People...we're Getting Screwed!

[D_Martin van Burden]

Frankly, I don't care who to blame. Blaming doesn't really solve anything. I just know that the local news publishes or televises a story related to increased gas prices and oil bulletins every few days ago. Gas, oil, and politics all keep people talking, and some of that is relevant to Bush.

I have spent an unprecedented $150 in gas so far this month, and that's driving a fuel-efficient car. It wasn't that long ago that I swore not to buy gasoline if it crept over $2.00 a gallon. Now I'm pushing $3.00 and, like it or not, I have to drive many miles a day in commute. I'm currently job searching for some local full-time, consistent help. (Insurance sales, needless to say, isn't for me.)

It's tough. Some people actually mean it when they say that they go broke trying to work for a living. I can believe that. It's hard to put food in your mouth, clothes on your back, AND gas in your tank on a $7.00 per hour job. It's hard to commute back and forth if you have to trust mass transit. It's almost impossible to live comfortably on a steady wage if daily living costs are shooting upward to the moon.

I really don't give a damn about what goes on in foreign countries, because it's hell trying to live and work here.

Similarly, a crash course in economics isn't going to help much either. Supply, demand, surplus, revenue, cost-benefit analysis -- I really don't know how they're going to help stretch that hard-earned dollar, I just don't.

 

[jakeatolla]

Hey, up here in canada its over a dollar a litre. Which translates to
roughly 4 dollars a gallon!!!!

God damn oil companies should be bombed back into the stone age.

 

[Chuck64]

Hey, up here in canada

But you deserve to get screwed. You're Canadian.

 

[D_Herin_Ghan]

But you deserve to get screwed. You're Canadian.

Chuck, thank you for putting a bright spot on a pretty crappy day.

 

[Chuck64]

Chuck, thank you for putting a bright spot on a pretty crappy day.

No problem. FYI - Gas was $2.719/gallon on the south side of San Antonio earlier today.

 

[jakeatolla]

But you deserve to get screwed. You're Canadian.

Says the ignorant redneck.....

 

[D_Herin_Ghan]

No problem. FYI - Gas was $2.719/gallon on the south side of San Antonio earlier today.

I drove past a sign that read $3.05 on my way back to PSU this past weekend. It scorched my retina.

 

[Orlando_8]

I beg to differ
"Tax Cut= more money in peoples pocket= higher aggregate demand= larger GDP. Makes sense? Who has the most money? Richer people. What will they do with it? Spend. What happens? Lower price level, increased business transaction, possible increase in gov't spending programs, better standard of living as a whole."
This has its the basis in supply side economics… Look to the 1980’s Reagonomics as it was called.. These people took the money and ran.. When 40% of your economy is based in your middle income families .. Why take the money away from them..

"64% of our federal budget currently goes to Social Security, Medicare and other welfare programs."
If the money had been left in these programs instead of tagging them as surplus and ”tax cuts” then syphoned off you wouldn’t have to worry about putting it back + interest..

Oil companies have less incentive to sell their gas if they know other companies are doing the same exact thing, and are under the same exact regulations. Result= decreased profits and competition, cost cutting, less pumping of oil. AKA SHORTAGE.

When you allow mergers an acquisitions to cut the number of companies to 3 or 4 with NO competition, Price fixing can occur

Case in point of what I was talking about before. Bush does not control prices. Gripe about his foreign policy all you want, it's absolutely terrible. However, you can't blame him for everything. There is a limit on presidential power, he doesn't make these prices.

But when govt turns a blind eye to corrupt practices and actually promotes such practices You get what you pay for

Also, surpluses are not always a good thing. We would naturally prefer a balanced budget. But since WWII. I believe if memory serves we have had only one budget surplus, and it was an unexpected one. The Clinton budget surplus was a good thing because it was unexpected, and allowed for the government to spend more money next fiscal year. Long term surpluses mean tax money is not being put to proper use. Defecit spending is typically used to stimulate aggregate demand, it's a tool of discretionary fiscal policy.

You’ve cut discretionary income…how can you have a discretionary fiscal policy..

You are promoting supply side economics.. A Republican cover for something that has proved can't and never will work..

 

[bigschlotsky]

Gas in America is way too cheap. When I see gas prices skyrocket here in America I jump for joy. No, I don't enjoy paying more. But if I look beyond my own nose for a moment, I can see that the only way this country is ever going to stop spewing crud into the atmosphere, and seriously developing and using cleaner feuls, is if using gas gets too expensive. So people - the planet is dying and our indifference is killing it. We drive polluting SUVs. We drive down the street instead of walking. We elect politicians who don't care if the earth is destriyed. We're short-sighted, self-absorbed, and we don't really believe that adding another 2 or 3 degrees to the temperature of the Earth will matter. But add another 2 or 3 degrees and Los Angeles, New York and London will be underwater, nobody will be able to go outside without UV-blocking sunscreen, and the warmer ocean temps. will kill off oxygen-producing plankton meaning we're all going to suffocate.
So what I'm saying, is long live higher gas prices.

 

[findfirefox]

This is why I stopped driving, I'm not rich and the Light Rail (Commuter Train)(Runs above ground on city streets)(A choo choo) runs behind my apartments and my work gives me a discount (I think I pay about 50 a month) to use the whole system, it works for me, but some people aren't so luckily... I feel bad for them...

I think its averaging like 2.50 here in Portland, OR... If you live in the metro I say you get pass for your transit (If it can work for you)

but, do you see some weird things on public transportation...

 

[rob_just_rob]

Do what I did. Take lots of public transit and buy petroleum/resource stocks.

 

[AlteredEgo]

Indeed.....but compared to Europe (about $8.10 or $6.40 adjusting for US gallons in the UK) you have comparatively cheap fuel....although I agree they are about the highest they have ever been for you in real terms. More sales=more tax revenue

I never understood oil executive salaries...I mean it's got to be about the easiest job in the world. Sales pitch goes something like...

"That gauge in your car....when the needle goes into the red...buy some petrol." Easy, peasy! Can I have my $1million salary now please...?:tongue:

Now actual Gas prices here are skyrocketing

You can't really compae our fuel costs to yours. Our lives do not cost the same. Property tax in my neighborhood (certainly not the highest in my area) is $9K a year. Water is over $200 a quarter. Water! Gas/electric is $400 a month in my house (we pay to heat the tennants' apartment and hot water in addition to our own). It costs $45 to fill my tank from just below a quarter tank. Insurance? The broker says I'm going up to $1700 for six months for liability only! Medical insurance? I make too much for a discount, and not enough to really afford it comfortably. $800 a month (almost) for me, a non-smoking, 26 year old woman with no children and no diseases. I do have PCOS but this is the cost of my insurance from way before that diagnosis. I wonder what it will shoot up to now that i have been diagnosed with a syndrome. Wanna go clubbing? Well, since I'm a lady, I can get in for half price most places before 1AM, so figure $12-15. Three drinks, $34, plus $6 in tips. After hours spot to soak up booze with food. $10-25. Cab home, $20-50. Did we eat out before hitting the club? Add $25-65. Now double all of those figures for our combined total. Now try not to worry too much about the $9000 property tax. And fill up my tank again so my grandmother can see her doctors. Don't worry. We don't have to spend $200 on a few hours' entertainment again soon. We have pictures from the club! Add another $10. At least there was no sales tax for the photos. That's at nearly 9%.

 

[Thedrewbert]

There is much debate on this issue in this country. However, I'm trying to stay economic and not go political here. First things first....trickle down is a complete misnomer. That's not what happens at all. What happens is that all benefit from this tax cut in one way or another (in theory). The tax cut will filter to all in terms of price level. When taxes are cut for corporations and the like, they can afford to charge less for products in order to achieve the same revenue. As a result, prices go down and a new equilibrium is reached in the economy. Companies can also produce MORE goods. Consumers have the ability to purchase more as wel due to the lower prices levied by companies and the like. As a result, GDP increases, so does standard of living.

Because of the lack of signifigant competition between the conglomerates today, there is no reason for companies to lower prices. If they get a big tax cut, that's just more profit for them. They'll rarely lower prices based on that. Think about it, after the Bush tax cut, did you see any price decrease in the price of toothpaste or cereal or whatever?

No, you want to increase spending in this country? Put the tax cut squarely in the hands of the <generally> least financially responsible people in the country, the lowest wage earners.

 

[DC_DEEP]

...When taxes are cut for corporations and the like, they can afford to charge less for products in order to achieve the same revenue. As a result, prices go down and a new equilibrium is reached in the economy....

So goes the theory, anyway. The problem that enters the big picture is this: Too many of the corporations receive the tax cuts, but instead of passing that savings on to the consumer, they simply pad the profits and compensations for those few at the top, hence the million-dollar bonuses that the execs receive, and multi-million dollar retirement packages.

No, bush and his administration don't set prices, but there are price-gouging laws in effect which are not being enforced regarding the petroleum industry. (The following example is used only for demonstration purposes, they numbers do not reflect actual exact numbers Have you ever noticed that say, there is a $1 increase in the price of a barrel of crude oil mid-day, the price at the pump is increased 5 cents within one hour? By close of business, the price has gone back down by that same $1, but the price at the pump will go down 2 cents tomorrow, and will take a month to trickle back down the full 5 cents? Yeah, a couple of cents per gallon does not sound like much, but nationwide, it amounts to a huge surge of profit for the company.

Comparing European petroleum prices to US petroleum prices is a bit unfair. Finding the perfect balance between available salaries and affordable housing is tricky, and commuting to work is a necessity for many. When my partner and I decided to buy a home instead of renting an apartment, we had to consider our combined salaries and decide on a price range we could afford. Unfortunately, that also meant factoring in the availability of public transportation and commute time/cost. To get something within about 15 minutes of work, the homes were in the $750,000 to $900,000 range. We ended up about 15 miles farther out, but the nearest light rail station is 10 miles away; the only bus is a commuter line, with 3 AM runs between 6:30 and 8:40, and 4 PM runs between 4:00 and 6:30. The 10 mile drive to the train station takes 20 to 30 minutes, and driving all the way in to work (20 miles) takes over an hour. All this, to get a house that was only $500,000. The point of this rambling is that, horrible as it is, the people who make LESS money are the ones forced to spend MORE on gasoline... Biking is not a very good option, as the roads are just not set up for it, and it becomes too dangerous for commuting. I can't wait until we can both retire, sell this place, and buy a plot of land out in the sticks away from the traffic. But for now, we are stuck in a situation that demands way more petroleum usage than I am really comfortable with.

 

[Dr Rock]

suck it down, bitches. serves you all right for buying cars and propping up the global oil monopoly to begin with. we should have outgrown our need for this increasingly broken system decades ago.

and this goes for everyone, not just americans. at least they've had the poor excuse, up until recently, that gas was cheap enough to use. in europe, it's ALWAYS been impossibly expensive, and yet hundreds of millions of retards are STILL buying it every day.

 

[AlteredEgo]

suck it down, bitches. serves you all right for buying cars and propping up the global oil monopoly to begin with. we should have outgrown our need for this increasingly broken system decades ago.

and this goes for everyone, not just americans. at least they've had the poor excuse, up until recently, that gas was cheap enough to use. in europe, it's ALWAYS been impossibly expensive, and yet hundreds of millions of retards are STILL buying it every day.

What is your brilliant solution for the average American Joe?

 

[Dr Rock]

What is your brilliant solution for the average American Joe?

quit whining and start cycling

 

[Sabln7]

The brilliant solution for the average Joe is to vote out every sitting Congressman and office holder who is on the ballot in November. Put new faces in there and let them know that if things aren't handled correctly, they will go.

As far as economics, I have lived through several "trickle-down" theorists...all Republicans--in my 61 years. I have yet to be trickled on. Oddly enough, when Democrats are in office, I always do better. Hey, maybe I am wrong, and it just needs time to trickle down to me. But at 61, I don't have much time. I am going to vote all of the SOB's out. I hope everyone else does too.

 

[mgtihlah]

As far as economics, I have lived through several "trickle-down" theorists...all Republicans--in my 61 years. I have yet to be trickled on. Oddly enough, when Democrats are in office, I always do better. Hey, maybe I am wrong, and it just needs time to trickle down to me.

I don't think it's just your imagination. There's some good evidence to back up why you feel that way. See here: http://www.eriposte.com/economy/other/demovsrep.htm

And to respond to LINittanyLion's "rose-colored-glasses" economic theories that aren't actually happening after 6 years of this President:

"...while corporate profits hit a record $1.35 trillion last year, companies have been stubbornly reluctant to reinvest those earnings. With profits up 65 per cent since 2001, capital investments have declined by 4.5 per cent. And though that has fuelled a surge in the stock market, broader financial measures like wage growth have stalled."

From this rather informative article: http://www.macleans.ca/topstories/politics/article.jsp?content=20060417_125323_125323

 

[Chuck64]

Says the ignorant redneck.....

It's called "sarcasm"

And FWIW I'm not a redneck, just raised by a few of them.