Principal Quits Over GBLT/Straight Alliance in School

[B_Jennuine73]

The principal made a big deal and obvious case for homophobia. I agree he could have just said "I am resigning for personal reasons." He couldn't do that and push his agenda though.

Religious beliefs are fine unless those beliefs are used to take away basic human rights and dignity.

 

[Shelby]

Faceking and shelby's point of view
never stray to far from F-A-R W-R-O-N-G!!!
cigarbabe:saevil:

Whatever.

The point is I think everybody's wrong at some level.

Surprise! Me included.

 

[DC_DEEP]

I never said I would approve or disapprove of either of these examples. I threw them out merely to see if anyone would apply their personal values against them much as the principal did his. If you were in his shoes and groups such as these formed would you resign or embrace them in the spirit of toleration.

You are using the old "Have you stopped beating your wife, yes or no?" tactic. Not gonna work here. Try again.

 

[Shelby]

You are using the old "Have you stopped beating your wife, yes or no?" tactic. Not gonna work here. Try again.

Really?

I thought I was trying to say no one's perfect.

 

[DC_DEEP]

Really?

I thought I was trying to say no one's perfect.

Perhaps in your response to cigarbabe, but not in your response to me. I still say your comparison of a racist group to a support group was misleading, and I'm guessing your intention was to be able to say "Aha! You are a hypocrite."

I suspect, or at least I hope, that a lot of what you post is not actually how you feel about any given subject, but rather playing devil's advocate to get people to think.

Keep in mind, though, there's a big difference between the composition of the group, and what the group is striving to accomplish. The principal resigned because there would be openly homosexual members, and he doesn't like homosexuals. The fact that the purpose of the group was to promote depolarizing the students, and encourage a less hostile environment, made no difference to him.

I know you understand that, even if you don't admit it.

 

[Rugbypup]

Right or wrong, he has a point.

If there was a heterosexual only school club, people would still raise merry hell. How is this different from him saying no to whites only or blacks only clubs.

They're completely separatist and shouldn't be encouraged. A school club should be based on a common interest or activity, not sexuality and or race.

 

[DC_DEEP]

Right or wrong, he has a point.

If there was a heterosexual only school club, people would still raise merry hell. How is this different from him saying no to whites only or blacks only clubs.

They're completely separatist and shouldn't be encouraged. A school club should be based on a common interest or activity, not sexuality and or race.

But Rugbypup, that's the point. He didn't quit over a "queers only" club. He quit over a club that encourages gay, straight, lesbian, bisexual, and transgendered students to join. You didn't get that from the OP or any of the subsequent posts?

 

[Stephenmass]

[The principal of a South Carolina public school announced he plans to resign following a demand to launch a student club to promote homosexuality.
/QUOTE]

I think the very first statement of the original post shows the way this principal is thinking. He looks at it as a club "PROMOTING" homosexuality, instead of a club simply created so whatever you are, people accept you. It isn't a gay only club. It isn't a straight only. It's all of them combined.

I think he looks at it as a "recruiting station". Bigot. Idiot.

 

[Ms.Teacher]

To be honest, I think these sorts of alliances ostracize minority groups even further by creating unnecessary polarizations. That's the basis of why I'd be against it. It's self-defeating. We can't possibly teach kids how to be accepting of homosexuals if people insist on creating segregations in every aspect of life. It's yet another completely fruitless 'them and us' situation, which is pretty much the problem with the world today if you ask me. I'd rather schools introduced a class about tolerance rather than creating clubs based on orientation.

I tend to agree. What often happens is the straight kids are ostracized for joining such a group and associating with gay students. It's almost like no win situation.

Religious beliefs are fine unless those beliefs are used to take away basic human rights and dignity.

Rather than try to stop this club from happening, he's resigning, so he's not taking away anyone's rights. He's leaving a perfectly good job over something that goes against his core beliefs.

"I feel the formation of a Gay/Straight Alliance Club at Irmo High school implies that students joining the club will have chosen to or will choose to engage in sexual activity with members of the same sex, opposite sex or members of both sexes."

It's not a sex club. I don't get where he's going with this.

"My decision to resign is a personal choice based on my professional beliefs and religious convictions. I have prayed about this decision for a period of time, and I have a peace about it. I would ask that you respect my choice as I respect your choice to disagree with me on this issue," he wrote.

He's entitled to resign from his position for whatever reason. When he interviews for other positions, his reasons for leaving that school are either going to work for him or against him.

 

[Shelby]

Perhaps in your response to cigarbabe, but not in your response to me. I still say your comparison of a racist group to a support group was misleading, and I'm guessing your intention was to be able to say "Aha! You are a hypocrite."

I suspect, or at least I hope, that a lot of what you post is not actually how you feel about any given subject, but rather playing devil's advocate to get people to think.

Keep in mind, though, there's a big difference between the composition of the group, and what the group is striving to accomplish. The principal resigned because there would be openly homosexual members, and he doesn't like homosexuals. The fact that the purpose of the group was to promote depolarizing the students, and encourage a less hostile environment, made no difference to him.

I know you understand that, even if you don't admit it.

1. not really, maybe a little

2. thanks for getting me

3. I agree.

4. I do and I do. :wink:

 

[Lex]

As such it's not a bad idea, I'm just doubtful of the kids' ability to make it work and not create divides amongst themselves as a result of it. It's often the case that when you highlight a sensitive issue, you invariably make it worse. I feel that drawing attention to people's orientation in this particular way, even in the context of an alliance, gives kids more ammunition with regards to labels and cliques, because their feelings are being officialized, which by definition pigeonholes people. Of course, you hope that it does encourage tolerance and provide support, but you can never really be sure how something like this will pan out. It's one of those things that would work in a perfect world, but might not in the real one. In any case, I'm just calling it the way I see it, and I might well be way off, especially if they have documented cases of this working out fine in other schools.

You should read some of the current research on teens and their attitudes towards togetherness and orientation.

Time Magazine did a cover story a few years ago, called The Battle Over Gay Teens.

Here is a link.

Points the article makes:

• Teens are feeling safer at school, more self-aware and connected to each other (thanks to the internet) and coming out earlier and earlier.
• More and more gay-straight alliances are forming.
• The majority of high school students and college underclassmen are not by the idea of gay rights. In fact, even amongst self-identified conservative youth, the issue of gay marriage is more of a non-issue.
• This all scares the crap out of some conservative groups, who, understanding that these youth as the next wave of voters, are trying to take their more conservative messages into schools under the guise of new character education resources. Additionally, the more liberal leaning organizations are trying to empower and promote there alliances.

I encourage you to read the article and rethink your thoughts on these alliances.

I'll give the victim spiel a rest. You all know me already anyway.

I'll spin it different. Suppose some racists, on both sides of the fence, got together and formed a club called the Black/White Alliance for Racial Purity. How would that rub you?

Or even more provocative how would you feel about a group forming whose sole purpose was to 'help' turn homosexuals straight?

Actually, as a principal, you would probably have to allow the club to form as long as they abided by school system rules.

Keeping in mind: I was a teacher, an assistant principal and work for a large school system.

And, as DC DEEP pointed out, your analogy does not really hold well in this case.

 

[FuzzyKen]

One of the major points being missed here is the legal precedent in the article or report. If they ban this particular group they then would have to ban all the groups from meeting on campus.

This would mean literally that if they ban the GLBT alliance group they also have to ban the Jerry Falwell Memorial Bible Study group too. He may personally favor the example of the Jerry Falwell group, but the antidescriminatory policy issued by the School District legal department is very clear.

I can see both good and bad in this type of group on a secondary school campus. The good or bad would depend on the attitues and defenses of that particular school with regards to security.

Teens attending group meetings could quickly be targeted by individuals with very bad intentions.

I may intensely dislike this Principals viewpoint, but, I respect that he is man enough to openly and honestly proclaim his own intolerance for other viewpoints than his own. This man, by proclaiming his actions to the press in this manner has just ensured himself unemployment, and status as a political football to anyone who is not a Christian Fundementalist. He has also insured that a job with ANY school district outside private secular schools will be denied him. He may be in the unemployment line for quite a while.

What you can expect in the next few months is that he will now be making the rounds on the Christian Broadcast Stations stating how he felt that this would be "promoting" homosexuality. You can also be assured that if he can't articulate this that Pat Robertson's script writers will do everything they can to make him look like a common sense articulate and intelligent person fighting for a principle when in fact he is a "phobe" fighting for bigotry.

Sadly, as I have said before: "Bigotry, intolerance and descrimination are alive and well!"

 

[Lex]

One of the major points being missed here is the legal precedent in the article or report. If they ban this particular group they then would have to ban all the groups from meeting on campus.

This would mean literally that if they ban the GLBT alliance group they also have to ban the Jerry Falwell Memorial Bible Study group too. He may personally favor the example of the Jerry Falwell group, but the antidescriminatory policy issued by the School District legal department is very clear.
...

This is the exact point I tried to make with my second post.

Really? As a former school administrator and someone who was taught school law--I don't get it at all. You can feel the way you feel--but the law is absolutely clear on the issue of allowing certain groups to organize and use school property while not allowing others. Either you let them all or you let none of them.

...

 

[vindicator]

Clearly this principal has a GROSS misunderstanding as to what a Gay/Straight alliance is.

The suggestion that straight people are being recruited, in school no less, is laughable.

The whole point of the Gay/Straight alliance is to open up a dialog between gay and straight people so that they can come closer together. You can't work out differences with others without talking to them and trying to understand their position.

We had a Social Climate Committee in my school which was pretty much the same idea as the gay/straight alliance but it was for people of different races and cultures. It worked out great. We got to talk, hang out, go out and do cool shit and get to know other people. I learned a lot about other cultures and races. The point is.... talking works.

Very dumb move on the principals side. You would give up your job without even taking the time to understand what the club is about? Any thought that gay and straight people might actually get to know each other must have been to much for them.

 

[B_jacknapier]

A gay/straight alliance club is for gays and straights, obviously. However, it also obviously has the goal of legitimizing homosexuality. Right or wrong, this man apparently has a problem with the idea of homosexuality being legitimized. This is a religious belief. The more orthodox sects of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam all agree that homosexual contact is sinful.

I don't agree, but I understand that this man felt the need to resign his post based on his religious views, and I respect his right to do so.

Saying so doesn't make me a homophobe or a bigot, either.

 

[Lex]

A gay/straight alliance club is for gays and straights, obviously. However, it also obviously has the goal of legitimizing homosexuality.

I wasn't under the impression that homosexuality has to be legitimized. I wasn't under the impression that people's fundamental being has to go through judgment in the eyes of other people. People should be allowed to be who they are, and homogeneity is boring.

Again, you have no idea what these alliances are about. There is nothing to legitimize. Some people are straight, some people are gay, some people are bisexual, some people are transgendered, some people are Black, some people are White, some are male, some are female. None of those traits should need anyone's approval or acceptance.

The goal of these alliances is to show unity, support, and make people feel accepted. How anyone can think that is a bad idea is beyond me. I did not understand it as a Black teen who grew up with friends of all races and was a part of a club in school. And I don't understand it as a Black, gay male who has kids, straight and gay friends, butch and fem friends (male and female). People who have differences getting together to celebrate their sameness is always good by me.

 

[B_jacknapier]

Are you saying that some people don't consider a homosexual lifestyle to be illegitimate? Some people don't accept it. The club is designed to promote acceptance. That's all I'm saying.


The very fact that gay marriage is only sanctioned in 2 states proves that some people don't consider homosexuality to be a legitimate lifestyle. Hence, to those people, it could be legitimized.


::rolls eyes::

 

[kalipygian]

GSA's are very far from being gay clubs. Several here have gone through periods in which the most active members were straight kids. Certainly straight faculty are just about the only ones who feel secure enough to be sponsors.
I am not sure when the first one nationally was started, the first here in Anchorage was about ten years ago, now they are in all the HS's. Also both HS's in Fairbanks and the one in Juneau. They work very well.

 

[DC_DEEP]

Are you saying that some people don't consider a homosexual lifestyle to be illegitimate? Some people don't accept it. The club is designed to promote acceptance. That's all I'm saying.


The very fact that gay marriage is only sanctioned in 2 states proves that some people don't consider homosexuality to be a legitimate lifestyle. Hence, to those people, it could be legitimized.


::rolls eyes::

I don't think bigotry is justified, nor is it legitimate in my book.

And majority opinion is never a good measure of worthiness when it comes to civil liberties. The 48 states that do not recognize same-gender marriage only emphasize the ignorance of the masses in those states.

 

[B_jacknapier]

Hey, I never said it was right. I just said that when someone doesn't consider a lifestyle to be legitimate, it can sometimes be legitimized in their mind through outside help.