Pederasty - natural or unnatural

B_Italian1

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In this case it's explicitly stated at the outset. They both knew what the score was and I find something refreshingly honest in that.

I guess that's what confuses me, Jason. When this older man finds a young guy who's down and out, does he explicitly state that he will provide all the comforts he's been lacking in exchange for sex? Or does he take him in and then kind of see where it goes? It seems kind of cruel in a way.

If the older man states from the outset that he requires sex from the young guy, and the young guy doesn't want to do that, he's left homeless. And if sex is not mentioned as part of the equation up front, and the guy moves in and refuses the older man's advances, then what? Is he booted out on the street again?
 

Freddie53

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In this particular instance that Jason has presented us with, there are too many variables out there we don't know the answers too.

1, The actual age of the young man. If he is 18, 16 in some localities then, it is legal. The morality of the situation is dependent on the morality of the person making the jdugement.

2. We do not know how this relationship began. Did the older man find the boy and have sex with him and then invite him to come live with him? Without knowing this piece of information, it is extremely difficult to make a judgement here.

3. Is osme of the "this is awful" also a part of not accepting homosexuality? Older men take girls as wives all the time. Very few people speak up about it though as being reprehensible and other choice words. It doesn't seem to me we use the same mroal compass with striaght as we do with gay older/younger relationships.

4. There apparently are teen and early twenties guys who want a daddy who also has a sexual relationship. It may be because that is what they have had in the past They get sex confused with love. I don't know, but as long as young gay men long for a sexual daddy, this relationship will also continue to be a one engaged in whether we like it or not.

5. Assumptions are being made that the young men are being forced into this relationship. in truth, these guys may be looking for this kind of relationship, which begs the question, are they really being abused in this situation?

I am not defending this type of relationship as being good, wholesome etc. However, if the younger man is legal in the locality he is in, that makes a difference. If the young man was having to be a prostitute and then one older man takes him in and has what appears to be true loving sexual relationship, the young man is going to believe the old man really loves him and will forever.

There is one part of this that no one has addressed that might be very telling on the part of the older guy. That is, the sexual relationship with the guys seems to end when the younger guy is completely a grown mature man. And the older guy is getting newer guys in the age group he is attracted to. This might give more reason for alarm than anything else mentioned.

I appear to be on both sides. I am not. I am trying to sort out just how this works. Can it be a true morally right thing to happen or is this relationship always wrong regardless of the circumstances?

There are all kinds of sexual attractions. The concept that some young men are indeed sexually attracted to older gentlemen and seek out a daddy/lover is a concept that is probably true. How do we we as a society deal with it may be the next big issue that we have to face as a society.
 

Male Bonding etc

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Freddie, another thoughtful post. I share your reservations and concerns, I think.

Age differences, when all involved have attained the age of consent, should not impede people from finding love and intimacy. Furthermore, young people need to learn about love and to feel valued.

I am confident that there must be people who were loved by and sexually intimate with older lovers when they were underage and who were actually the better for it. I am also confident that there have been people who were in sexually intimate situations with older people when underage who feel abused, confused, angry, misled, and damaged. I doubt that there's really a way to get an accurate count for either group.

So, my sense of what should happen is that we should go out of our way to interact with and value young people. Let them feel loved, respected, understood by people who are not trying to seduce them so that they do not confuse sex with love, respect, and understanding.
 

D_Gunther Snotpole

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I am confident that there must be people who were loved by and sexually intimate with older lovers when they were underage and who were actually the better for it. I am also confident that there have been people who were in sexually intimate situations with older people when underage who feel abused, confused, angry, misled, and damaged. I doubt that there's really a way to get an accurate count for either group.

So, my sense of what should happen is that we should go out of our way to interact with and value young people. Let them feel loved, respected, understood by people who are not trying to seduce them so that they do not confuse sex with love, respect, and understanding.

Thank you, Male Bonding. This is exactly what I have wanted to say.
 

B_Italian1

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In this particular instance that Jason has presented us with, there are too many variables out there we don't know the answers too.

Exactly. That's why I questioned it.

The actual age of the young man. If he is 18, 16 in some localities then, it is legal.

True.

We do not know how this relationship began. Did the older man find the boy and have sex with him and then invite him to come live with him? Without knowing this piece of information, it is extremely difficult to make a judgement here.

That's what I asked earlier. It seems that if the young man didn't want a sexual relationship he'd be back out on the street again.

Assumptions are being made that the young men are being forced into this relationship. in truth, these guys may be looking for this kind of relationship, which begs the question, are they really being abused in this situation?

They're not forced but if they don't put out are they thrown out? From what I've read, yes. The older man is offering a lot to the younger one, and sex is expected in return.

There is one part of this that no one has addressed that might be very telling on the part of the older guy. That is, the sexual relationship with the guys seems to end when the younger guy is completely a grown mature man. And the older guy is getting newer guys in the age group he is attracted to. This might give more reason for alarm than anything else mentioned.

That's what I found most troubling. I know this isn't pedophilia, but once children reach a certain age, pedophiles are no longer interested and look for new blood. This older man appears to have age limits. Everything he's doing is completely legal, but is it morally okay? That depends on how you look at it.
 

jason_els

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Most daddy/boy relationships do have a natural end to them as the boy becomes more mature. The boy outgrows the daddy and leaves home to explore the world, become his own man, and find relationships more equal.

Many of these kids had abusive or distant fathers so they never felt their masculinity was validated, that they were truly men. These kinds of relationships can instill that feeling, giving these young men self-esteem and direction. It is not unusual that the relationships continue even after the young men leave home and, as in this case, the other previous boys become like brothers, and the feeling is one like family. Sometimes it's the only family these young men have.