Obama's Poll Numbers

B_Nick8

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I have.

1.) He supports Obama
2.) He supports HIV+ men engaging in unprotected sex
3.) He supports Gay marriage
4.) He claims to support conservative ideology.

Something doesn't add up here....

What doesn't add up, among other things, is that you're an idiot.

He is highly--but often objectively--critical of Obama. He has never, to my knowledge, supported HIV+ men having unprotected sex, but that's a lovely slur. He's gay, so of course he supports gay marriage, but then anyone with half a brain does. And he is a conservative. Certainly from where I'm standing. Perhaps if you're standing somewhere to the right of Mussolini you wouldn't think so.

Seriously, buddy, you are so myopic that you can't accept anyone who doesn't share your tunnel-vision. It might be time to get your prescription checked.
 

B_VinylBoy

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I think you should look into his history a bit more.

No need to. We can go by his own words. I mean, you DO remember he wrote a book about it entitled, "The Conservative Soul". If you didn't know, educate yourself.

Here's the book: Amazon.com: The Conservative Soul: How We Lost It, How to Get It Back (9780060188771): Andrew Sullivan: Books
And here's an interview where he discusses it: YouTube - Dennis Prager & Andrew Sullivan debate Conservatism (1 of 4)

Also, he's recognized by many others in the political arena on both sides of the spectrum as a conservative. Search his name on YouTube and you'll see countless interviews on Olbermann, Chris Matthews and even commentary on Real Time with Bill Maher where he comes right out and says it.

But of course, in your binary world it's impossible for you to fathom that someone can be a conservative and not agree with you or align with the stereotypes that associate with it. Grant it, you may be entitled to your opinion. But to suggest that Andrew Sullivan is not a conservative based on your own mental definition of what makes one further solidifies you as one of the more ignorant people on this board. Congratulations!!
 

Bbucko

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Ah, you mean the Andrew Sullivan who used to be the editor for the liberal rag "The New Republic"? Yeah, he OBVIOUSLY doesn't have a liberal slant to try and whitewash Obama's failing numbers.

Yawn.

I actually knew Andrew Sullivan back in the 80s in Boston when he was still going to Harvard. He was (and still is) a hard-core Thatcherite and has enormous sympathy for the Tory party in the UK (extremely conservative).

His tenure at The New Republic was extremely controversial, especially in Boston where he was based. I remember his frequently getting into loud verbal shouting matches (at least one turning into a pushing match) in the local gay bars, most especially Fritz, an after-work watering hole in the South End, which in the 80s was the gay ghetto.

According to his wiki bio:

Sullivan describes himself as a libertarian conservative who has argued that the Republican Party has abandoned true conservative principles.[12] He views true conservatism as classical libertarian conservative, where economic control of a citizen's daily life by the government is very limited. However, this style of conservatism differs from classic libertarianism in that some governmental control or regulation is acceptable in order to preserve a functional society as it currently exists. Stances on social or cultural issues, under this style of conservatism, resemble the stances of classical libertarianism or modern U.S. liberalism. While stances on foreign policy are more hawkish than classic libertarianism, this style of conservatism differs from current neo-conservatism and arguably more closely resemble U.S. liberalism from the early 1930s up until the late 1960s. In the foreign policy sphere, Sullivan's views have become somewhat less hawkish following the difficulties of the Iraq War.[citation needed]
Sullivan supported G.W. Bush in the 2000 election, calling Dick Cheney "sexy" on Real Time with Bill Maher.[13] In 2004, he gave a rather late endorsment to John Kerry, primarily as a vote against what he saw as severe problems with the Bush administration. In 2006, he supported the Democratic Party's takeover of Congress. His political philosophy includes a broad range of traditional conservative positions: He favors a flat tax, limited government, privatization of social security, and a strong military, and he opposes welfare state programs such as publicly-funded health care. However, on a number of controversial public issues, including same-sex marriage and capital punishment, he takes a position typically shared by those on the left of the U.S. political spectrum. His position on abortion is more mixed; saying that he personally finds it immoral and favors overturning Roe v. Wade, but he can accept legalized abortions in the first trimester. Sullivan endorsed Senator Barack Obama for the Democratic Nomination in the 2008 U.S. Presidential Election, and Rep. Ron Paul for the Republican nomination. On his blog, Sullivan has been highly favorable toward Obama, and has denounced McCain for running misleading campaign advertisements, and endorsed Obama for President on the eve of the election.[14]
In 2009 Forbes magazine ranked Sullivan #19 on a list of "The 25 Most Influential Liberals In The U.S. Media." The magazine said that "he clings unconvincingly to the 'conservative' label even after his fervent endorsement of Obama. His advocacy for gay marriage rights … puts him at odds with many on the right." It stated that Sullivan tends to see issues through an ideological lens based on his homosexuality, and that determines his writing.[15] Sullivan rejected the label and responded that he did not fit the article's own criteria for a liberal, such as support for progressive taxation, universal healthcare, and support for the "war on terror." He concluded that Forbes considered him a liberal because he does not subscribe to the view of conservatism as a religious movement, and because "the real truth is that many on the Republican right just read everything I write through an anti-gay prism, because their homophobia - benign or not-so-benign, conscious or unconscious - is so overwhelming it occludes any genuine assessment of a person's thoughts outside this fact. See how Forbes cannot even keep the word gay out of quote marks. Just imagine the same sentence with the word "Jewish" replacing the word gay. It tells you everything you need to know about the moral core of conservatism today. It's sad and will one day be seen as embarrassing."[16]

Continued to the next post...
 

Bbucko

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Continued from the previous post...

He is also the author of a book called The Conservative Soul: How We Lost It and How To Get It Back. According to Amazon:

From Publishers Weekly
As editor of the New Republic and on his blog The Daily Dish, Sullivan has been a major conservative voice in U.S. politics for 15 years. Now, he attempts "to account for what one individual person means by conservatism"—not repudiating his former political beliefs but trying to "rescue" modern U.S. political conservatism from "the current [Christian] fundamentalist supremacy" that now dominates it. Sullivan (Love Undetectable) has a breezy, readable style that allows him to address such diverse issues as religious fundamentalism's reliance on "the literal words of the Bible," the "excessive witch-hunt" surrounding Clinton, and the secular Enlightenment foundations of the Constitution. He's most approachable when he writes autobiographically through a critical lens—"Looking back I see this phase of my faith life as a temporary and neurotic reaction to a new and bewildering school environment." But that reflection is not as readily apparent when he makes sweeping pronouncements on politics ("post-modern discourse... opposed basic notions of Western freedom: of speech, of trade, of religion"). Much of the book is a meditation on his own evolving faith as a devout Catholic and will appeal most to readers interested in personal religious evolution. (Oct. 3)
The wiki entry about his time at TNR from 1990-96:

In 1990, Andrew Sullivan, a 28-year-old gay Catholic from Britain, became editor and took the magazine in a somewhat more conservative direction, though the majority of writers remained liberal or neoliberal. Hertzberg soon left the magazine to return to The New Yorker. Kinsley left the magazine in 1996 to found the online magazine Slate.[4]
Sullivan invited Charles Murray to contribute a controversial 10,000-word article that contended blacks may be, as a whole, less intelligent than whites due to genetics. The magazine also published a very critical article about Hillary Clinton's health care plan by Elizabeth McCaughey, an article that Alterman called "the single most influential article published in the magazine during the entire Clinton presidency". However, this article was later shown to be inaccurate and the magazine would later apologize for the story. Sullivan also published a number of pieces by Camille Paglia.[4]
His support for Obama came from many places, including a deep respect for the man and a belief of the potential transcendence that his candidacy offered to the US. His December 2007 essay, Goodybye To All That goes into much better details about his opinion of Obama than I could do justice to.

But he's not the only conservative who supported Obama. My former employer, a political consultant who is as Republican as they come (his website brags about his firm's having once worked for Jesse Helms) voted for Obama. In my employer's case, because McCain showed himself to be unsuited to the demands of the presidency and his utter, complete, total disdain for Mrs Palin.

Intelligent people evolve, Skippy, but don't really change. Andrew Sullivan is still a conservative, my former employer is still a conservative, and I'm still a Anarchist with a deep distrust and horror of authority, but we all support President Obama.
 

Bbucko

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I have.

1.) He supports Obama
2.) He supports HIV+ men engaging in unprotected sex
3.) He supports Gay marriage
4.) He claims to support conservative ideology.

Something doesn't add up here....

He is also one of the "original birthers" who questioned Sarah Palin's motherhood of her son Trig.

So, yeah, I know enough about him to realize that he is either 1) supportive of an ideology that is against his lifestyle or 2) isn't a real conservative.

I know the liberals love him so much it's like "Hey, he agrees with all of our positions - but he SAYS he is a conservative! Yeah, conservatives agree with us!"

Please.

He believes that what two consenting adults do in the privacy of their own lives is of no concern to anyone else. That's actually a very conservative thing, Skippy. I thought it was liberals who assume to know what's best for you. How are the Nanny State and conservativism at all compatible?

He doesn't just support Gay Marriage, he is married. He and his husband have been married for over two years now.

As someone who used to be 60% gay himself, I find your litmus test on conservativism, homosexuality and social issues to be complex, to say the least. Maybe the Log Cabin Republicans will take you in.
 

Ericsson1228d

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What doesn't add up, among other things, is that you're an idiot.

Ah, the hallowed personal attack!

He has never, to my knowledge, supported HIV+ men having unprotected sex, but that's a lovely slur.

I couldn't find an archive of his original blog post (it's moved several times) but the following article outlines how he admitted to the whole HIV+ bareback.

Andrew Sullivan, Overexposed


So, no, not a slur at all. But since you thought that was a "slur," you must find it to be a "negative thing" to say that someone supports HIV+ unprotected sex. So.. does that alter your opinion of Mr. Sullivan at all, since he supports an opinion that you view as "negative"?
 

Bbucko

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I couldn't find an archive of his original blog post (it's moved several times) but the following article outlines how he admitted to the whole HIV+ bareback.

Andrew Sullivan, Overexposed


So, no, not a slur at all. But since you thought that was a "slur," you must find it to be a "negative thing" to say that someone supports HIV+ unprotected sex. So.. does that alter your opinion of Mr. Sullivan at all, since he supports an opinion that you view as "negative"?

Actually, Nick8 and I remain very good friends despite the fact that I am a known, outspoken serosorting barebacker, Skippy. I have mentioned this over and over in my years here at LPSG, and link my blog in my signature that is almost nothing but my ten-part series entitled Deep Inside Mancunt, or Titpig's Adventures in Barebacking: soon to be eleven-part, then finished.

The double "B" in my screenname here is code, Skippy.

Again: I fail to see the conservativism of a prohibitionist, Nanny State approach to the conduct of adults in the privacy of their own homes.
 

Ericsson1228d

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Actually, Nick8 and I remain very good friends despite the fact that I am a known, outspoken serosorting barebacker, Skippy. I have mentioned this over and over in my years here at LPSG, and link my blog in my signature that is almost nothing but my ten-part series entitled Deep Inside Mancunt, or Titpig's Adventures in Barebacking: soon to be eleven-part, then finished.

Just hope your serosorting is accurate and your partners are truthful. HIV transmission is a felony crime in many states.
 

Bbucko

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Just hope your serosorting is accurate and your partners are truthful. HIV transmission is a felony crime in many states.

I am religiously up-front about my status and will not fuck anyone until he's told me that he's poz, too. I may be crazy, but I'm not homicidal :cool:
 

B_Nick8

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Actually, Nick8 and I remain very good friends despite the fact that I am a known, outspoken serosorting barebacker, Skippy.

You and I are just a bit more than "very good friends".

Just hope your serosorting is accurate and your partners are truthful. HIV transmission is a felony crime in many states.

Not to worry, baby. You'll never have to be worried, nor will you be lucky enough, to have the honor of drawing Bbucko's attention in any meaningful sense.

And, by the way, you have no idea what a line you've crossed with that statement. I don't mean this literally, but I could kind of kill you for even alluding to such with respect to him. You clearly have no idea what his story is. Don't do it again.
 
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Ericsson1228d

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You and I are just a bit more than "very good friends".



Not to worry, baby. You'll never have to be worried, nor will you be lucky enough, to have the honor of drawing Bbucko's attention in any meaningful sense.

And, by the way, you have no idea what a line you've crossed with that statement. I don't mean this literally, but I could kind of kill you for even alluding to such with respect to him. You clearly have no idea what his story is. Don't do it again.

Want to bite off my finger? You are the one who called it a slur (term or disparagement), not me.
 

B_Nick8

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Want to bite off my finger? You are the one who called it a slur (term or disparagement), not me.

Not at all, dipshit. I'm not violent. Just letting you know where things stand. You could learn a thing or two if you'd actually listen once in a while and weren't so quick with the retort.
 

Bbucko

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You and I are just a bit more than "very good friends".

Didn't wanna blow any covers there, sweetheart :wink:



Not to worry, baby. You'll never have to be worried, nor will you be lucky enough, to have the honor of drawing Bbucko's attention in any meaningful sense.

And, by the way, you have no idea what a line you've crossed with that statement. I don't mean this literally, but I could kind of kill you for even alluding to such with respect to him. You clearly have no idea what his story is. Don't do it again.

True 'nuf that: I don't think Skippy's really what you'd call Uncle Bbuckles-worthy-grade ass. I go for the swarthy Latinos with child-bearing hips and miserably bitchy attitudes. Other criteria are available to pre-screened and qualified applicants upon request.

The fact that he leaps to conclusions, including the suggestion that I might just possibly be a felony waiting for a victim, did not escape me. But as Skippy knows what's best for me more than even I do, I'm sure it was all done in the spirit of Christian compassion.
 

D_Ireonsyd_Colonrinse

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Nick8:

Eric is the one who gleefully started the September "Taxpayer March on Washington" thread (another chance for mob-mentality protesters to get out their Obama/Hitler signs)

.Largest March on Washington

----------

Eric begins his thread by pretending to be fairminded and balanced:

I decided to cite a UK newspaper website, to avoid the politicization of this report, since FoxNews, etc would be dismissed by many. .

Today, estimates show that nearly TWO MILLION people marched on Washington today to protest Obama, his mandates, and Pelosi.

----------

Wow! Two million!

Unfortunately, that "two million" figure came from a press release written by Dick Armey's FreedomWorks (and picked up by Michelle Malkin), who, along with Glenn Beck, sponsored and promoted this "spontaneous, grassroots event".

Along with the spurious two million figure, a fake aerial photo was distributed that was from a previous march which had nothing at all to do with Obama nor tea parties.

9/12 March 'Tea Party' Photo: False Image Spread By Anti-Reform Activists



ABC News put the number of protesters at between 60 - 70,000. The Fire Dept. gave an early estimate of 60,000, but later revised that number, saying it may have been more than 75,000. After this, FreedomWorks itself, "revised" its original "two million" estimate, and now called it about 600,000.


Most estimates say there were between 70,000 - 100,000 protesters, approximately half the size of your average West Hollywood Halloween Bash. However this IS A FAR CRY FROM TWO MILLION.



Eric has never apologized or retracted his spreading false information. As far as I know, he's still sticking by this fake "two million" estimate, a figure nobody, not even FreedomWorks, believes.
 
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B_Nick8

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I know who little Eric "is", Will. I'm trying to be nicer to him than I'm inclined to be because I'm assuming he's just, um, "young". As in, um, realllly "young". I'm attempting to give him the benefit of the doubt. Patronizing? Assuredlly. I'm sure he won't like it at all. But it's the best I can do. And it's the nicest I can be. Particularly in the face of what he said to Bbucko.

Forgive the little children and all that. You never know. Perhaps there's a chance for him. For instance, I got a really nice pm last night from someone you'd never think, not actually apologizing but we made amends to each other. We'll never agree, but interesting things can happen.

I don't hold out a lot of hope for little E, but let's give him another day or two.
:wink: