Oh Indians...

Discussion in 'Politics' started by B_enzia35, Feb 10, 2012.

  1. B_enzia35

    B_enzia35 New Member

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  2. D_Miranda_Wrights

    D_Miranda_Wrights Account Disabled

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    Unemployed alcoholics in destitute areas don't engage in much personal responsibility. Whiteclay is a complicated issue, as are the moral and legal implications of addiction and the people who take advantage of it. I do not agree with this lawsuit, but I find the Whiteclay people to be morally abhorrent.

    What exactly does "Oh, Indians" have to do with this?
     
  3. B_enzia35

    B_enzia35 New Member

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    It's the Indians, or Native Americans if you like.
     
  4. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    Indians are from India.
    Native Americans are the indigenous people of the USA.
     
  5. hypoc8

    hypoc8 Member

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    By now you ought to know that you have to be PC on here are someone will get their panties in a wad.
     
  6. dandelion

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    And cowboys are to be found everywhere.
     
  7. 1kmb1

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    in WNY the "Native Americans" call their government the Seneca Nation of Indians.
     
  8. dandelion

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    Perhaps the phrase 'native americans' makes non native americans feel less like invaders. If they are all americans, it cant be bad, can it?
     
  9. D_Miranda_Wrights

    D_Miranda_Wrights Account Disabled

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    ay, I wasn't trying to start a debate on "Native American" vs. "Indian"...very few of us object to "Indian" and it only grates me because it's ambiguous.

    Uh, yeah, I wasn't correcting your nomenclature. I was wondering what you possibly meant by "oh, Indians." Obviously they're Indians -- it's an Indian reservation with nearly third-world conditions; virtually no one else lives there. But what does their Indianness have to do with this? How does this reflect on Indians more broadly? Was "oh, Indians" just some sort of empty textual chortle (and, if so, at what?) or were you getting at something?

    Brother, even if you believe it, "the answer is to pull yourself up by your bootstraps" isn't the answer. It's barely even the start of the answer, and perhaps if you realized how difficult it was to figure out an actual answer, you would understand why this tribe is behaving so desperately.
     
    #9 D_Miranda_Wrights, Feb 11, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2012
  10. B_enzia35

    B_enzia35 New Member

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    Well my point was that the tribes are sueing the stores and the town for selling them alcohol. Where is their sense of responsibility to not buy the alcohol in the first place?
     
  11. hypoc8

    hypoc8 Member

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    Why don't you know, it's always somebody elses fault.
     
  12. D_Miranda_Wrights

    D_Miranda_Wrights Account Disabled

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    Fine, but I'd rather you not "oh" my ethnicity as if we were all a part of this, or as if ethnicity were the problem.

    How exactly would you fix the cyclical alcohol problem? Most kids there start drinking in their early teens, before their long-term decisionmaking is fully formed, because their parents do -- and because the unemployment rate is something like 80%. Do you really think saying "the solution is individual responsibility!" helps anything here? Are 12-year-olds raised in an area where half of homes have no indoor plumbing, with poor adult role models, going to pull themselves up by their bootstraps? Not trying to be a dick here. Individual responsibility is great. How do we put these kids in a situation where they have any sense of what individual responsibility is, and what they stand to gain from it, when everything around them is in ruins?

    Unless your overall point is "this people deserve the way they are living because they aren't living otherwise"...then, what exactly is your point?

    Not to be the angry Indian here :D
     
  13. vince

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    I too am interested to hear an explanation for the choice of words used in the title of this thread.
     
  14. fun21

    fun21 New Member

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    I really can't see the OP's use of "Oh Indians" as meaning anything other than, "Oh [typical] Indians." This linked with the article is, I believe, an attempt to make the generalization that all Native people blame their problems on Europeans that settled here, and their descendants.

    To answer the OP's question, responsibility is a difficult thing to have when one is addicted and living in poverty. Since the many members of this tribe have problems with substance abuse the leaders are trying to be responsible for them by removing the problem of alcohol. Suing businesses in Whiteclay may not work as a solution to this problem, in fact the OP may find it laughable, but this does not justify slandering an ethnic group.
     
  15. B_HarryWales

    B_HarryWales New Member

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    For me the term "American" has no real meaning. That is to say the Italians, Irish, and Polish, (though they've been here for generations) call themselves "Italian/Irish/Polish-American". My background is mostly Scottish.
    It goes back for some generations. I've never heard anyone say "I'm Scottish-American". Odd that. :confused:
     
  16. B_enzia35

    B_enzia35 New Member

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    Because an Indian tribe is suing for damages.

    And them wanting to sue the beer companies for their alcoholism is like people suing McDonald's for getting them fat.
     
  17. legna

    legna Member

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    Well put. I have to admit that that "Oh Indians" comment has got my Native American blood boiling too.
     
  18. B_enzia35

    B_enzia35 New Member

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    Sure, banning stuff sure has solved problems. Like Prohibition, when the US got rid of all alcohol in the country. That worked, didn't it?
     
  19. fun21

    fun21 New Member

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    enzia35, I hope you realize that the main point of what I said was not about whether banning alcohol is a viable solution, but that your generalizations and slander are both offensive and ignorant.

    As for your sarcastic comments about the effectiveness of prohibition, no, it didn't get rid of alcohol, but it definitely made it harder to attain. This, I believe is the tribes goal.
     
  20. aninnymouse

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    You do understand that the term "Indian" is, in many quarters pejorative at best, don't you?

    In many, it's considered a slur and an insult, and will get you a beat down.
     
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