Pelosi + Obama = Disaster for Americans & the Auto Industry

Discussion in 'Politics' started by 1BiGG1, Nov 9, 2008.

  1. 1BiGG1

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    Reid, Pelosi Urge Treasury to Extend Aid to Automakers

    Let’s watch this unfold ….

    ….. as in the next several months the domestic auto industry will get a much needed bailout but under the direction of the liberals it will be a Band-Aid that will ultimately fail as the liberals will not ensure the auto industry gets rid of its real problem being the UAW and legacy costs.

    Like United Airlines did when it got rid of antiquated pay systems/obligations recently, the auto industry needs the same but the wacky democrats in-charge are just gonna end up costing us all big money and not fix the real problem.

    Fucking liberals that spend my money pandering to the cause instead of the problem will sum this up soon, and I’m sure this will only be the start. :rolleyes:
     
  2. D_Rod Staffinbone

    D_Rod Staffinbone Account Disabled

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    i guess you won't be satisfied until kids are working in coal mines again and no one gets a paid sick day off and no one gets employer healthcare and no one gets a paid vacation day. that is what unions accomplished in this country. you
    are so brainwashed by corporate spin.

    oh, and btw, united is the largest employee owed company in the world, isn't that socialism to you?
     
    #2 D_Rod Staffinbone, Nov 9, 2008
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2008
  3. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    The benefits provided under unions were helpful in protecting our workers for years. However, the labor costs associated with union benefits have priced us our of the market in most manufacturing industries.

    Its critical to adapt and adjust to changing market conditions, and our manufacturing co's, namely auto, are handcuffed by these costs.
     
  4. D_Rod Staffinbone

    D_Rod Staffinbone Account Disabled

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    make a good product and americans will buy it. it's the executive brains that have been handcuffed by their own doing for 30 years. stop blaming the workers and things might get better for you execs. car company execs used to come up through the ranks, now right to the top with a MBA, totally clueless about how cars get made.

    maybe robots can take over the whole organization. they don't get union benefits or golden parachutes. hmm, but
    then who is going to have the cash to buy these products?
     
    #4 D_Rod Staffinbone, Nov 9, 2008
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2008
  5. 1BiGG1

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    Not even, I will be happy when a level-playing-field exists between foreign auto manufacturers and domestics in the North American market.

    I’m not saying workers should not get a reasonable wage, I’m saying they should get a wage dictated by the market, not a union with the power to hold a company hostage with unfair wages.
     
  6. mindseye

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    *Yawn* Another attack on things that haven't even happened. 1BiGG1, come join the reality-based community. We have cookies.
     
  7. wispandex_bulge

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    Government ownership is socialism...employee ownership is just good common sense. Shouldnt the employees have the strongest voice in how a company is run?

    As for the UAW, when Ford and GM go bankrupt because the cant afford to pay their line workers, then who will the union go crying to? AFLCIO wont help because they only help unions that are funnel money to them. Many unions today are nothing more than pyramid schemes. I will admit that there are still places today where a union could improve the conditions for certain workers who are taken advantage of (customer service agents for one), but the majority of unions only want more money.
     
  8. beretta8

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    Anticipating the worst from peoples one is not fond of is fun!:rolleyes:

    I'd like a cookie....:biggrin1:
     
  9. wispandex_bulge

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    What he describes coudl become a reality. Are you so blind to ignore what could be? Besdies, regardless of whether you think this is a likely outcome or not, if you think this is a bad outcome (limping along of a broken industry) then shouldnt we take steps to avoid that outcome?
     
  10. 1BiGG1

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    Reality-based you ain’t and not interested in what you call cookies as its really Kool Aid you are serving and I’m certainly not drinking it! :wink:
     
  11. D_Rod Staffinbone

    D_Rod Staffinbone Account Disabled

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    we are now all competing with the wages of chinese "slave" labor.
    don't hold your breath for a level playing field anytime soon.
    china's labor force organizing for better working conditions and better pay
    (unions?) along with u.s. ingenuity will help level the field.
     
  12. wispandex_bulge

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    Star has a point. Unions were formed originally to improve the working conditions for groups of people who were being abused by their employers. Much of that job is now done by OSHA and related entities. Gotta love the alphabet soup of the American federal government.

    Now, unions primarily operate over wage discrepancies. I would say that other than the recent writer's strike in TV land, majority of strikes in teh last ten or twenty years have been about wages, and obviously the unions purse trumps the employees purse which in turn trumps the employers purse and industry health.
     
  13. 1BiGG1

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    Domestics lead in many categories and compete in quality, plus its not like foreign manufactures have a lack of business at dealership service departments.

    Blaming executives is not the answer, the answer is getting rid of antiquated costs. China which recently overtook Europe as the number 2 auto market is a good example; General Motors is the number 1 import and number 1 manufacturer there and very profitable. Why is that? Because General Motors gets to play on an even playing field in China.
     
  14. wispandex_bulge

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    As a side note, people who are quick to judge Bush, republicans, and captalism forget that our free market is that only in name. There are many regulations in place which limit truly free market principles for taking hold. For example, minimum wage puts an artifical floor on wages. I understand the need for minimum wage when there are immigrants, legal and illegal, who are willing to work for a fraction of what most americans are willing and able to work for. Also, free markets should allow for monopolies (one seller many buyers) and monopsonies (one buyer manny sellers). The American government has a strong anti-monopoly slant. In today's market, most things end up beign econommies of scale, and the largest companies are too topheavy. Shouldnt the market take care of companies that are two big for their own britches? Shouldnt smaller and fresher start-ups grow to accomodate the market demand? I like to think of the free market as a forest, where occaisionally, lightning strikes, and fires happen. Its necessary to burn the canopy in order to allow new growth on the floor.
     
  15. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    My favorite flavor of THE Kool-Aid is grape........although lemon-lime is a close second.
     
  16. mindseye

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    What he's done, wispandex, is cited a link to a news article in an attempt to establish credibility, and then provided a negative spin without referring to any of the specifics of the article.

    If "what he describes could become a reality", and he made a serious case for that with reference to specific details that have emerged from the story, I'd respond quite differently.

    But
    I don't consider it "blindness" to dismiss every time 1BiGG1 hollers "the sky is falling". It's legitimate to distinguish between analysis and spin.
     
  17. D_Rod Staffinbone

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    no one can built cars fast enough for the booming chinese economy.
    GMs trucks, not selling well here, are being shipped over to china.
    i'm not sure who in china makes enough to buy them. there is a chinese middle class evolving, i doubt if it includes the factory workers. i could be wrong about that.
     
  18. 1BiGG1

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    I don’t think you understand what I am talking about. Forget about anything offshore, foreign owned labels pay much less per unit manuactured here on our soil.

    Domestics need the ability to level this playing field and the only way to do that is make foreign labels pay part of domestics legacy costs and pay the same wages, or let domestics get rid of legacy costs (like United Airlines recently did) and pay equal wages.
     
  19. 1BiGG1

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    Make no mistake; I’m certain you bath in it as well! :biggrin1:
     
  20. wispandex_bulge

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    You dont take into account media spin or lack of spin. DO you honestly think that the same media which has pushed Obama from no-name to President-elect is going to talk about teh possible negative consequences of his policies. This is where you are blind.
     
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