Police fire 50 shots at unarmed men!

baseball99

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You've already formed an opinion - don't be disingenuous.



Yes, we should be very thankful for the police brutality we have - look at the alternative! :rolleyes:

I suspect you'd be singing a different tune if you were the victim of police profiling.

I've posted before a long time ago how I did have major run ins with a cop bc i was profiled to be someone that the cops were after bc i looked very very similar to this guy. Not only was i in a foreign country at the time, but i didnt speak the language, was getting screamed at and damn near close to being arrested.....

All that is beside the point

ISOLATED incidents get press. The news media is to blame.....they draw conclusions and do so in ways to get an audience. How often do you hear about all the good cops do? How much media time does a cop get when he is killed on duty? Why isnt there an uproar about that? How come it gets 15 seconds on the news? My logic is flawed? Police brutality is rare, despite popular belief (but i forgot, i am on the site where everyone has a 12 inch dick and 200+ IQ).....I want questions answered.....why is it police brutality when a white cop punches a black guy but if the same guy was punched exactly the same by a black cop its not the same? I remember one "police brutality" patient in the hospital.....He was hit by a car runnin from the cops, after he fired 6 rounds at them but "had nothing to hide".....he said the cops were goin after him "bc he was black".....the dude was high on crack at the time. All the cops that were involved were black or hispanic and he asked us to say that the "lightest" one hit him.....why would he do that? bc he knew nothing would come of it otherwise and he was wrong

are there bad cops, yes.....is police brutality rampant, no. Do you really think the US would be safer without cops? Come on no one can be that stupid.....
 

baseball99

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Cops don't stop people from living next door to me from being criminals or breaking any laws. Your logis is beyond flawed. In fact, I can assure you that while they are pulling me over for bullshit, other crimes ARE occuring. I tend to think that good people make the world good.

As a school-aged teen, I had cops harass me and my friends for standing on the bus stop waiting for the bus to get to my after school job (while the corner boys with pockets of drugs slowly walked away). Would I really STAND there if I have drugs in my backpack (which had my work uniform)?




I totally forgot to be thankful for that on Thanksgiving. Damn.

You're right, the cops hand deliver the rapists, drug dealers, child molesters, murderers, scam artists directly the the realtor so they can get a house right near you. Actually cops are out to get you. Doctors are out to get you......this board sounds like a fuckin paranoid schizophrenia board
 

rob_just_rob

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I've posted before a long time ago how I did have major run ins with a cop bc i was profiled to be someone that the cops were after bc i looked very very similar to this guy. Not only was i in a foreign country at the time, but i didnt speak the language, was getting screamed at and damn near close to being arrested.....

All that is beside the point

ISOLATED incidents get press. The news media is to blame.....they draw conclusions and do so in ways to get an audience. How often do you hear about all the good cops do? How much media time does a cop get when he is killed on duty? Why isnt there an uproar about that? How come it gets 15 seconds on the news? My logic is flawed? Police brutality is rare, despite popular belief (but i forgot, i am on the site where everyone has a 12 inch dick and 200+ IQ).....I want questions answered.....why is it police brutality when a white cop punches a black guy but if the same guy was punched exactly the same by a black cop its not the same? I remember one "police brutality" patient in the hospital.....He was hit by a car runnin from the cops, after he fired 6 rounds at them but "had nothing to hide".....he said the cops were goin after him "bc he was black".....the dude was high on crack at the time. All the cops that were involved were black or hispanic and he asked us to say that the "lightest" one hit him.....why would he do that? bc he knew nothing would come of it otherwise and he was wrong

are there bad cops, yes.....is police brutality rampant, no. Do you really think the US would be safer without cops? Come on no one can be that stupid.....

Your arguments are flawed, probably because you haven't experienced day-to-day harassment from the police, or know someone who has.

Isolated incidents get press. One rape in 10 gets reported. Get it?

As for your last question - I'll put aside the baby-and-bathwaterness of your rant and point out that for a surprising number of people in the USA, yes, it would be. Try living in a poor neighbourhood and reporting criminal acts, see how much action you get for your trouble.
 

Lex

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You're right, the cops hand deliver the rapists, drug dealers, child molesters, murderers, scam artists directly the the realtor so they can get a house right near you. Actually cops are out to get you. Doctors are out to get you......this board sounds like a fuckin paranoid schizophrenia board


Boy, your reading comprehension sucks and so does your ability to follow the logical progression of this discussion. You implied that my neighborhood was safe because of police. I said that the police have nothing to do with the quality of my neighbors. I have a safe neighborhodd because we who live here keep in that way. You then bolded one sentence and commented on it out of context. Wow, you're exhausting.
 

baseball99

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Boy, your reading comprehension sucks and so does your ability to follow the logical progression of this discussion. You implied that my neighborhood was safe because of police. I said that the police have nothing to do with the quality of my neighbors. I have a safe neighborhodd because we who live here keep in that way. You then bolded one sentence and commented on it out of context. Wow, you're exhausting.

right poor reading comprehension has got me to where i am :rolleyes:

My comment (which as you eloquently demonstrated how easy it is to take something out of context).....if there werent cops these people would be in your neighborhoods, in your schools, with your children, maybe next door to you bc its the cops that enforce law and get these people off the streets.....you were the first to utilize poor reading comprehension.....if cops werent there to enforce as best they can your neighborhood wouldnt be as safe bc crime would invade your quaint little neighborhood. Do they directly protect your neighborhood and form a human wall around it, no.....but stopping and slowing crime in any city near you keeps YOU safe so you can live in your little neighborhood. Your argument is cops have nothign to do with keeping your neighborhood safe.....im just sayin youre full of shit
 

baseball99

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Your arguments are flawed, probably because you haven't experienced day-to-day harassment from the police, or know someone who has.

Isolated incidents get press. One rape in 10 gets reported. Get it?

As for your last question - I'll put aside the baby-and-bathwaterness of your rant and point out that for a surprising number of people in the USA, yes, it would be. Try living in a poor neighbourhood and reporting criminal acts, see how much action you get for your trouble.

Yeh i've performed the examinations on rape victims.....the vast majority beg and plead not to have anything reported. Get it? No probably bc you didnt know that.

One thing about the US is the news media will do anything to get ratings.....if that means throwing key words like racial bias, police brutality, or whatever they will do it before they even know the whole story. What will happen to this story if all of a sudden this man wasnt unarmed? It would disappear from teh media. No one knows the whole story yet

And here we go with the victim act.....another classic of LPSG.....the argument is usually "you dont have it as bad as me.....blah blah blah".....well maybe I dont. Maybe I have busted my ass so hard, gone so far into debt to increase my education to be able to move out of crime-ridden areas to give a better life for my children. Maybe I came from a poor family and lived in a poor neighborhood and used every fuckin opportunity possible and when there wasnt one I made one so i could make something of myself. Maybe I should feel guilty for becoming educated, becoming a professional and not looking back.

Everyone needs to accept responsibility. If the cops are wrong, they need to accept responsibility. If the governor was wrong for prematurely and stupidly giving opinions like they were facts he needs to accept responsibility. If the guy was wrong, then his family has to accept that maybe he instigated the whole situation.
 

baseball99

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Apparently your grammatical and punctuational skills have helped you on your way to decent reading comprehension...

You grammar good!:biggrin1:

yeh grammar is usually a priority after working a 36 hour shift.....while dealing with 6 code blues, 2 gun shot wounds, 5 car accident, 10 hunting accidents.....

Not that it matters but my grammar is proper in real life.....i didnt realize the internet was regulated by my 3rd grade teacher :rolleyes:
 

AlteredEgo

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Hingsight it always 20/20.....when a cop gets killed in a shootout how come there isnt the same uproar? They were unarmed. How do you know they didnt say they had a weapon? I'm sorry but when someone tries to run someone over with a car, thats a weapon. Everyone can be an expert with biased news media stories. Everyone can say what should have been done or how they would have handled it. However, anyone in that situation as the cop would have reacted the same way. Someone just tried to run you down with a car and you'll just write down the license plate number? I'm sorry but I hate when people act like experts when no one even knows the whole story yet. I give cops a lot of credit for what they do and despite a few bad cops they do a great job and put themselves in harms way every single day. They help keep your country civil so you can speak out against them. Its always easy to criticize when you're not in their situation, but until everyone knows the whole story premature opinions dont help the situation at all

and bloomberg is an idiot for giving an opinion without the whole story, all politicians are the same

Do you live in a suburb or something? Anyway, back in the big cities, there is always an uproar of sorts for the tragic death of on duty police officers. It's not as extreme, because officers sign up to deal with bad people. That's the job. Defend the rest of us with their lives. And they have guns. Unarmed civillians? Not the same story.

Was the car being used as a weapon? Yup. But if you point a gun at me while I'm in my car, I'm going to use it to kill you. End of story. And if after I hit you the first time you don't back off, but instead climb on top of it, I'm going to use my basic understanding of physics to knock you off, and run you over, with the intention of killing you. I assume anyone who points a gun at me wants to use it. And anyway, it is NOT the policy of the NYPD to fire upon suspect who are using a vehicle as a weapon. An NYPD spokesperson has already confirmed this.

Giulliani used to give opinions before conducting investigations also. But he always sided with police.
 

b.c.

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Yeh i've performed the examinations on rape victims.....the vast majority beg and plead not to have anything reported. Get it? No probably bc you didnt know that.

One thing about the US is the news media will do anything to get ratings.....if that means throwing key words like racial bias, police brutality, or whatever they will do it before they even know the whole story. What will happen to this story if all of a sudden this man wasnt unarmed? It would disappear from teh media. No one knows the whole story yet

And here we go with the victim act.....another classic of LPSG.....the argument is usually "you dont have it as bad as me.....blah blah blah".....well maybe I dont. Maybe I have busted my ass so hard, gone so far into debt to increase my education to be able to move out of crime-ridden areas to give a better life for my children. Maybe I came from a poor family and lived in a poor neighborhood and used every fuckin opportunity possible and when there wasnt one I made one so i could make something of myself. Maybe I should feel guilty for becoming educated, becoming a professional and not looking back.

Everyone needs to accept responsibility. If the cops are wrong, they need to accept responsibility. If the governor was wrong for prematurely and stupidly giving opinions like they were facts he needs to accept responsibility. If the guy was wrong, then his family has to accept that maybe he instigated the whole situation.

It's amazing, the blase form of ignorance and "illogic" that seems to over take otherwise fairly intelligent people when they want to be in denial of truth.

The hidden message in your post above suggests that you have done what "these people" (as you refer to in a previous post) have failed to do...i.e. worked hard to lift yourself up and "make something of yourself". (Somebody got a medal for him??)

You're so fuckin' busy patting yourself on your back for that which many of us have done as a matter of routine that you've totally failed to get the point that Lex and others are trying to make here.

And that is that for some, even having done all that you said you have done for yourself is not enough. That even people who have "made something" of themselves have on too many occasions been treated, unnecessarily so, as second class citizens, if not worse. And for no other reason other than prejudice and racism. (Or perhaps you believe that if this incident involved a car load of white guys in business suits they'd still be dead now).

In your mind it is the product of the "liberal" news media trying to get ratings. (Funny...I didn't hear any member of the media mention racism.) To you it's the "victim act." Act? The posters on here are relating real life experiences. Who are you to call it an "act" simply because you refuse to accept the reality of their situation?

(I wasted more time on your ridiculous ramblings than it was worth.)
 

rob_just_rob

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Yeh i've performed the examinations on rape victims.....the vast majority beg and plead not to have anything reported. Get it? No probably bc you didnt know that.

As a matter of fact, I do. My point was that a lot of police harassment and brutality goes unreported, too.

And btw, do you really need to remind us of what you do in every thread you post in? :rolleyes: Yes, we get it, you're in the medical profession, and you have the delusions of grandeur to go with it. I see your god complex is developing nicely, too.

Everyone needs to accept responsibility. If the cops are wrong, they need to accept responsibility.

Wow, really? Even if it's just an "isolated incident?" Or if they shoot me, do I have to grin and bear it, because the previous 10 times I interacted with the police, they didn't shoot me?

The points you seem to be missing are these:

1. The police have a lot of power in our society. They carry guns. They can make pronouncements that ordinary citizens have to obey - e.g. to disperse. The word of a police officer carries a lot of weight, so if there is a disagreement between the cop's version of events and your version, you'd better have a lot of evidence for your version, because all other things being equal, the cop's version will win out.

2. Given these powers, the police have an obligation to exercise them carefully. If I fuck up in my job, people will lose a lot of money. If the cops fuck up, people lose their lives, freedom, or livelihood. Note the difference, and read DC_Deep's thread on the inaugural protests, or Lex's and OKFarmer's accounts in this thread. There are too many fuckups happening, despite your claim that these are "isolated incidents".

3. Racial profiling exists. If you don't believe that, I suggest you do some research. Visible minorities and youths are randomly stopped a lot more often than older, whiter people are. Visible minorities are the victims of police brutality far more often than white people - regardless of what they happen to be doing at the time.

Now given 1, 2, and 3, the cops need to do more than "accept responsibility" when they fuck up and wilfully injure or kill innocent people. They need to recognize point #3 as fact and work to correct that. They need better training. And they need to take a hell of a lot more care than they seem to be taking.

An example: I have belonged to various gun clubs in the past. As you may know, guns are very strictly regulated in Canada, so those of us who are or have been gun hobbyists are very careful to shoot responsibly and safely and obey the law. Guess where most of the shooting range accidents occur? Yup, police ranges. It's not even close - police ranges have over 10 times the accident rate (per range) than private ranges do.

So, yes, everyone needs to accept responsibility. However, when the cops fail to accept responsibility, people tend to get badly hurt in one way or another, so the standard of care is higher. When they act, they had BETTER be acting correctly.
 

Sergeant_Torpedo

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Internal inquiries are fine but when a seemingly innocent man or woman (or sadly even a child) is judiciously murdered then a judicial invesigation should be obligatory. Scared and incompetent poilce officers are a danger, but so long as politicians can use them to their own ends then imunity will always be granted. That is of course until some Senator's kid driving home from a frat party gets the treatment then there will be some premature retirements without pensions.
 

Lordpendragon

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[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]
H-statistics.gif



[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed."
[/FONT]
[SIZE=-1]-Dwight D. Eisenhower, U.S. general and 34th president (1890-1969)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+2]Facts about Gun Violence[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+2]General Gun Violence Statistics[/SIZE]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]
FACT: In 2003 (the most recent year for which data is available), there were 1,146 gun deaths in the state of Illinois, a 7% decrease from 2002 Illinois gun deaths. The 2003 Illinois gun deaths included:
  • 696 homicides (60% of all IL gun deaths),
  • 404 suicides (36% of all IL gun deaths),
  • and 23 unintentional shootings, 8 legal intervention, and 15 of undetermined intent (4% of all IL gun deaths combined).
-Numbers obtained from CDC National Center for Health Statistics mortality report online, 2006.

FACT:In 2003 (the most recent year for which data is available), there were 30,136 gun deaths in the U.S:
  • 16,907 suicides (56% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 11,920 homicides (40% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 730 unintentional shootings (2% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 347 from legal intervention and 232 from undetermined intent (2% of all U.S gun deaths combined).
-Numbers obtained from CDC National Center for Health Statistics mortality report online, 2006.
[/SIZE][/FONT]

Slightly off topic to Police brutality etc - but these figures are amazing - almost like a Twin Towers every month.[/SIZE][/FONT]
 

DC_DEEP

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<...>All that is beside the point

ISOLATED incidents get press. The news media is to blame.....they draw conclusions and do so in ways to get an audience. How often do you hear about all the good cops do? How much media time does a cop get when he is killed on duty?

Uh, you really don't seem to understand, baseball99. It makes the news here because it is NOT isolated incidents. How often does this kind of thing have to happen before you admit it is SOP, and not an isolated incident? You did not read my previous posts, did you? Cops killed in the line of duty DO make headlines here, they really do make a huge deal out of it. I'm not sure where you live, but as I mentioned before, I would bet the farm it is not in Maryland, District of Columbia, or Northern Virginia. Ha, especially not Baltimore County or Prince George's County.
are there bad cops, yes.....is police brutality rampant, no. Do you really think the US would be safer without cops? Come on no one can be that stupid.....
The point is, some police jurisdictions seem to encourage corruption and license, by not discouraging it. When all the investigations are internal and almost guaranteed to find "no wrongdoing," what is the incentive to clean it up? When the courts excuse any behavior of an individual, simply because of his employer, why be discreet? If you don't like the way the kid looked at you, just shoot his fucking ass, the internal investigation will find probable cause and you won't have to answer for it.

No, the world would not necessarily be a better place without police, but live here for a couple of years and tell me it would not be a better place if the cops were made to toe the line.
 

b.c.

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[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]http://www.ichv.org/images/H-statistics.gif [/FONT]


[FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif][FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]"Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and are not clothed."[/FONT]
[SIZE=-1]-Dwight D. Eisenhower, U.S. general and 34th president (1890-1969)[/SIZE]

[SIZE=+2]Facts about Gun Violence[/SIZE]
[SIZE=+2]General Gun Violence Statistics[/SIZE]


[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]FACT: In 2003 (the most recent year for which data is available), there were 1,146 gun deaths in the state of Illinois, a 7% decrease from 2002 Illinois gun deaths. The 2003 Illinois gun deaths included:
  • 696 homicides (60% of all IL gun deaths),
  • 404 suicides (36% of all IL gun deaths),
  • and 23 unintentional shootings, 8 legal intervention, and 15 of undetermined intent (4% of all IL gun deaths combined).
-Numbers obtained from CDC National Center for Health Statistics mortality report online, 2006.[/FONT][/SIZE]​

[SIZE=-1][FONT=arial, helvetica, sans-serif]FACT:In 2003 (the most recent year for which data is available), there were 30,136 gun deaths in the U.S:
  • 16,907 suicides (56% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 11,920 homicides (40% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 730 unintentional shootings (2% of all U.S gun deaths),
  • 347 from legal intervention and 232 from undetermined intent (2% of all U.S gun deaths combined).
-Numbers obtained from CDC National Center for Health Statistics mortality report online, 2006.[/FONT][/SIZE]​


Slightly off topic to Police brutality etc - but these figures are amazing - almost like a Twin Towers every month.[/FONT][/SIZE]

Well, maybe not entirely off topic if say "an observer" from afar (another country for example) were looking at those statistics, because such a person might be inclined to think why, with such statistics, would we get all bent out of shape over the police killing of one guy. After all, the statistics suggest we do an incredible amount of killing of each other (specifically as it relates to black on black crime). So we get the innuendo behind the statistics.

I think the outrage comes about for two reasons. One is obvious. We hold those in law enforcement to higher standards...we expect them to protect and serve, to act with a certain degree of propriety. The other reason is because when such things occur it smacks of a continued form of an institutionalized class/racial divide.

That's why these incidents merit attention.
 

baseball99

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The point is, some police jurisdictions seem to encourage corruption and license, by not discouraging it. When all the investigations are internal and almost guaranteed to find "no wrongdoing," what is the incentive to clean it up? When the courts excuse any behavior of an individual, simply because of his employer, why be discreet? If you don't like the way the kid looked at you, just shoot his fucking ass, the internal investigation will find probable cause and you won't have to answer for it.

No, the world would not necessarily be a better place without police, but live here for a couple of years and tell me it would not be a better place if the cops were made to toe the line.


you're completely right. I agree with you.....Police should be held to a higher standard and when wrong, held accountable. I still think these incidents are a minority of what happens and what police have to deal with on a daily basis. There are a few things i get very passionate about.....I have the utmost respect for police officers and have seen what they have to deal with on a daily basis. I'm happy there are people willing to do that bc I wouldnt want to know what the US would be like without them
 

spartalee

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most likely one cop shot and the rest were like...What the hell I have never shot this bad boy outside of the range.....*POW**POW**POW**POW*.


.....no reason for that kind of violence...
 

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you're completely right. I agree with you.....Police should be held to a higher standard and when wrong, held accountable. I still think these incidents are a minority of what happens and what police have to deal with on a daily basis. There are a few things i get very passionate about.....I have the utmost respect for police officers and have seen what they have to deal with on a daily basis. I'm happy there are people willing to do that bc I wouldnt want to know what the US would be like without them

I disagree, anyone should be held to a standard, the same standard for everyone, and when wrong, of course accountability when it's not "on the job" related. For "on the job" incidences, you may be able to apply a higher or even uniformly applicable standard on a case by case basis, as the nature of their job puts them in predicaments that are as close to war as one could be placed. Obviously, gunning down granny over a j-walking incident, you could apply that higher standard (that is unless granny had an uzi and had just robbed a bank), common sense discretion and interpretation has to be the rule when rendering a judgement.

In this incident, the citizens were unarmed in terms of firearms, according to an account, they didn't portray themselves as unarmed and explicitly indicated they were armed. Ultimately, a motor vehicle was used as a weapon. I don't know which I'd choose, a gun or a car as a weapon of choice, but in this case of one car vs several guns, the car was obviously the wrong choice.
 

baseball99

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I disagree, anyone should be held to a standard, the same standard for everyone, and when wrong, of course accountability when it's not "on the job" related. For "on the job" incidences, you may be able to apply a higher or even uniformly applicable standard on a case by case basis, as the nature of their job puts them in predicaments that are as close to war as one could be placed. Obviously, gunning down granny over a j-walking incident, you could apply that higher standard (that is unless granny had an uzi and had just robbed a bank), common sense discretion and interpretation has to be the rule when rendering a judgement.

In this incident, the citizens were unarmed in terms of firearms, according to an account, they didn't portray themselves as unarmed and explicitly indicated they were armed. Ultimately, a motor vehicle was used as a weapon. I don't know which I'd choose, a gun or a car as a weapon of choice, but in this case of one car vs several guns, the car was obviously the wrong choice.

I agree with you.....i also heard the men exclaimed they were armed.....i really wish it was possible to get an unbiased story bc otherwise all you get are opinions which are bullshit