Olympic Swimming

Jason

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I guess we've all seen the story of the swimming wins by Ye Shiwen and the claims that they are simply too good to be true - that in effect her times are in themself evidence of drugs. One of the many articles is here.

The IOC has basically told everyone to shut up about this.

The options seem to be that either China has an athlete who is performing above and beyond any previous examples of excellence, or that China has found a drug which has slipped under the radar, and that there is a problem which the drug testing has not picked up.

If there is a drug problem it quite probably goes beyond this one athlete and this one sport. And China does have form for use of illegal drugs.

I imagine we would all LIKE the performance to be genuine and demonstrate what humans can do without drugs. But what do we all THINK?
 
Well - considering her performance was better than the medal winners in the men's event, I think it has to be dodgy.
 
One obviously has to be suspicious. Whether or not any use of illegal substances will be found on the drugs testing depends, I suppose, on the substances being used and whether they are detectable by the available tests.

A problem that I have is that, if there is nothing untoward about the swimmers concerned, it is a terrible thing for them to be falsely accused and undergo a "trial by media". I suppose we need to wait and let the official procedures take their course...
 
A problem that I have is that, if there is nothing untoward about the swimmers concerned, it is a terrible thing for them to be falsely accused and undergo a "trial by media". I suppose we need to wait and let the official procedures take their course...

That's exactly how I feel. Innocent until proven guilty is the way I look at it.
 
Suppose i can always start an unsubstantiated rumour' that team GB ( fr eg) is not doing well on the medals table, because of all the rain they have had, over the last few years ...
or
the type of legal generic (for cost savings) drugs they are taking ..?
 
I don't understand the media frenzy over this. Aren't medallists automatically tested? Plus they keep the samples around to retest up to 8 years afterwards if new or better tests get invented. Also can someone explain why everyone are making a big deal of her going faster than that other guy? Maybe he just didnt do very well plus she didn't even set a new world record so it's not like noone's gone this fast before.
 
I don't understand the media frenzy over this. Aren't medallists automatically tested? Plus they keep the samples around to retest up to 8 years afterwards if new or better tests get invented. Also can someone explain why everyone are making a big deal of her going faster than that other guy? Maybe he just didnt do very well plus she didn't even set a new world record so it's not like noone's gone this fast before.

It wasn't that she was all around faster, but her split on the last 50 of the 400 IM was faster than the "fastest man in the world"
 
An alternative explanation could be that unbeknown to us, athletes reach their highest potential at a much earlier age than hitherto thought and that by age 18 we are already on the downside of the curve. This isn't based on anything scientific, mind you. Just offering a "what if".
 
The only reason this is a thing is because she comes from a country that is officially disapproved of by western media.

Michael Phelps wins more medals than anyone else in history, and no one's going on about some completely unsubstantiated secret substance that he's consuming/injecting.
 
One would be hard-pressed to find a clean world-class athlete. It is the reality, and just because an athlete tests clean does not mean they have not engaged in "unnatural" performance-enhancement in some way. There are some good pharmacists and doctors out there.
 
It sucks that no one understands what it's like to be a world class athlete, even the jackass american coach throwing out the comments apparently.

Yes you'll be incredibly hard to find a world class athlete that is clean of all banned substances.

On the other hand, everyone wants to see better and better performances, and these athletes have gone through so much to be the best in their respective endeavors. I don't understand who the IOC, WADA, FDA, and so on think they are to try and restrain athletes from being as good as they want to be.

Obviously safety is an issue. Therefore there should be universal health testing standards in place. In effect this will better protect the athletes than traditional drug testing would. Unless an athlete were to do something remarkably dumb like OD on stimulants pre-event, their blood measures and hormones would be optimized for better performance. You'd also likely see athletes miss less time due to injury.

To the athletes drugs aren't cheating, they are just part of getting better. See, so many of us started at our sports before we even remember. Then one day comes along where it's time to start competing, then later on, the training sessions intensify, eventually you'll spend more hours a day specializing on certain skills, and adding in proper strength and conditioning for your sport. Further education is added in when needed through specialized coaching, video, etc. Somewhere along the line, we tweak our diets to optimize performance. When you plateau again, eventually you add in drugs to the equation.

It's really just the next progression in seeking our own personal best. Somewhere along the line, it became cheating because someone could make money off vilifying it. Then steroids were banned from OTC sales, and suddenly they're mystified and using steroids is illegal AND "immoral."

Fucking brainwashing by the media makes people think that the only people who have used drugs are those that tested positive (or the people that they tell them used --- Barry Bonds). [/end rant]


Okay for the matter of this swimmer. Is she "on" something? Well what do the men's 50m times look like compared to the final 50m in the 100m race? (This is information I legitimately don't have). Comparing the 50m from the platform to a 50m off the wall may be a completely apples to oranges comparison. Like in track, if you compare the later 100m in a 200m sprint, they should always be faster than a 100m time for the same athlete. (Of course, coming off the wall is a change in direction different than that off a dead start in the 100, but like I said I don't have the information.) So the media could be tugging our chain about a non-story on her 50m split.

However if they aren't, and in a 50m race she's actually beat the men's gold medalist - then yes I would sincerely believe that China has found a new doping agent. I'm not sure how much sense this would make, given that they aren't cleaning up in swimming. If they found something they were confident enough to use in their best woman, you better believe she wouldn't be the only one taking it. (or maybe there are plenty of other athletes accumulating medals since Beijing using the same stuff).

OR that "she" really isn't a woman, and has some kind of "chromosome confusion" - really don't know the term. But it has happened in the past with track. There have been women with male chromosomes.
Women's 800m gold medal favourite Caster Semenya takes gender test hours before World Championship race | Mail Online
(I wonder if Semenya is still competing...)
 
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and it came to pass, that ....


No exemptions, for any countries behaviour ....


'I just crashed, I did it on purpose to get a restart': controversy mars GB sprint


'I just crashed, I did it on purpose to get a restart': controversy mars GB sprint gold

If the chinese wanted to throw a badmitton match, they should have done it in a fashion that didn't cause bad ratings and tarnish to the olympic games.

He was following the rules of his sport by crashing.

Everyone wants to think these athletes are on some kind of moral high ground just because they're in the games. They're not. It's like believing in santa claus. These people have waited years and years just for their sport to be RELEVANT and on TV. You don't work away years and years and years just to fuck up your start and lose because of it.

You claw and scratch for every millisecond. If that means crashing, you crash. The culture of any given sport depends on its athletes. Having played ice hockey for so long, fighting has always been integral to the sport - along with getting rough. Playing in international competition doesn't magically make players friendly to one another, even if you ban fighting in international matches (hint, many fights were worse than anything in the NHL).