Philosophical Question

[Smaccoms]

So you meet a guy out in public or something and you start talking. He begins to tell you how he's been divorced for about 8 months and has four kids. Let's say he's 54 years old. He tells you he's never had sex with another man, never seen one naked even! He tells you the reason for the divorce was that he told his wife he realized that he was gay.
Do you believe him? How do you think it's possible for him to identify as a homosexual with no homosexual experiences? Do you think sexual practices reflects on a person's sexual identity? How and how much? What does this mean in terms of what sexuality is?
I just wanted to get peoples thoughts on this. I thought it could be an interesting discussion...oh and on top of this random meeting in the park, the guy asks for your number afterward *wink wink*

 

[D_Hey Sailor]

The ole' call it one question, ask five trick!

I would believe him. Most people don't pack that much damaging info into a statement unless it is true. Besides, who am I to question it? I don't think you need to experience sex of a certain alignment in order to know it's what fits you. Surely you couldn't say the average teenager doesn't know their sexual preference just because he or she hasn't lost their virginity yet (or kissed).

As for sexual practices as a reflection of their sexual identity... I think most people are going to engage in acts that "fit the bill." However, there are always cases where the person doesn't have a firmly established preference; practice sex in a certain way so that they fit in; or deviate from what they ideally desire for any number of personal reasons.

 

[seeksthequestion]

I am of the belief, people can't be easily labeled in their sexuality. First off it is the experiences and periods in an individuals life that are straight/gay/bi etc. Secondly, there are too few categories in which to put people even if we wanted to and differing opinions of what acts would place someone into any given category.

 

[nudeyorker]

Well I'm willing to suspend disbelief that he has never seen another man naked (Does he live in a land with no gyms?) But everyones discovery of who they are is not set on the time table that the rest of us measure ourselves on. I knew I was gay at a very young age. I never felt that I was straight when I slept with woman (I felt like a gay guy just double checking to be sure)
Everyone comes to their own truth in their own way and in their own time.

 

[Smaccoms]

The ole' call it one question, ask five trick!

I would believe him. Most people don't pack that much damaging info into a statement unless it is true. Besides, who am I to question it? I don't think you need to experience sex of a certain alignment in order to know it's what fits you. Surely you couldn't say the average teenager doesn't know their sexual preference just because he or she hasn't lost their virginity yet (or kissed).

As for sexual practices as a reflection of their sexual identity... I think most people are going to engage in acts that "fit the bill." However, there are always cases where the person doesn't have a firmly established preference; practice sex in a certain way so that they fit in; or deviate from what they ideally desire for any number of personal reasons.

I personally think htere can be mutiple different reasons to have sex with someone, only one of them being "I find him/her attractive"...who one has sex with says nothing of who they want to have sex with. This is the primary difference between having sex and making love.
Personally, one's sexual identity I believe starts with curiosity--"I wonder what their dick looks like, I wonder what their lips taste like, I wonder what it's like being submissive, I wonder what her back feels like, OOOO a whip!" that sort of thing. The point of the matter is to explore different things you like and expand on it. Get that bj you want where you can get it (safe obviously), touch her back, use that whip. It's after you begin to explore these curiosities you can say what you like and why. It also leads you into finding different types which attract you--feminine shoulders, muscular butts, fat lips, big feet. That's one path anyway, I'm sure there are others.
Sex can be about the dick, and sex can be about the boobs. But in my perspective, sex goes a lot deeper than that. It works itself past gender I think. The homo/hetero-sexual split is an illusion I believe. Intercourse is only the beginning...

 

[Smaccoms]

I am of the belief, people can't be easily labeled in their sexuality. First off it is the experiences and periods in an individuals life that are straight/gay/bi etc. Secondly, there are too few categories in which to put people even if we wanted to and differing opinions of what acts would place someone into any given category.

Actually, I've been told America is weird in having only two sexual categories (gay vs straight) I've been told a lot of other societies have multiple in order to accomodate the vast arenas of human sexuality, which is a psychological concept as well as biological.

 

[Smaccoms]

Well I'm willing to suspend disbelief that he has never seen another man naked (Does he live in a land with no gyms?) But everyones discovery of who they are is not set on the time table that the rest of us measure ourselves on. I knew I was gay at a very young age. I never felt that I was straight when I slept with woman (I felt like a gay guy just double checking to be sure)
Everyone comes to their own truth in their own way and in their own time.

I never saw men nude at the gym in my hgih school--there was too much stigma to my homosexuality. Everyone knew by the time I got to gym class so the guys always changed out of eye-sight...in middle school I generally kept my eyes shut way in the corner out of nervousness--I was a bit of a wreck back then (but who isn't I guess)

 

[D_Hey Sailor]

I personally think htere can be mutiple different reasons to have sex with someone, only one of them being "I find him/her attractive"...who one has sex with says nothing of who they want to have sex with. This is the primary difference between having sex and making love.
Personally, one's sexual identity I believe starts with curiosity--"I wonder what their dick looks like, I wonder what their lips taste like, I wonder what it's like being submissive, I wonder what her back feels like, OOOO a whip!" that sort of thing. The point of the matter is to explore different things you like and expand on it. Get that bj you want where you can get it (safe obviously), touch her back, use that whip. It's after you begin to explore these curiosities you can say what you like and why. It also leads you into finding different types which attract you--feminine shoulders, muscular butts, fat lips, big feet. That's one path anyway, I'm sure there are others.
Sex can be about the dick, and sex can be about the boobs. But in my perspective, sex goes a lot deeper than that. It works itself past gender I think. The homo/hetero-sexual split is an illusion I believe. Intercourse is only the beginning...

I don't recall getting into the specifics of why people have sex with one another, but I guess I'll bite. Attraction for me comprises more than just the visuals, and as such, I see your statements about the draw to intercourse/exploration as contradictory. Curiosity gives rise to attraction! That curiosity about _______ is going to *attract* you to a specific behavior/person in order to sate the emotion. Certainly, this can lead to novel sexual venues, broaden horizons, and so on, but it's ignorant to assume that said curiosity can blur all barriers -- especially the homo/hetero one for the average person. The majority are going to have well-established boundaries that have been socialized into them throughout their upbringing, and those will not be easily over-ridden. As well, I don't believe you're giving the inverse enough emphasis: sexploration can make you more rigid and less-open minded with equal ease.

I also disagree on the homo/hetero split being an illusion. You simply cannot deny that it exists in one form or another, and that opposite sexes are naturally attracted in the bulk of cases. It's a dominant, inherent trait. If it's purely a social thing, then why has it remained so prominent throughout ages and cultures?

"Intercourse is only the beginning..." ??? this sounds like a trailer for a space-pornouttahere:

 

[Smaccoms]

I don't recall getting into the specifics of why people have sex with one another, but I guess I'll bite.

haha I rant to the point where I move from one topic to the next in my head without thinking about it, I'm sorry. I haven't read the rest of your post so, here I go...

 

[Smaccoms]

I don't recall getting into the specifics of why people have sex with one another, but I guess I'll bite. Attraction for me comprises more than just the visuals, and as such, I see your statements about the draw to intercourse/exploration as contradictory. Curiosity gives rise to attraction! That curiosity about _______ is going to *attract* you to a specific behavior/person in order to sate the emotion. Certainly, this can lead to novel sexual venues, broaden horizons, and so on, but it's ignorant to assume that said curiosity can blur all barriers -- especially the homo/hetero one for the average person. The majority are going to have well-established boundaries that have been socialized into them throughout their upbringing, and those will not be easily over-ridden. As well, I don't believe you're giving the inverse enough emphasis: sexploration can make you more rigid and less-open minded with equal ease.

I also disagree on the homo/hetero split being an illusion. You simply cannot deny that it exists in one form or another, and that opposite sexes are naturally attracted in the bulk of cases. It's a dominant, inherent trait. If it's purely a social thing, then why has it remained so prominent throughout ages and cultures?

"Intercourse is only the beginning..." ??? this sounds like a trailer for a space-pornouttahere:

I think what i meant is that the hetero/homo split exists to some degree. It extemely helpful and tells us in which direction we should go in terms of where to direct our vast array of sexual behaviors. I think it is also just as important to realize that the binary split also doesn't exist, especially in terms of sex. A blow job is a blow job is a blow job for example. It's like a alternate form of jerking off, or getting a hand-job. Sometimes who is giving it is part of the sexual situation but it doesn't HAVE to be, cause you're really just jerking off here...*giggles*
Just like I can't assume the binary split does not exist whatsoever, you can't assume homosexuality is just a modern theme and in the past heterosexuality being the social norm globally speaking. That statement is false. Before Christian influences, most cultures and societies assumed bisexuality as the human norm and operated as such. After Christian influences, it's a constant struggle and common theme. I am reading a textbook right now that identifies that thread and describes it from as early as 800 BCE to as late as 1800 CE.
I can curiosity and sexploration narrowing boundaries rather than widening them definitely. I simply think sexploration can work in both directions. COnsidering our society at the moment, it is more prudent for people to "freeze" the "widening" effect and "fire up" the narrowing effect. I think if people sexplored more and let themselves open up, they would find the realm of the sexuality much wider than they would expect. They would have more options, get more sex, and become healthier in the process (you know what they say about ejaculations...). I personally think it also leads to a happier "you" (I've experienced this "widening" effect myself).
I really really hope I using the right "effect" here--I think I am...
intercourse really is only the beginning, and if that's all you do sexually speaking...that's kinda boring. It's like eating the same five things your entire life, doesn't it EVER get old?
A space-porno eh? I'll have sexplore that...