Inwood: [quote author=gigantikok link=board=99;num=1067045112;start=0#7 date=10/27/03 at 19:01:14]
Oh please to you too. With people like you juding the quality of a major world leader due to "fun factor", I grow a bit more frightened everyday. And it is also your personal opinion that Bush mislead the country, I happen to disagree with that. THERE IS NO WAY, though, to disagree with the fact that Clinton lied, cheated, and stole. He lied to the country under oath, mysteriously pardoned criminals, shamelessly stole from the White House during the last days of his presidency, and raped a woman (Juanitta Broadrick, who alot of you Clinton lovers will automatically dismiss without questioning her testimony or the facts, of course). So forget the fact that he was a slimey asshole and hardly did his job, he was "fun". SO hey, if we want to vote in "fun" presidents, who's next? O.J Simpson is a pretty charming guy too, maybe he should run for office with voters like you out there...[/quote]
Obviously you're an easily frightened and timid soul. "People like me" -- hmm -- there is no reason a leader can't or shouldn't be "fun." I wasn't judging his quality as a leader by that term. But you obviously are. You have a lot of hate in you. He's not really worth that much invective. He was only a president and like all others one day will be dust just like you and me.
It may or may not be my personal opinion that Bush misled the country. That will depend on whether we are able to see all the relevent information that supposedly led to the decision to go to war. And the Bush admin. is not exactly known for letting people access information that is possibly embarrassing to them much less that could be treasonous or impeachable.
As far as I can tell from my post I never said that Clinton didn't mislead the country about his indescretions with that woman-Ms. Lewinsky. But generally those types of affairs are handled between husband and wife. Not used as political weapons. (It's also interesting to note that during all of the impeachment proceedings, etc. several leaders of the opposition were boffing someone on the side that wasn't their wife) If that is the new standard let's go after Jeb Bush's drug addicted daughter to show Jeb's unfit for his job since he can't even control his kids. That's really a poor way to judge someone. Reference history - a lot of leaders have less then sterling personal lives. Doesn't mean they can't lead.
As to pardons, most presidents have a pardon or two that they're not too proud off. Some have many. But hey, it's in the constitution and nobody's decided we need to take it away. And since it's up to his discretion who he decides to pardon there is nothing mysterious about it. There is no such thing as a stealth pardon.
As to items leaving the White House well Bushs I, Reagans, etc. all seemed to have items turn up where they weren't suppose to be.
As to Ms. Broadrick all I would say is bring it to court. Press charges. The republicans are in charge all over the place. I'm sure some venue can be found to try it. But if they don't well don't blame me if I don't immediately condemn Clinton. Last I looked "innocent until proven guilty." Additonally you assume because I said Clinton was fun that I loved him. I'm ambivalent at best. I think he could have done a lot of good things but his hubris about certain things led him to squander a great opportunity.
It's also amazing that even though most of what he got done was really just republican lite you can't stand it that he got the credit for it. Face it he out manuever the best the republicans had.
I don't like or trust Bush II but surprisingly I think Rumsfeld has really good ideas about reforming our armed forces and just hope Bush backs him with some of his political capital so at least one good thing happens on his watch.
-www.buzzflash.com/analysis/03/10/ana03004.html and here's something thoughtful from the ever-polite, ever-forgiving opposition-www.safesearching.com/billmaher/blog/archives/000101.html, and here is how one celebrity is being treated by the Ashcroft crew-www.post-gazette.com/localnews/20030912chong0912p5.asp. This all following so closely on the heels of Bill Bennett's credibility demise must have given rise to betting pools somewhere on who's next- "Dude, "Scooter" Libby is obviously a tweaker. He's always flying. I've known guys like that. Why do you think they call him "Scooter"? Rumsfeld's a basehead from way back, and Wolfowitz spends most weekends in a K-hole. Someone I know like totally parties with his dealer. Supposedly Cheney is into synthetic psilocybin, but only once or twice a month, and he's really stringent about the "set and setting"." ??? 8)