Political Discussion #1: Abortion

[jonb]

Originally posted by GottaBigOne@Apr 10 2005, 12:19 PM
So Dr. Rock you think the only consideration there should be in an abortion is the woman's health? The fetus gets no consideration whatsoever?

[post=299282]Quoted post[/post]​

If the woman dies, the embryo/fetus will most likely die as well.

 

[Altairion]

Originally posted by surferboy@Apr 10 2005, 08:44 PM

I am against late term abortions. I think once the fetus is deveoloped enough to survive on it's own, it's a person.

I fully agree. It's not life until Michael Jackson can dangle it from a balcony.

[post=299394]Quoted post[/post]​

HAAAAA! That's the funniest thing I've heard all night Nix :lol:

 

[Dr Rock]

Originally posted by GottaBigOne@Apr 10 2005, 08:19 PM
So Dr. Rock you think the only consideration there should be in an abortion is the woman's health? The fetus gets no consideration whatsoever?

[post=299282]Quoted post[/post]​

bingo.

 

[madame_zora]

Well, if birth control methods fail, the fetus resulting is unwanted and uninvited. I see no reason for a woman to change her life for two decades for something she didn't ask for or was trying to prevent. I guess I'm with Dr. Rock here. It seems harsh, but reality nonetheless.

 

[surferboy]

Originally posted by Altairion+Apr 10 2005, 09:36 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Altairion &#064; Apr 10 2005, 09:36 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-surferboy@Apr 10 2005, 08:44 PM

I am against late term abortions. I think once the fetus is deveoloped enough to survive on it&#39;s own, it&#39;s a person.

I fully agree. It&#39;s not life until Michael Jackson can dangle it from a balcony.

[post=299394]Quoted post[/post]​

HAAAAA&#33; That&#39;s the funniest thing I&#39;ve heard all night Nix :lol:

[post=299426]Quoted post[/post]​

[/b][/quote]


Thanks

 

[Onslow]

Originally posted by madame_zora@Apr 10 2005, 11:31 AM
Wow, Onslow, are we really agreeing on something? This might start a new trend- now who will I have to argue with? :lol: Just kidding, guy- you know I luv ya.

[post=299145]Quoted post[/post]​

Don&#39;t worry my dear, I&#39;m sure we&#39;ll have more run-ins (unless I surprise myself and avoid all my insane political--and other sorts of--diatribes). Come to think of it we have had a few moments of harmony.

Yipes&#33; Now I&#39;m scared.

 

[Freddie53]

There are several issues invovled here. Legal and religious and personal. The answers are not the same for all. First religious.

RELIGIOUS:

It is would be proper to include all religions here. But the truth is this is a Christian issue in America. That is because that is the only religion to get involved at this point in time.So, the fundies have always wanted to use the Bible so let&#39;s go there.

There is absolutely no meniton of abortion in the Bible and we know that obortoin has been around for thousands of years. So people using the Bible will have to use selected Scriptures and do a lot of interpreting and streching of thier overall convictions to come up with a Biblical answer.

For me I use the Genesis text where God breathed life into Adam. I use the breath of life concept. When baby starts breathing is when I think that the soul enters the body. To me a baby never born alive, never lived and will not be in heaven for eternity. I don&#39;t think these pregnancies that ended early regardles of how they ended will have a baby there.

I understand the oppposite view that at the moment of conception there is a soul and so if there is an abortion, miscarriage or morning after pill that there is a baby with a soul that is in heaven. However, from a biblical prespective, the ancients new nothing of sperm and eggs and fertilization and all of that. So it is difficult using the Bible to defend that position as well.


LEGAL:

This one is easy. Throughout the ages, only babies born alive have been recorded as having been born. This is true in all cultures that I know about. We list our birthdates from the day we were born, not the date we were conceived.

PERSONAL:

To me with both the legal line of stating who has actualy lived .so defined and the religious lines so undefined, that leaves only one option for the personal consideration.

The pregnant female. the doctor, the spiritual advisor, the god of choice if you have one and personal beliefs has to prevail here. If the pregnant female wishes to include the male who did the conceiving that should be her choice.

As for as the rest of us. We should bale out of it. It is not our body, it is not our consequences to deal with and we live in a free country. The best we can do is offer support regardlless of the decisin of the pergnant lady involved.

The last thing we need is a bunch of laws on the books regulating this most private matter.

 

[madame_zora]

Beautifully spoken as always, Freddie. You never cease to amaze me, especially coming from such a strong religous perspective yourself. I believe you are the type of man Jesus was here to teach us how to become. You have paid attention to that example in ways most people can scarcely imagine. Thanks for being a voice of calm, clarity and reason, I love and respect you so much, Jana.

 

[jonb]

Well, I&#39;ve heard that in Irian Jaya they arrange marriages before the bride&#39;s even born, but I&#39;m not sure.

 

[Leung]

Originally posted by jonb@Apr 11 2005, 11:32 PM
Well, I&#39;ve heard that in Irian Jaya they arrange marriages before the bride&#39;s even born, but I&#39;m not sure.

[post=299716]Quoted post[/post]​

Let&#39;s just hope that the doctors don&#39;t make a mistake in the sex determination. It could be quite embarressing for all involved&#33;

 

[Freddie53]

Originally posted by madame_zora@Apr 11 2005, 05:00 PM
Beautifully spoken as always, Freddie. You never cease to amaze me, especially coming from such a strong religous perspective yourself. I believe you are the type of man Jesus was here to teach us how to become. You have paid attention to that example in ways most people can scarcely imagine. Thanks for being a voice of calm, clarity and reason, I love and respect you so much,  Jana.

[post=299695]Quoted post[/post]​

I have to make this further comment. The ones who are so prolife when it comes to a fetis that is neither wanted nor has an adult support system here to raise it are the first to want to fry a criminal in the electric chair. Not very parallel there at all. The exception is the Catholic Church. I can respect their views because they are consistent. They are anti abortion and they are anti capital punishment.

 

[Dr Rock]

yep, that&#39;s the typical religious neo-conversative ethos. they&#39;ll fight tooth and nail for your right to the first 9 months of your life; once you&#39;re actually born they couldn&#39;t give a shit, though.

 

[jeepwranglerboi]

All I have to say is that I am very Pro Choice. Who am I to tell another human being what they can and cannot do with their body.

 

[13788]

KAO3602: I think that abortion is a really good topic, not for arguments or anything but just a good thing to talk about. I think that abortion is wrong in most cases. If you are a girl/woman that does not want a baby, then you should not be out spreading the joy if you know what I mean. There are things like birth control and condoms, which dont always work, but they are there to lower the chance. Which maybe birth control is wrong too, but atleast there were never a baby there to begin with. I do however thing that abortion could be used in situations like rape or things of that nature, but I still do not believe in it. Is there anyone else that agrees with me?