Obama's American Jobs Act

[B_crackoff]

Hey, Karl Rove's take:

Twelve Words To Describe Obama's Jobs Speech | Fox News

He confirms, that Obama demanded 17 times the House passed a bill - that no one has seen.

I can't believe that someone actually counted them.

 

[D_Hairy Truman]

obama is an orator i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin. dealmaker? obviously he sucks. reputed to spend 1 billion to try to be reelected. if you have to spend this much money something is being said. it'll come down to romney and barack as both are similar. besides it doesn't matter. what matters is getting rid of a centralized bank (privately owned federal reserve) and take our country back. another 500 billion dollar loan that the taxpayers are used as collateral again. it is the money masters that control this country and make the laws. or any country.

 

[Jason]

This was an excellent political speech. It has conveyed the message that Obama cares about unemployment in the USA and the problems it is creating. There's also a concrete proposal behind the rhetoric. Once the figures are reduced a bit as the bill goes through I suppose it will be ballpark $ one-third of a trillion pa into job creation.

The problem is with the underlying economics. The Keynesian mantra that governments should spend to get out of a recession only works when a country has a surplus or a modest deficit. In broad-brush terms a blanket spending boost in the USA will not work. However well targetted investment might work. For example there is a case for bringing forward planned investment (which means cancelling investment in later years) and there is a case for looking at specific projects with a direct, quick, quantifiable return on investment. Certainly a few billions of investment brought forward and well-targetted makes sense. But not anything like the intended $450bn.

The short-term effects of the policy should be some sort of reduction in unemployment. But a plan to add $450bn to debt over and above the existing planned debt is not sustainable. Assuming this bill becomes law I cannot see any way that the USA will escape downgrades by credit rating agencies. Indeed Moodys have the USA on negative watch which specifically means change policy or be downgraded.

So does it matter? A lower credit rating will put up both bond yields and the default insurance premium on bond purchases. The USA will be paying a higher rate of interest on its debt, and given the size of the debt mountain that will be a very big problem.

We're in an interesting scenario where a politician's economic policy will very soon get an objective view on whether it is right. If Obama is right then US bond yields end of 2013 will be much the same as now, and unemployment will have come down a bit. If he is wrong by end of 2013 bond yields will be rising fast and the USA will be forced into extreme measures to contain an economic collapse. It is a massive gamble. My money is on a short-term boost to the US economy followed by disaster.

 

[D_Kitten_Kaboodle]

The one thing that I found rather humorous about the speech (and actually about the 12th time or so I started rolling out loud):

"PASS THIS BILL...NOW"

It became a joke with us... Not that we disagreed with the speech (or agreed)

Pass the Salt..errrr BILL NOW LOL

He is a good orator. He has a great public presence. I found a couple of issues that he really put a spin on, but otherwise, he did a very good job.

 

[D_Percy_Prettywillie]

He has to be emphatic about what he thinks is necessary at this point. Any equivocation on his part and the Republicans will steam roll over his proposal with (ironically enough) one road block after another. They'll tie up the plan in ribbon until the country bleeds red ink. If he said "Take time to consider the implications of non-action, read carefully, deliberate, and vote your conscience," it would be 2020 before the damn thing even reached the house floor.

"Pass this bill now" in Congressional terms means "Pass this bill while the problems it is designed to address are still current. Pass it some time before the the second coming."

As for Republicans not having read it? A.) they're not going to read it anyway and b.) no matter what they read they're going to be against it. The bar has been set so low at this point their comprehension of the materials involved is wholly irrelevant.




JSZ

 

[D_Sam Rockswell]

obama is an orator i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin. dealmaker? obviously he sucks. reputed to spend 1 billion to try to be reelected. if you have to spend this much money something is being said. it'll come down to romney and barack as both are similar. besides it doesn't matter. what matters is getting rid of a centralized bank (privately owned federal reserve) and take our country back. another 500 billion dollar loan that the taxpayers are used as collateral again. it is the money masters that control this country and make the laws. or any country.

i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin.

i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin.

i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin.

i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin.

lol Nice. And you don't see anything wrong with that statement? Guess ya wouldn't.

I just would like it noted that kt71 said that. No one put a gun to his head or made'm eat green peas...he said that of his own free will.

 

[D_Sam Rockswell]

Presumptuous? Did anyone say that when bush was tripping over his own speech? Cause i don't know about you but that seems way more in appropriate for the president of these United States. Reading is in fact fundamental.

Tired? Well you would be too if you had to repeat the same thing over and over again in the span of four years.

Small? Thats what she said...about your penis. Sorry couldn't help myself.

Mind-boggling? Wait what? There was a version with a graph an everything.

Slippery? Ok now you just completely lost touch with what a politician. Not agreeing that he is indeed slippery all's i'm saying is compared to others he's about as slick as sandpaper.

Misleading? (sigh) ok your just making it too easy now.

Arrogant? Says the person with an outline saying "Twelve Words to Describe Obama's Jobs Speech" cause america really is that simple.

Self-centered? Do you even own a dictionary?

Unnecessary? (falls over laughing)

Completely political? So wanting to make sure America doesn't collapse from the weight of douche is completely political? Dude your soooo lucky you have a job at present time.

Hyper-partisan: This speech – especially its angry tone? Angry tone? Really? I'm gonna go ahead an guess you are your own editor.

Misguided?........not enough words in the english dictionary to explain that bit of stupidity.

 

[D_Sam Rockswell]

obama is an orator i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin. dealmaker? obviously he sucks. reputed to spend 1 billion to try to be reelected. if you have to spend this much money something is being said. it'll come down to romney and barack as both are similar. besides it doesn't matter. what matters is getting rid of a centralized bank (privately owned federal reserve) and take our country back. another 500 billion dollar loan that the taxpayers are used as collateral again. it is the money masters that control this country and make the laws. or any country.

Oh an just so ya know, i'm not attacking you or playing any sort of card or anything. If anything we're a lot a like me an you. I like you, not many people can articulate their opinion as awesomely as you have with out a caps lock key.

 

[Bbucko]

Presumptuous? Did anyone say that when bush was tripping over his own speech? Cause i don't know about you but that seems way more in appropriate for the president of these United States. Reading is in fact fundamental.

Tired? Well you would be too if you had to repeat the same thing over and over again in the span of four years.

Small? Thats what she said...about your penis. Sorry couldn't help myself.

Mind-boggling? Wait what? There was a version with a graph an everything.

Slippery? Ok now you just completely lost touch with what a politician. Not agreeing that he is indeed slippery all's i'm saying is compared to others he's about as slick as sandpaper.

Misleading? (sigh) ok your just making it too easy now.

Arrogant? Says the person with an outline saying "Twelve Words to Describe Obama's Jobs Speech" cause america really is that simple.

Self-centered? Do you even own a dictionary?

Unnecessary? (falls over laughing)

Completely political? So wanting to make sure America doesn't collapse from the weight of douche is completely political? Dude your soooo lucky you have a job at present time.

Hyper-partisan: This speech – especially its angry tone? Angry tone? Really? I'm gonna go ahead an guess you are your own editor.

Misguided?........not enough words in the english dictionary to explain that bit of stupidity.

Someone's obviously deleted a post here, as you're responding to something that no longer exists. This is an excellent reason to use the Quote feature, especially if something is somewhat controversial in nature.

 

[D_Kitten_Kaboodle]

He has to be emphatic about what he thinks is necessary at this point. Any equivocation on his part and the Republicans will steam roll over his proposal with (ironically enough) one road block after another. They'll tie up the plan in ribbon until the country bleeds red ink. If he said "Take time to consider the implications of non-action, read carefully, deliberate, and vote your conscience," it would be 2020 before the damn thing even reached the house floor.

"Pass this bill now" in Congressional terms means "Pass this bill while the problems it is designed to address are still current. Pass it some time before the the second coming."

As for Republicans not having read it? A.) they're not going to read it anyway and b.) no matter what they read they're going to be against it. The bar has been set so low at this point their comprehension of the materials involved is wholly irrelevant.




JSZ

I know all this JSZ.... it just got funny after a while and I'm the kinda person that finds humor in odd places.... One time I just started laughing uncontrollably and my hubby looked at me.. ... I had to explain what I was hearing....

A more emphatic speech, there never was...........

 

[Frnkd213]

Obama is the messenger folks. Listen to it, it was to the people(us) to let us tell congress-I could use expletives but choose not to, that hey, the ball is and has been in your hands and you ( congress-repubs mainly) need to get off your ass.

You see it's easy to blame the parents when their adult children continues to terroize the neighborhood, bullying, having gang mentality. Unfortunately some of these foster children who was placed in the neighborhood by social workers (us) think they aren't responsible for any of their actions. Finally the foster parent is telling the SW you placed them here now tell them that hey act responsibly or I'll (SW) get you out of there and put you back where you came from.

The president can only suggest legislation, it's up to congress to legislate. Details? He gave enough for congress to work with. People who use this excuse have no intention to want a recovery. And it shows by their no action, "show me the money", I'm representing the will of god and the people attitude. A frame work is what the president has proposed! Now it's up to them to define it further and pass it. President than signs or vetos. That's a democratic process. (for tea baggers there is a difference between democratic and democrate- whom you hate.)

It's clear who are the naysayers and fair whether constituents here. The speech was not about war, debt ceiling, health care. It was about jobs. Yes everything that's going on is related to jobs, only an idiot would have to have that spelled out too. Jobs is what the speech is about. Jobs, jobs, jobs.

Call, email, fax- don't mail it will take weeks having to go through anthrax search etc.,send a post card-no search needed. Flood them with your disgust as well as the action they need to take! Don't know their address? Whitehouse.gov

 

[D_Sam Rockswell]

Hey, Karl Rove's take:

Twelve Words To Describe Obama's Jobs Speech | Fox News

He confirms, that Obama demanded 17 times the House passed a bill - that no one has seen.

I can't believe that someone actually counted them.

It was a reply to this link by Karl Rove. Sorry, no one here actually said it so i just assumed it was read out of sheer wtfness lol. My apologizes.

 

[vince]

Someone's obviously deleted a post here, as you're responding to something that no longer exists. This is an excellent reason to use the Quote feature, especially if something is somewhat controversial in nature.

Nope, nothing was deleted or otherwise tampered with. It just seems to have come out of the ether.

 

[ripsrips]

I called the white house and asked where I could read the bill the president proposed?

"There is nothing on paper, if you want to go to the presidents website you can find the text of his speech there."

So I ask; If the president proposes a bill shouldn't he have it on paper somewhere?

"Technically yes! However within a week or two he should have something written down." Please continually check his website!

So I asked you mean whitehouse.gov?

“she says no barackobama.com”

I say if this is proposed legislation shouldn’t it be on whitehouse.gov…and not his re-election campaign website? …..after a short pause I got …

”thank you for calling the white house”

This girl (she sounded young) was searching for answers to my questions she kept saying "well...ummm...ummm" about a dozen times...almost as many times as the pres said pass this bill now, and the total time on the phone was 2:54 seconds!

I did ask a few other questions that not pertain to the president and in those questions I got a swift response...and NO ummms!

 

[Bbucko]

Nope, nothing was deleted or otherwise tampered with. It just seems to have come out of the ether.

OK, thanks.

 

[NYCdude]

This girl (she sounded young) was searching for answers to my questions she kept saying "well...ummm...ummm" about a dozen times...almost as many times as the pres said pass this bill now, and the total time on the phone was 2:54 seconds!

Yea, because I'm sure you were the only nutjob who called asking the exact same thing and she had no idea what to say.

Back on planet Earth, the speech was excellent and there is no doubt it had an effect on republicans. We'll see what happens, but Boehner had an "oh shit" look on his face, and nobody has been a stronger critic of Obama (with reason) than me. The 14 months line was brilliant. The "Imagine where we would be if the modern day republicans had made decisions like not to build the railroads, the interstate system, the airports, subsidize the internet" etc. was even better.

The President is in an extraordinarily weak position for an incumbent, but the Republicans are rapidly making themselves even weaker. You've got half the party saying good riddance to social security, while the other half is saying what the hell.

 

[dandelion]

One million construction workers [850,000 of them hispanic who send most of their pay checks back to their countries, and pay very little taxes due to the many children they have], the steel comes from China, etc....A failure to boost the economy.

I think you make a good point here. In the past this kind of policy truly put americans to work. If now it means employing foreigners to use up imported materials, it isnt going to get the local economy moving.

a few billions of investment brought forward and well-targetted makes sense. But not anything like the intended $450bn.

Always a question of how much is too much or not enough, isnt it. I'd suggest Obama's number is a minimum figure if you seriously intend to affect anything rather than just doing pr and trying to talk things up. But as per by previous comment, any amount is useless unless it is spent on something where it will be effective.

But a plan to add $450bn to debt over and above the existing planned debt is not sustainable.

Rock and hard place. Another indeterminate quantity, how much can the US borrow. I would agree with you that it is not clear whether borrowing plans are sustainable or not. I think on balance the US will be able to borrow this and a lot more. Banks are desperate to lend to the US. The question is whether it will repay. If things go badly so that it cannot repay, then I doubt the extra sums borrowed now will have been the tipping point.

Assuming this bill becomes law I cannot see any way that the USA will escape downgrades by credit rating agencies.

Rather depends if this is perceived as adding to the solution or the problem. I'd suggest that at worst it is probably neutral. On the other hand, if congress throws out the bill, that might precipitate a downgrade because it would again demonstrate the Us inability to do anthing at all even to try to fix things.

It is a massive gamble.

Ha! like there are now any small ones?

 

[Industrialsize]

obama is an orator i think people like to listen to because he is articulate for a black man. yes i said black based on the color of his skin. dealmaker? obviously he sucks. reputed to spend 1 billion to try to be reelected. if you have to spend this much money something is being said. it'll come down to romney and barack as both are similar. besides it doesn't matter. what matters is getting rid of a centralized bank (privately owned federal reserve) and take our country back. another 500 billion dollar loan that the taxpayers are used as collateral again. it is the money masters that control this country and make the laws. or any country.

WTF does that mean? He is articulate FOR A BLACK MAN? You stating that speaks volumes about YOU.

 

[D_Sam Rockswell]

WTF does that mean? He is articulate FOR A BLACK MAN? You stating that speaks volumes about YOU.

That it does :biggrin1:

 

[Thedrewbert]

I'm going to paraphrase another user who put this as succinctly as I think it can be put; no matter what plan he proposes ("Tax cuts for anyone who votes Republican!" was the tag line I'm thinking of) there is a group of Congressman who would vote against it. There are talking heads who would qualify any plan this President came up with as a brick on the path to (fill-in-your-favorite-news-crawl-melodramatic-reference-to-the-apocalypse-with-appropriate-theme-music.)

It will either hurt the economy, bring about socialism, result in death panels, enrage the international community, destroy small business, up-end the American way of life, or exacerbate what ever problem it is intended to address; now let's hear what he has to say so we can decide which it is this time.

A good plan, a bad plan, it makes no difference- it won't get through Congress the way it is proposed as their entire legislative agenda is to tank anything that comes out of the White House and ensure this country is in the worst possible shape in 2012 so as to make their primary goal (That Barack Obama be a one term president) a reality.

With that as the reality of the situation, discussion over the actual merits of anything he proposes seems almost moot; what difference does it make? It's like planning how you would spend the money if you won the lottery- an enjoyable pastime but 99.999 % of the time just a pipe dream.




JSZ

that would be me, and the line was "Obama's Jobs Bill could be 'Tax cuts for anyone who votes Republican' and the Republicans would STILL vote against it"

Very strong domestic spending with a "built in america" requirement is the only way to get the jobs back. Debt or no debt.