Prenuptials--yes or no

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by B_RoysToy, Oct 11, 2005.

  1. B_RoysToy

    B_RoysToy New Member

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    Recently I've learned that more and more married women are getting divorced after child birth, getting alimony as well as custody of the child/children, and taking the spouse for most of what he's worth financially. With marriage becoming later and later in life, ofttimes one or both might own quite a lot in material wealth. Not all states' divorce laws are equal.

    My son and some of his friends are skeptical of marrying because of this becoming so prevalent among people of their age group. What is your opinion of a couple signing a prenuptial agreeing on the conditions that will follow in case of divorce? My son and I are for it, but one of my daughters says, "No, that sets the stage for a future split, which might not come without being anticipated."

    I welcome your opinions and comments re. this. Thanks.

    Luke
     
  2. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree? Sex
    I agree with your son: far smarter not to get married in the first place.
     
  3. Shelby

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    Ah the delicious irony. Feminists have played the victim card so skillfully that men are becoming more reluctant to marry.

    Beautiful.
     
  4. Dr. Dilznick

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    Fixed.
     
  5. GottaBigOne

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    Marriage is a legal contract. There should be aggreed to guidlines about how such a contract will be dissolved.
     
  6. SUMYUNGUY

    SUMYUNGUY New Member

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    If a woman has a problem signing a prenup then don't marry her.
     
  7. madame_zora

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    Exactly right! If a woman is hesitant about signing a prenup, run like hell!
     
  8. D_Barbi_Queue

    D_Barbi_Queue Account Disabled

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    The best thing is that if we're married to a guy for at least 7 yrs, we get to draw some of his social security! *maniacal laugh*

    But seriously, I don't mind the idea of a pre-nup as long as I'm not giving up my life to advance his and then possibly getting screwed in the end. Not saying that I would have to walk away with a Anna Nicole Smith type of sum (at least she's getting paid to advertise with Trim Spa - ha/ha) but something that would allow me to go back to school and get my Masters since I've otherwise given up my time/career to raise our kids.
     
  9. jay_too

    jay_too New Member

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    I remember a long conversation about this last winter. I think there were at least two lawyer types involved. Penuptials are often not enforceable. If so, this means they are worthless.
     
  10. bigenuf

    bigenuf New Member

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    If raising your kids is perceived as giving up your time or career, then by all means don't have kids.
     
  11. madame_zora

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    If raising your kids is perceived as giving up your time or career, then by all means don't have kids.
    [post=350693]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]


    Well, that's pretty fucking rude. I guess the woman is the only one who's responsible for those kids? STFU.

    Texass, I think there are ways of dealing with that issue through a prenup. Many women have been where you are, and have put their own education on hold to help put their husband through school and rasie the kids so that one parent can be at home. This IS something that should be considered in a prenup, obviously. If you invested in his education and therefore didn't get to finish your own, he should help you to the same extent that you helped him, and BOTH parties should share the financial responsibility for the children in percentages by income.
     
  12. SUMYUNGUY

    SUMYUNGUY New Member

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    One word: Sexism
     
  13. Love-it

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    If you don't have a prenup, watch for the following; this happened to a close friend:

    1. Pick up the mail at least half of the time and watch for credit cards that you aren't familiar with: last count 23 for a total of $83,000 unaccounted for and paid in the divorce settlement.

    2. In California a spouse is not required to co-sign on a second mortgage or home equity loan: $35,000 unaccounted for and paid off in the divorce settlement.

    3. Help pay the bills and/or keep track of the checking account(s) for unusual payments: no idea of money lost.

    4. If your spouse has a home business or is self employed pay attention to the cost of doing business and profits. Unknown amount of money in a foreign bank account, no password or location all that is known is an account number. The judicial system and IRS don't have the resources or time to track the small fry. The spouse made money and hid it from everybody.

    5. Pay-Pal accounts can hide a lot.

    6. If the spouse is hanging around with a lot of recently divorced, or in the process of getting a divorce, people they will learn a lot of tricks on how to screw over their significant other: Here is one nasty trick that really hurt my friend: the spouse talked about the divorce with every lawyer in the county, my friend then had to find a lawyer from over 100 miles away. Admittedly it is a small town/county but they can put the hurt on you in more ways than you can imagine.

    I am sure that there are a lot of other signs of trouble out there but these are the ones that caused my friend the most financial grief.
     
  14. DC_DEEP

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    Hmm, I like her reasoning, maybe if I don't write a will (that is, anticipate dying,) then I won't die.

    A prenup is a good idea, especially if either or both involved have accumulated any real property or material wealth. It always seems that if neither person really owns much, a male will usually be for it and a female against it - I know, that sounds sexist, but that's often the case. About the only time I have known of women supporting signing a prenup is if SHE has lots of property or wealth, and her fiancee does not. Otherwise, it just does not seem romantic... "isn't out love enough? We will NEVER divorce, we aren't like everyone else."
     
  15. Shelby

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    What should your husband get?
     
  16. D_Barbi_Queue

    D_Barbi_Queue Account Disabled

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    Thanks MZ.

    Shelby, you missed the point. He always has a wife that's devoted her life to raising his kids and maintaining the household while he's out there working his ass of to "bring home the bacon."

    Besides, I don't say this for my current situation. I love my man and expect that we'll be married for many more years. I just wanted to offer the flip side of the coin. It's not all fun and games for women in a marriage either and sometimes they make sacrifices for a marriage and husband that should be respected if the relationship splits up.
     
  17. madame_zora

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    I think fairness is hard to arrive at when emotions are running high. You must first consider WHY the relationship is splitting up. In cases where it's mutually agreed that things are just not working, there is less likelihood of an ugly battle through divorce- often a dissilusionment will do the trick. If it's a case where infidelity has been the issue, it's likely to be an ugly scene.

    A prenup would protect BOTH parties and underscore what the results would be in different circumstances. Marriage is a contract, and when the terms of any contract are borken, there need to be clear plans for how to dissolve the corporation.

    SUMYUNGUY, you posted "One word-sexism" after I clearly outlined a fair and equitable disopsition. What exactly is your problem? If you're just a troll who wants to argue with anything anyone says, please tell me so I can quit wasting words on you.

    The things that need to be weighed in the prenup and compared to reality at the end of said marriage are:

    1) What each brought in to the marriage

    2) How each increased in personal worth and marketability through education

    3) How the cost of said education was distributed

    4) Changes in income for each party

    5) If children were born issue of said marriage and care given primarily by one spouse during the term of said marriage, this should be seen as loss of income as measured by their work history prior to their births.

    NOW, I do know of some women who never discussed being a stay-at-home mom with their husband before getting pregnant and dropped the bomb on him AFTER she was pregnant, and I do NOT feel that deception should be rewarded. However, the time to address this is right away. If the guy lets the situation continue, it's pretty hard to complain about it five years later.

    Generally speaking, I fell that each party should take from a marriage the same percentage of assets that they brought in, and if one spouse has helped the other pay for their education during the term of the marriage, that some repayment is in order.
    In the case of non-working spouses, where that was an agreed upon aspect of the marriage, I think support is in order, depending on the length of the marriage. I detest older men trading in their aging wives who have stood by them for a twenty-something when they're in their 50's and then think they shouldn't owe their wife anything more than the old "heave ho". Personally, I'd never be in that position, but that's the American Values way.

    Let me ask some of the men here, what do you think is fair? Does it matter if it's just a case of growing apart or if there's infidelity?
     
  18. bigenuf

    bigenuf New Member

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    Well, that's pretty fucking rude. I guess the woman is the only one who's responsible for those kids? STFU.

    Texass, I think there are ways of dealing with that issue through a prenup. Many women have been where you are, and have put their own education on hold to help put their husband through school and rasie the kids so that one parent can be at home. This IS something that should be considered in a prenup, obviously. If you invested in his education and therefore didn't get to finish your own, he should help you to the same extent that you helped him, and BOTH parties should share the financial responsibility for the children in percentages by income.
    [post=350700]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/b][/quote]

    Please point out where in my comment the part that says this applys only to women.
     
  19. madame_zora

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    Well, because your comment was a direct response TO Texass, who we know is a woman. If you didn't mean it to be directed to her, you shouldn't have used the words
    "your kids" or "your career". When people speak in generalities, they say "one's kids" and "one's career".

    Besides, your point was flat. Anyone who has kids knows that those things are sacrificed for a time. Your suggestion was almost as clever as abstinence only programs.
     
  20. GottaBigOne

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    Texass, it is interesting that you seem to view the bearing and raising of children as aduty a woman has to her husband, and not a concious selfish choice she makes for her own interests. Maybe it is the historical aspect of marriage that has creeped into your psyche where you feel that marriage is all about benefitting the husband and not the wife, which is totally evil and one of the worst things about marriage( its history). The husband should not be accountable for the choices that a woman makes in regards to her life. if "one"(thanks madam) makes the choice to forgo college in order to have kids the consequences of that choice rest on "one's" shoulders and not "one's" spouse. Should a woman have to pay alimony if her husband sacrificed the career he dreamed of in order to get a more profitable, but less disireable job in order to support his family? of course not, he made the choice, he must live with the consequences of that choice. just because life didn't turn outthe way he wanted it to doesn't mean he gets a do-over. No spouse owes the other spouse anything for being married to them, it should not be a favor. if it is then they deserve what comes to them, and they deserve the heartache and trials of divorce because they did not understand what they were getting into and treated it far to lightly.
     
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