to run their programs on a balanced budget, and there would be less overhead involved simply because the money would be traveling between fewer hands. Let each state determine the domestic programs they wish to fund.
Say what you want about wealth distribution, but there are definite benefits to having programs run on a federal rather than state level. For instance, lower overhead is not guaranteed just because fewer people are involved. Larger nationwide programs can better take advantage of economies of scale. Additionally, privately owned companies involved benefit, because they only have to abide by a single set of rules rather than fifty. A larger tax base for funding increases options for aiding efforts in poorer parts of the nation. The benefits are many.

I get what you're saying about local funding, but it seems more motivated by an emotional need for "fairness" in the distribution of money. We're all one national economy and community. What real benefit do we actually gain by allowing certain parts of the economy to shelter themselves off and make their own rules?
 

cruztbone

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the latest ABC-Washington Post poll has Obamacare at 44% approval, 48% disapproval. that is the best showing yet for Obamacare nationally in any poll.
and it makes Obamacare an important issue for Democrats to run on in 2014, despite the nonsense from its detractors.
 

JTalbain

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the latest ABC-Washington Post poll has Obamacare at 44% approval, 48% disapproval. that is the best showing yet for Obamacare nationally in any poll.
and it makes Obamacare an important issue for Democrats to run on in 2014, despite the nonsense from its detractors.

Individual parts of the law have always polled better than the law as a whole. Additionally, it's worth pointing out that the primary reason we needed any reform at all was because skyrocketing costs were beginning to strangle our economy. Regardless of how people about the law, it's performing cost control admirably.
 

Jjz1109

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Individual parts of the law have always polled better than the law as a whole. Additionally, it's worth pointing out that the primary reason we needed any reform at all was because skyrocketing costs were beginning to strangle our economy. Regardless of how people about the law, it's performing cost control admirably.

As we discussed earlier, by increasing deductibles (mine tripled this year) and passing costs onto the consumer, who must now reach hefty deductibles. You may refer to that as performing cost controls admirably, I see it as shifting the burden onto the consumer. You can argue any way you want, but it just cost me more out of pocket than last year.
 

b.c.

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the latest ABC-Washington Post poll has Obamacare at 44% approval, 48% disapproval. that is the best showing yet for Obamacare nationally in any poll.
and it makes Obamacare an important issue for Democrats to run on in 2014, despite the nonsense from its detractors.

There are people here quoting polls etc. but those numbers don't quite show the whole picture do they?

For example, even in a "red state" GOP/Tea Party stronghold like Louisiana, a slim majority of people still aren't in favor of outright repeal of the law, and this in spite of a big bucks (Koch bros. money) TV blitz blasting Landrieu for voting in favor of the law:

http://www.nola.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/04/louisiana_residents_dont_like.html

Wording of the polls questions (as well as the selected demographics of the poll) can also be misleading.

Furthermore, when one considers other "numbers" (since they want to cite them so much) the GOP doesn't measure up quite as well:

"Americans trust Democrats over Republicans by 40 to 34 percent to handle the country’s main problems. By significant margins, Americans see Democrats as better for the middle class and on women’s issues. Americans favor the Democrats’ positions on raising the minimum wage, same-sex marriage and on the broad issue of dealing with global climate change."

The GOP/Tea Party knows this, which is why the strategy for this fall is to

1) continue to try painting the ACA as a failure and quote whatever numbers they can muster to suggest a lack of support, and


2) continue to pass voter suppression laws designed to disenfranchise those who vote against them (not that those voters traditionally bother to even SHOW for these "midterm" elections, anyway).
 
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b.c.

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And what's also amazing is the level of ignorance out there regarding the law. I think in one recent poll, some 58% of those who already had health insurance believe the law will have no effect at all on them.

For STARTERS, here's three benefits, for those of us who were already covered:

1. Elimination of caps to coverage whereby after they've covered a certain amount they say "no more".

2. NO LONGER getting kicked from your plan, just when it begins to look like you're going to need it most.

3. And contrary to the constant barrage of GOP lies and spin, this FACT:


"After doubling in the past two decades, medical expenses rose less last year than at any time since Harry S. Truman was president in 1949

Obamacare Winning Bond Converts as Slowing Health Costs Tame CPI - Bloomberg


Of COURSE there are objections from those who go around without coverage, don't want to buy it and figure they’ll NEVER need it, but who will beat US (who have it) to the emergency rooms, and more likely than not, skip out on the tab.

But then, that’s to be EXPECTED of the CLIVEN BUNDYS of the world, who don’t mind taking, cheating, whatever - and then somehow figure the only ones on the TAKE are “those people”.
 

b.c.

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Major New Study Says Obamacare Is Working — Even For Republicans


http://finance.yahoo.com/news/major-...mments-postbox



“The Affordable Care Act has been successful at achieving some major goals in the first year of its full implementation, according to a new study from The Commonwealth Fund.”

“There are three important findings from the study: The uninsured rate is dropping, most people like their new insurance plans (even Republicans!), and most people are finding it easy to visit a doctor.”

“Expectedly, there is a significant difference in the reduction of uninsured between states that have expanded Medicaid and those that have not.”


Gee… thanks GOP!


“Even 74% of Republicans say they're at least somewhat satisfied with their new plans.”


“Significantly, most people who gained coverage under the Affordable Care Act said they couldn't have accessed care they have received since obtaining insurance…”
 
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deleted15807

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Major New Study Says Obamacare Is Working — Even For Republicans


http://finance.yahoo.com/news/major-...mments-postbox



“The Affordable Care Act has been successful at achieving some major goals in the first year of its full implementation, according to a new study from The Commonwealth Fund.”

“There are three important findings from the study: The uninsured rate is dropping, most people like their new insurance plans (even Republicans!), and most people are finding it easy to visit a doctor.”

“Expectedly, there is a significant difference in the reduction of uninsured between states that have expanded Medicaid and those that have not.”

Gee… thanks GOP!


“Even 74% of Republicans say they're at least somewhat satisfied with their new plans.”


“Significantly, most people who gained coverage under the Affordable Care Act said they couldn't have accessed care they have received since obtaining insurance…”

Don't expect 'the sky is falling/government takeover/death panels' squad to capitulate. They'll just roll-over their astroturf Fox generated rage to the next -Gate armed with lies, half-truths and misrepresentations.
 

b.c.

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Don't expect 'the sky is falling/government takeover/death panels' squad to capitulate. They'll just roll-over their astroturf Fox generated rage to the next -Gate armed with lies, half-truths and misrepresentations.

Yes. With 74% of Republicans reporting that they're at least somewhat satisfied with their plans under the ACA, you have to wonder why Koch backed organizations are still running lying b.s. political ads against a plan that has allowed millions (who couldn't get coverage) to FINALLY obtain insurance.

But then again, that's like the bullshit ads they're running against Mary Landrieu here in "Looseyana", criticizing her position on environmental protections and industry regulation by claiming it "costs jobs".

TRANSLATION: "SOME" (apparently) feel they ought to have every RIGHT to pollute the state willy nilly as they so desire, without regulations to abide by, as if the BP debacle and the Kochs own environmental fuck-ups aren't REASON ENOUGH for the need of laws to protect the health, property and livelihood of the people therein.

But then, twisting truth is what the GOP EXCELS at, isn't it??

Turning a war hero into a villain while someone with a spotty record of service becomes a VICTIM... making people think something good for them is bad, and something bad is good...

... turning the truth into a lie, and a lie into the truth.
 
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Boobalaa

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I finally received my "Benefits Identification Card" from the CA. Dept. of Health Care Services. Not bad, since I sent in my paperwork on 10/1/2013..It only took a bout 9 months!Now, come Monday, the real waiting in lines begins..
 

h0neymustard

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I finally received my "Benefits Identification Card" from the CA. Dept. of Health Care Services. Not bad, since I sent in my paperwork on 10/1/2013..It only took a bout 9 months!Now, come Monday, the real waiting in lines begins..

Yay for socialized healthcare!
You wanted it, right?