Perceptions of success fulfillment

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by Drifterwood, Nov 15, 2007.

  1. Drifterwood

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    Can you order these in priority of importance for achieving happiness?

    Health
    Family and Friends
    Wealth
    Education
    Faith in God
    Safety
    Freedom
     
  2. findfirefox

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    Freedom
    Safety
    Health/Family & Friends (Mental health involves social aspects)
    Education
    Wealth
    Faith in God.
     
  3. Blocko

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    Family and Friends (even if you lose your health, they're there for you)
    Health (it's hard to be happy when you're coughing up blood)
    Education (freedom, safety, wealth and health all flow from it)
    Freedom (you need some to be happy)
    Safety (I often don't like to be safe, live outside the comfort zone)
    Wealth (I know some damn happy poor students and some miserable rich guys)
    Faith in God (but I'm agnostic, so yeah...)
     
  4. findfirefox

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    Its hard to remember and feel love from your family if you're not given to the freedom to have one or ever meet them...
     
  5. Not_Punny

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    I share Bucko's sentiments, but I would also add HUMOR just above education. It helps if you don't take things too seriously, and heaven knows some books/teachers/classes are outrageous. :wink:
     
  6. ManlyBanisters

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    Freedom



    Family and Friends
    Safety
    Health
    Education
    Faith in God



    Wealth

    (gaps are intentional)
     
  7. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    kind of depends what you mean.
    Health... you mean as opposed to being born with AIDS and progeria?
    Wealth... as opposed to living on the street in Calcutta?
    Safety... as opposed to living in constant fear for your life?
    Freedom... as opposed to being sold into slavery as a child prostitute?

    Taken to their opposite extreme all of those things could be pretty important.

    I also think ordering them, since the definition of each of the above terms is so subjective, is pretty pointless.

    I do have a couple thoughts, though.

    Wealth can be very important to happiness, if you are smart about it. If you surround yourself with other people who are just as wealthy as you are, it will mean nothing to you. If you are irresponsible with your wealth, it will probably be a source of misery and stress for you. So it depends on the person. If you have to work to achieve your wealth, you'll also probably appreciate it more. Especially if you keep the same friends.

    Education and intelligence can actually be quite detrimental to happiness. In general, the smarter and better informed you are, the more likely you are to realize how pointless and fucked the entire world is and the more likely you are to spend large chunks of your life depressed or despondent. On the other hand, a high-school diploma or college degree can both be a big help in finding a job that you actually enjoy doing.

    Faith in God I believe to be extremely detrimental to personal happiness. It won't seem that way when you still have your faith... but lose it, come to grips with that loss, and reevaluate who you are and what you want out of life... and I think most will realize like I did that you are much better off and much happier than you were when you still had your faith. Though again, it can depend largely on the person. Some people just don't have the drive to work toward self-actualization without a book or spiritual leader telling them exactly what to do to get there.
     
  8. conchis

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    Family and Friends
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    Safety

    true happiness doesn't include the need of any god
     
  9. ManlyBanisters

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    Holy Fuck that's a fairly condescending attitude - even for you! Did you mean it to sound lke that?

    Speaking as someone who was raised in a non-denominational household and has gone in the other direction I completely disagree. I am so much more at ease with myself and happier since getting to grips with God and my faith. I don't want to sound all born again - because I'm not, I had this faith all along - I just denied it til I was in my mid twenties, to my detriment, I might add. Having a spiritual faith does not mean one needs a book or spiritual leader telling one how to achieve self-actualisation, or anything else for that matter. Most faiths have a lot of room for personal interpretation and are a lot less stiff than people give them credit for. Also, most people with a strong faith will tell you that the minutia of that faith is a deeply personal and specific thing. No two people have the same belief in God.

    OK - you are happier since you cast off whatever spiritual system you feel was imposed upon you - maybe you felt it constrained you - maybe it did. We are all unique and you just can't apply your model to everyone anymore than I can tell you you are a poorer person for not accepting the things I believe in. I might think that (I don't actually, but I might) but I have no right to assume you would be happier with my spiritual outlook. I think most people here would be fairly disgusted at me if I said such a thing - and rightly so.

    So you throw your "it can depend largely on the person" qualifier in there - but then you insult everyone with any spiritual faith with "ome people just don't have the drive [...]". Again - I could say something along the lines of some people just don't have the moral integrity to take a spiritual framework and mold it to themselves and themselves to it - but I think several people would pounce on me for it - and I wouldn't blame them.

    In short, you may be a highly intelligent and well reasoned individual with strong confidence in your own beliefs but that doesn't make everybody of differing beliefs wrong.
     
  10. Drifterwood

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    You're not rich are you Nic?

    TBH, this post doesn't read like you at all.
     
  11. IntoxicatingToxin

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    Family/Friends
    Health
    Safety
    Freedom
    Education
    Faith in God
    Wealth

    For me personally, of course.
     
  12. agnslz

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    Freedom
    Family and Friends
    Safety
    Health
    Education
    Wealth
    Faith in God
     
  13. earllogjam

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    This is what I'd like to believe would lead to happiness in an ideal existance.

    Family and Friends
    Health
    Education
    Safety
    Freedom
    Faith in God
    Wealth



    But actually you need your own house in order to give and get happiness IMO:

    Freedom
    Faith in God (spiritual life)
    Safety
    Health
    Wealth
    Family and Friends
    Education
     
  14. Ethyl

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    Family and Friends - prefer to lump this in with "relationships" in general. My loved ones are my raison d'etre.

    Heath - can't do or enjoy much without it.

    Freedom and Safety are one and the same for me.

    Faith in God: Important as i'm pondering the mysteries of the universe at the moment and knowing that it's okay not to know all the answers right now, if ever.

    Education: Aside from experience, I know of no better way to broaden my horizons.

    Wealth: I define this as the abundance of blessings in my life whether or not they are related to money. Money can always be found unlike other things in life. Money can pave the way for positive opportunities and things, but can give people the illusion that it will buy them a soul, a brain, character, compassion, etc.
     
  15. 36DD

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    Being that all these things are subjective to one's own experiences, I'll answer according to mine:
    Faith in God: Without it I could not have survived some awful situations in my life...my faith gave me hope, which in turn gave me drive.
    Family and Friends: They have been a source of contention at times but are still a rock for me to lean on, and in my darkest of days have proved to be worthy of my trust and love.
    Freedom: I can't even begin to tell you how important is is to me to have the freedom to think for myself, the freedom to empower myself, the freedom to make choices.
    Education: Without freedom, there cannot be a true source from which to draw information that helps us to know more about the world and others, or enable us to have the power to be able to make a difference.
    Safety: I have never lived in a state of war or poverty, I have seen cruelty in my own life though, but that is where my faith comes in.
    Wealth: In my darkest moments, the fact that I have money has never wiped away the tears, it is my faith and family that have helped me. My monetary wealth can help others so I always just consider it something on loan from God...it is not mine.
     
  16. D_Gunther Snotpole

    D_Gunther Snotpole Account Disabled

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    Health: With poor health, you can't enjoy much. (But hard to rank because poor health/bad health form a continuum, and one might be a bit closer to the poor-health end without losing all capacity to enjoy life.)

    Family and Friends: One must be socially connected, have others to provide a reflection of oneself.

    Safety: Continuum factor again. But if you feel constantly imperiled, life is obviously no fun.

    Wealth: Ambiguous, again. No great amount of wealth is necessary, but you must have enough so that the need for money doesn't condition everything else.

    Freedom: If you can't control your own life to a reasonable degree, you won't be happy. But it's possible to define control in many ways. Was it Gandhi who said he could be perfectly free in jail? I believe it's possible ... for people like him.

    Education: I think it's less important than the previous factors. I've known happy and unhappy people at all ends of the education spectrum.

    Faith in God: No correlation with happiness. Lots of Buddhists (who don't believe in God) and agnostics and atheists are perfectly happy. And lots of religious people are miserable.
     
  17. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    No.
     
  18. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    Then you are not in a position to disagree. I said that as long as you have your faith, and as you admit, you always had it, then it's going to seem like being closer to God makes you happier. I was there before. I used to think that my faith was the only good thing in my life and saved me from killing myself. I didn't realize at the time it was part of what was making me miserable. Since you've never thrown off those shackles completely, you can't agree or disagree with me.
     
  19. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    I'm extremely wealthy compared to the average person in the world. I'm dirt poor compared to the average 28 year old living in the Northern Virginia area, which is by most counts the wealthiest area in the country. It has been demonstrated that material wealth can equal happiness, but it depends on context. If you are some rich fuck living in Malibu surrounded by a bunch of other rich fucks... you'll probably be just as miserable as your neighbors. On the other hand... take your relative wealth to a small village in Thailand on vacation and you'll probably be pretty happy while you're there. My car doesn't stand out a lot in Ft. Lauderdale... but some other places it gets me tons of attention and the adulation and positive affirmation does make me feel good. When I got my first job and had some income and could afford to start buying some stuff that I always wanted but could never afford before, that made me happy as well. Compared to where I was coming from, my newfound buying power was a source of happiness. If you are more affluent than your friends or neighbors, this can also make you happier. I can't link to the studies but they've been done. I said in the first sentence I was extremely wealthy compared to the average person because I have central air, a roof over my head, carpet under my feet, a car, a nice computer, internet access, a home theater, warm and comfortable clothing, etc. I can afford to go out on nice dates, take vacations to exotic locations, stuff like that. Things many people take for granted in the USA, but most people around the world can't afford. Ask an impoverished farmer in Vietnam who can't afford to feed or clothe his family how important wealth is to happiness.
     
  20. ManlyBanisters

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    Is that you don't care to respond to the rest of my point?

    I am completely in a position to disagree. An atheist can go to church everyday, considering themselves a believer, and think, as you say you did, that they are happy in their faith until they eventually find the way to their atheism and conclude that the faith they thought was a benefit was actually holding them back from true happiness. Likewise, someone with faith can live quite assuredly as a devout :wink: atheist and be convinced that that is the right path - only to later find that something they had dismissed as childish acceptance of the norm was in fact much deeper. I still say you are putting far too much weight on your own judgement - just because your faith shackled you that does not make it so for everybody.

    We may have no proof of the existance of God but neither do we have any proof of the non-existence of God.
     
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