Pregnant Woman Confined Against Her Will

[D_Rosalind Mussell]

1st story

I think it's ridiculous that a court can take away someone's legal rights who is of sound mind. Obviously the extra stress the woman endured being confined to the hospital could have aided in her body aborting the baby. That physician is a loser and I hope he lost all of his patients once they heard about this.

2nd story

Ugh, another person who doesn't have a womb trying to Lord over women's bodies. Exactly how is someone supposed to stop their body from naturally aborting a child? Tons of women go into premature labor and even with bed rest and medication they still cannot stop it. What a crock. How does someone like that get elected into office anywhere in this country?

I agree with you a million percent, SG. As a side note, I propose we make premature ejaculation illegal. THEY CAN TOTALLY CONTROL IT, RIGHT?

 

[FeroxFemina]

I agree with you a million percent, SG. As a side note, I propose we make premature ejaculation illegal. THEY CAN TOTALLY CONTROL IT, RIGHT?

roflmao!!!!

 

[AlteredEgo]

According to the way most reproductive laws and guidelines are written, and the way women are treated by doctors, we are just hosts for potential fetuses. We are not people. They won't even let some women decide to sterilize themselves, then they don't want her to ever terminate a pregnancy. Now they won't even let a woman get a second opinion?! The Patients Bill of Rights says patients have the right to a second opinion! Oh. Unless you're pregnant, or might get pregnant. I see.

 

[AlteredEgo]

I agree with you a million percent, SG. As a side note, I propose we make premature ejaculation illegal. THEY CAN TOTALLY CONTROL IT, RIGHT?

If there were an award for "Quote of the Day", you'd get it.

 

[Tee&A]

Whoa...
I think I have to marinate on this a bit before I respond (mostly because this is moreso tragic to me than actually shocking, as I don't put much faith in the rights of the people being unequivocally enforced in the grand ol' USofA).
Be back later.

 

[B_subgirrl]

Sorry, I should have specified that laws generally differ state to state here. There must be some law in Florida that allowed this to happen, yet it defies logic. Confining a pregnant woman against her will is not conducive to keeping her relaxed and unstressed until the baby arrives. I doubt she had a background of mental illness but who knows what details might arise.

It does make me wonder if other states or countries (even my own) could have hidden laws, just waiting to jump out and bite you on the ass. I'm sure when that woman said that bed rest was impossible, she didn't have a clue that things could turn out the way they did. The horrible part is that there are so many ways they could have helped her out and encouraged bed rest, without an involuntary confinement.

msnbc.com Video Player Now it's going to be illegal to miscarry in Georgia :sad:

What is there to say to that, except this:

As a side note, I propose we make premature ejaculation illegal. THEY CAN TOTALLY CONTROL IT, RIGHT?

Good call with this one :tongue:.

 

[D_Rosalind Mussell]

According to the way most reproductive laws and guidelines are written, and the way women are treated by doctors, we are just hosts for potential fetuses. We are not people. They won't even let some women decide to sterilize themselves, then they don't want her to ever terminate a pregnancy. Now they won't even let a woman get a second opinion?! The Patients Bill of Rights says patients have the right to a second opinion! Oh. Unless you're pregnant, or might get pregnant. I see.

This is true. In my mind it's just another way to control us, rooted in the archaic belief that women do not know what's best for themselves. God forbid we have the last word about anything, especially our own bodies. This is such an important issue for all of us, we need to demand better legislation from our lawmakers. As far as I'm concerned, confining that woman against her will is right on par with false arrest and should be criminalized as such.

And thank you for the comments about my premature ejaculation bit. I'll be here all week, be sure to tip your waitress. :smile:

 

[AlteredEgo]

The Patients Bill of Rights says patients have the right to a second opinion! Oh. Unless you're pregnant, or might get pregnant. I see.

I'm wrong. In Florida, the PBoR does not guarantee us the right to seek a second opinion. That is... stunning.

 

[ManofThunder]

I'm wrong. In Florida, the PBoR does not guarantee us the right to seek a second opinion. That is... stunning.

Very stunning!

 

[D_Rosalind Mussell]

I'm wrong. In Florida, the PBoR does not guarantee us the right to seek a second opinion. That is... stunning.

Holy shit, AE. When you say "us", does that include men as well?

 

[AlteredEgo]

Holy shit, AE. When you say "us", does that include men as well?

Yes.

It does guarantee us the right to refuse any treatment, so long as no other law prevents such a refusal. I wonder where this doctor's office is, and if it is close enough for me to organize picketers.

 

[D_Rosalind Mussell]

Yes.

It does guarantee us the right to refuse any treatment, so long as no other law prevents such a refusal. I wonder where this doctor's office is, and if it is close enough for me to organize picketers.

Wow...that is completely fucked up. Something needs to be done about that, too.

I wonder where that doctor's office is, too. I know if it were up my way I'd be out there with a sign and a bullhorn.

 

[helgaleena]

Florida...:sad:

The trouble with having to go to court right after a miscarriage is that you are in a very hormonal state of grief. Some incompetent attorney probably did a terrible job and lost the case for her and made her think it's her fault for yelling too much. I sincerely hope she has some friends and relations to fall back on.

 

[TheCameraMan]

That truly is horrible. I don't see how something like that can be ordered, especially when there's little support from any organizations.

 

[AlteredEgo]

Florida...:sad:

The trouble with having to go to court right after a miscarriage is that you are in a very hormonal state of grief. Some incompetent attorney probably did a terrible job and lost the case for her and made her think it's her fault for yelling too much. I sincerely hope she has some friends and relations to fall back on.

The miscarriage was way back in March. The ACLU assisted her in the case. Where are you getting that she was yelling in the courtroom?

 

[helgaleena]

The miscarriage was way back in March. The ACLU assisted her in the case. Where are you getting that she was yelling in the courtroom?

That's not what I said. I said 'yelling too much', not where. And the ACLU is handling the appeal, not the original suit. I get that if it were me, I'd be yelling.

And it's March now. One year is not enough time to get over a miscarriage.
http://www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2010/01/13/is-refusing-bed-rest-a-crime/#more-17311

http://parenting.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/03/03/depression-after-miscarriage/

 

[AlteredEgo]

That's not what I said. I said 'yelling too much', not where. And the ACLU is handling the appeal, not the original suit. I get that if it were me, I'd be yelling.

And it's March now. One year is not enough time to get over a miscarriage.
Is Refusing Bed Rest a Crime?

Depression After Miscarriage - NYTimes.com

Where did you find any evidence that her attorney was incompetent, or that she was ever yelling at anyone? It's a huge extrapolation. If a court is under the power of a judge looking to expand the reach of certain laws, there is nothing even a great attorney can do other than appeal to a higher court when the judge acts on his or her bias. You yell at people when you are depressed. Fine. I don't. I withdraw. I turn my unhappiness on myself. Maybe she yells at people, and maybe she's a saint. We don't know.

On an unrelated note, I found the following as a comment on the situation. It's on the first page Helga links to, which you can get to by following the links from the OP's originally linked article:

William 1.14.2010 at 7:58 pm The thing about this case is that I’m not sure just how aware people are of the breadth of powers granted to doctors and the utter deference with which their opinions are treated. I’m finishing my last year in a doctoral program in clinical psychology and my current clinical training is at a very large public hospital in Chicago. Part of my responsibility is to cover ER shifts and do psych consults/evals when ER or ASC (think urgent care without the urgent) staff thinks there is some kind of psychiatric issue. Probably a quarter of those pages involve doctors, often with very little psych training, calling me in and expecting me to rubber-stamp a certificate and have someone involuntarily committed for one reason or another. In about half of those cases the primary psychiatric symptom cited when I show up is “noncompliance.”
Just so its clear: when I work an ER shift and my pager goes off there is about a 1 in 8 chance that a doctor wants me to declare someone incompetent, issue a certificate attesting to that, and have them committed against their will because the person has decided not to follow doctors orders. Every single time I say no I end up on the business end of a tirade from an entitled M.D. and told I’m not being a team player.

 

[B_subgirrl]

I'm wrong. In Florida, the PBoR does not guarantee us the right to seek a second opinion. That is... stunning.

Wow! I don't know what else to say except wow.

On an unrelated note, I found the following as a comment on the situation. It's on the first page Helga links to, which you can get to by following the links from the OP's originally linked article:

Also wow. Good on him for doing what's right instead of being a 'team player'. I can't believe 'non-compliance' even COULD be cited as a reason for involuntary admittance.

 

[B_crackoff]

Doesn't this come under some kind of child destruction laws? I.e if a 3rd party damages you & the unborn child it becomes murder, or if (3rd trimester on)the mother is substance abusing etc.

It's impossible to know without the full details of the case - mental capacity etc, but surely the doctor recognised the risk of miscarriage, & applied whatever guidelines exist.

I don't have much time for the medical service at all, but it's a bit harsh for some to believe that the miscarriage was because of hospitalisation, rather than the fulfilment of the risk.

Isn't there a waiver system? In such a litigious culture, the medical profession has to cover its ass.

It was a female doctor, & Burton was still smoking.

Doctor Gets Court Order to Confine Pregnant Woman Against Her Will | Change.org News

If you want to change the law, you'll have to get rid of child destruction laws too.

I'm ambivalent on this - it's sods law either way.

 

[EllieP]

Sweetheart, this is Florida, probably the reddest of the red states. Gainesville is the only tinge of blue, well except for maybe Key West, that you'll find. Yes, I can truly believe the entire story having lived here for a few years.

Don't even talk about women's issues in public or you will be branded forever. Trust me on this one. Even talking with other women they sometimes become aghast that I would even think about reproductive rights.