According to you, if somebody is morally outraged over priests sexually abusing children, then that person is somehow bigoted towards people of faiths? And if the bishops and cardinals of the Catholic Church cover up the sexual abuse, do you expect nobody to be outraged over that? So if somebody is outraged over this, how does that imply they are bigoted towards people of faiths?
Pope Complicit in Sex Abuse Coverup
- Thread starter B_quietguy
- Start date
According to you, if somebody is morally outraged over priests sexually abusing children, then that person is somehow bigoted towards people of faiths? And if the bishops and cardinals of the Catholic Church cover up the sexual abuse, do you expect nobody to be outraged over that? So if somebody is outraged over this, how does that imply they are bigoted towards people of faiths?
In making that false statement, and playing a "see no evil" of any protestants game, you may now join the Anglican Church sex abuse cover up club.
Sexual Abuse of Children by Protestant Ministers
Salvos talk to Anglicans about abuse cover-up - National - www.theage.com.au
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2004
- Posts
- 15,642
- Media
- 62
- Likes
- 5,042
- Points
- 433
- Location
- London (Greater London, England)
- Verification
- View
- Sexuality
- 90% Gay, 10% Straight
- Gender
- Male
For info Church of England and Anglican are not synonyms - rather C of E is a part of the Anglican communion.
The RCC has been shown to have had a deliberate and settled policy of covering up sex abuse on a massive scale involving tens of thousands of assaults on children. I do not think that other churches have had a deliberate and settled policy of covering up sex abuse on a massive scale. No protestant church has a doctrinal need to make such a cover up.
D_Tully Tunnelrat
Experimental Member
Indeed. Perhaps because no other Church has the dogma of papal infallibility... the religious equivalent of "...because I said so."
I read somewhere (maybe on this board) that the odd makers where placing bets that Ratzinger would resign at 12 to 1 a few weeks ago. Now the odds are 3 to 1. Maybe it will be an even bet shortly.
I see the pope says in his letter that the problem is because the church strayed from its ways of strict adherence to canon law and punishment to more modern, more forgiving ways. Time to get out the red hot pokers then?
He also blames insufficient moral guidance and interestingly excessive respect for clergy (and others).
Im not quite sure what that might all mean. Obviously the letter will have been vetted by every lawyer and PR expert they could muster so its double speak. Is it saying Ratzinger favours a return to traditional hard line values and blames modern liberals for what happened?
Im not quite sure what that might all mean. Obviously the letter will have been vetted by every lawyer and PR expert they could muster so its double speak. Is it saying Ratzinger favors a return to traditional hard line values and blames modern liberals for what happened?[/QUOTE]
sound's like the old ussr. return to old hard line values yes when people are terrified to speak up. and if no one speaks it never happened. the r.c church has been caught with its pants down . literally and will use every p.r. stunt favor it can pull to get out. this is not a religious matter it is the law. children's lives are being ruined living in fear of the very people they should be able to trust. and this will continue on for the rest of there lives. well after the news circus has moved on. the people who do and cover up child abuse are tarred with the same crime and should be treated within the law. to show the people they have violated justice still works. everyone has the right to believe in what ever religion they chose and to live there lives as they see fit. that is the point of a free society. but they are still have to be within the laws of the land. so will mr. pope and his p.r. brigade come clean start again and try again and regain trust. or maybe spout some hard line nonsense and play the blame game and hope it all goes away? place your bets now. we have seen the hard line values have we not. and so have countless children. the ball is in your court mr pope.
sound's like the old ussr. return to old hard line values yes when people are terrified to speak up. and if no one speaks it never happened. the r.c church has been caught with its pants down . literally and will use every p.r. stunt favor it can pull to get out. this is not a religious matter it is the law. children's lives are being ruined living in fear of the very people they should be able to trust. and this will continue on for the rest of there lives. well after the news circus has moved on. the people who do and cover up child abuse are tarred with the same crime and should be treated within the law. to show the people they have violated justice still works. everyone has the right to believe in what ever religion they chose and to live there lives as they see fit. that is the point of a free society. but they are still have to be within the laws of the land. so will mr. pope and his p.r. brigade come clean start again and try again and regain trust. or maybe spout some hard line nonsense and play the blame game and hope it all goes away? place your bets now. we have seen the hard line values have we not. and so have countless children. the ball is in your court mr pope.
midlifebear
Expert Member
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2007
- Posts
- 5,789
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 179
- Points
- 133
- Location
- Nevada, Buenos Aires, and Barçelona
- Sexuality
- 60% Gay, 40% Straight
- Gender
- Male
I'm sure the Vatican will say "The Devil made me/us do it!" Since it is now widely recognized by the Pope that Satan has been living in the Vatican and causing all sorts of trouble, like whoopee cushions under the Pope's seat. :smile:
Oh, and Poor Mr. Buildington. He's a devout catholic? Well, that's his fucking problem -- no one else's.
Oh, and Poor Mr. Buildington. He's a devout catholic? Well, that's his fucking problem -- no one else's.
I'll bet now. The Pope is already in denial and refusing to admit his role in this scandal. He will continue to deny and play down the scandal and hope it goes away. That's why his underlings are doing for him.
Frankly, I've no respect for him. His letter says to forgive people rather than saying anything about his own actions and policies. The children who had their lives messed up emotionally are not going to easily forgive so great a crime.
I don't know about being 'in denial'. I think they understand the situation well enough. They are now in the situation where 'I decline to answer on the advice of my lawyer'.
You could argue that the church's approach to crime, move the person somewhere they will not be able to repeat the crime, hasn't worked very well, but how different is it to the civil approach? You lock someone up (at great expense) for a little while, and then let them out to do it again. The church (presumably) aims at rehabilitation and thus reducing future crime.
Don't tell me the prison approach stops crime, because it does not. If it did, there would be virtually none, because most is the same people over and over. Not to mention that with all crime, the most successful criminals never get caught by anyone.
Which isnt to say the situation inside the RC church hasnt got completely out of control, but give them some credit for good intentions.
Oh, and Poor Mr. Buildington. He's a devout catholic? Well, that's his fucking problem -- no one else's.
At this point, I don't think Mr. Buildington is Catholic - and nor do I really care. I think he is just a troll who likes to post inane comments to rile people up. If claiming he is Catholic allows him to rile people up and most more trollish comments, then he would do it.
Although I am not the Pope and can't read this mind, I still think he is in denial. I'm not saying he is in denial about how far reaching the sex abuse scandal is. I suspect he is in denial about his role in it - as in he does not want to admit to himself or others how his actions as Archbishop or Munich or how his policies as Cardinal led to further abuse.
justasimpleguy
Legendary Member
- Joined
- Feb 11, 2009
- Posts
- 444
- Media
- 37
- Likes
- 1,218
- Points
- 348
- Location
- Alabama (United States)
- Sexuality
- 99% Straight, 1% Gay
- Gender
- Male
The Church has been doing all of these things and worse since its conception. Glad to see it's finally catching up with them. Rat bastards.
midlifebear
Expert Member
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2007
- Posts
- 5,789
- Media
- 0
- Likes
- 179
- Points
- 133
- Location
- Nevada, Buenos Aires, and Barçelona
- Sexuality
- 60% Gay, 40% Straight
- Gender
- Male
Just came across a tightly held secret about mormons and keeping decades of secrets about their Boy Scout leaders sexually molesting kids from as little as 8 years0ld (Cub Scouts) to the 16-17 year-old set (post Eagle Scouts, forget what they're called). Trust me, it's going to be a very BIG problem for the LDS folk.
The C of E is the mother church of Anglicans as the Church of Rome is the mother church of Roman Catholics. The Church of Rome, historically, is also the mother church of the C of E. I gave you examples of sex abuse and cover ups that occurred in the Anglican Church. Somehow you felt the situation different, but it is not. Devolution doesn't stop the sex scandals of autonomous church regions from smearing the Anglican or Roman Catholic Churches.
Pope Benedict XVI - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
In the OP Ratzinger wasn't complicit in the Hellermann sex scandal. It was Father Gehard Gruber who was. It was he who ignored the psychiatrist's recommendation that Hellermann not be allowed to work with children and assigned Hellermann once more to parish duties.
As dandelion mentioned, although the Roman Catholic Church had good intentions, their past policy of dealing with sex offenders was inadequate and needed to be changed. And the Vatican brought about those changes before Ratzinger became Pope Benedict XVI.
In June 2002 the Vatican instituted reforms to prevent future sex abuse and required dioceses faced with an allegation to alert the authorities, conduct an investigation and remove the accused from duty.
Catholic sex abuse cases - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Last edited:
Priests who once worked for then Archbishop Ratzinger of Munich said the guy was a micromanager and controlling. He had to be the one who made all the decisions about everything. I'd bet Ratzinger knew Hellermann was reassigned to work at another parish even though a psychiatrist said Hellerman was unrepentant and incurable. You'd think a micromanager controller like Ratzinger would follow-up on such a serious matter, but nope. As long as the victims were paid to remain silent, there was no need for follow-up.
The link you provided in your comment says nothing about Vatican "reforms" in 2002. It does say that in 2001, "all priestly sex crimes cases were to be placed under the Vatican's Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith which, in most cases, would authorize the bishops to conduct trials themselves." That policy was written by Cardinal Ratzinger and basically says "tell only the Vatican, do not tell the civil authorities, and local bishops may conduct the "trials" in secret. The only "trials" were to decide which parish to move the predators to next.
Basically, it comes down to this: Ratzinger is complicit in sex crimes against children. He has enabled the predators to harm more children, and prevented the civil authorities from knowing. Any high school principal who moved a predatory teacher around and maintained secrecy for a predatory teacher would be go to court as an accomplice after the fact.
The Pope deserves some serious jail time for his crimes. May he rot in jail and become the butt-boy for some predatory priest!
I don't believe that "2001 policy" was created by him quietguy as your OP states it was already in place when Ratzinger transferred Hellermann to Munich for psychiatric therapy in 1979. The policy is one of devolution, where the bishop who heads a particular jurisdiction/diocese has that authority and hence also bears the brunt of criticism regarding his decisions in his diocese.
I referred to June 2002's Charter For The Protection of Children and Young People of footnote # 9
USCCB - (OCYP) - Charter for the Protection of Children and Young People
USCCB - Office of Child & Youth Protection Home Page
Last edited:
*I see that in 2001, under Pope John Paul II's direction, Ratzinger reaffirmed the church's policy of authorizing the bishop of a diocese to deal with the matter of sex abuse complaints, as opposed to involving the civil authorities. And he was one of the members of Pope John Paul II's Holy Office a.k.a. the CDF.
Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph...ne_of_the_Faith#Response_to_sex_abuse_scandal
Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph...ne_of_the_Faith#Response_to_sex_abuse_scandal
Last edited:
Well, Ratzinger may have codified a policy in 2001 based on existing practices of his and many other bishops of shielding predators from the civil authorities. But the main point still sticks. This guy shielded predators and allowed them to sexually abuse more children.
Similar threads
