Publicity ploy to close Gitmo blowing up in Obama's face

Discussion in 'Politics' started by B_starinvestor, May 20, 2009.

  1. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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  2. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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  3. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    Bush III on foreign policy. Again and again and again...
     
  4. tripod

    Gold Member

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    Well aren't you happy now? Isn't Bush III a dream for conservatives? Conservatives would have tossed his salad if he asked them to...
     
  5. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    happy that some of Obama's false promises and PR stunts are coming to light.

    In my circles, don't know of anyone that was thrilled with Bush, most think he was a poor president, however overly-crucified by media and left.

    Obama is an amazing charmer, in the end has no backbone and won't accomplish much, if anything; will set us back economically

    Dazzling publicity efforts will lose luster as time passes
     
  6. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    As usual, much ado about nothing.
    Especially when you consider that conservatives like McCain was also asking for the closing of Gitmo during the election. Only NOW do they see it as a problem. Ummmm, yeah...

    Some of you conservitards are so hypocritically transparent it's beyond laughable. Wake me when Cheney, Wolfowitz and Rumsfeld are being tried for war crimes, OK? :rolleyes:
     
  7. houtx48

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    does star want to toss some salad, but which guy?
     
  8. D_Sir Fitzwilly Wankheimer III

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    Tru dat. I can't wait to see what he does with Iran!
     
  9. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    empty lib rhetoric smashes up against reality
     
  10. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    And I'm sure in your reality, unicorns and leprechauns exist as well. :rolleyes:
     
  11. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    through all of your swarmy jokes, i haven't seen an admission that Obama pulled another bait & switch.
     
  12. D_Tully Tunnelrat

    D_Tully Tunnelrat New Member

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    Star as usual you are reading into the article, even written by FN, what you want to hear. The article does not call it an Obama publicity stunt, and it is is not one. Gitmo needs to be closed because it is a symbol of the US ignoring the applicability of the Geneva Conventions, and a great recruitment tool for Al-Queda, thus the photos specifically depicting the abuses, were not released.

    I agree that Obama's push for a specific time based closure for Gitmo was premature, and as a law professor, he knew that the legal status, and appropriate process for the detainees had to be established BEFORE closing the base. Since this legal approach has not yet been agreed upon, there is no way to move the prisoners anywhere that is politicaly palatable.

    However the legal process will take place over time, and Gitmo will be closed, even if it means shipping the prisoners back to their homelands. Whereas it is a setback for Barack, it is hardly a repudiation. It is also not a problem of his creation, and so he will likely not suffer greatly in opinon polls because of it.

    If you are waiting for Barack to get taken down a peg, you will have to wait a bit longer.
     
  13. B_Nick8

    B_Nick8 New Member

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    It is unequivocally not about pandering, public relations tricks and popularity contests to try to both live up to one's campaign promise as well as to do what one believes is morally and ethically right, only to be thwarted by others who are not bound by those same constraints. To do differently would be disingenuous. If, in the end, the goal cannot be fully accomplished and/or compromises have to be made due to Congressional action, there is more than enough blame to go around but your version of it is ludicrous.

    And, once again, oh master of hyperbole, all this is "taking away from [his] governing", how?
     
    #13 B_Nick8, May 20, 2009
    Last edited: May 20, 2009
  14. sparky11point5

    sparky11point5 New Member

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    A real news outlet might point out that this was push-back by Congress to assert its authority. That is, Dems and Repubs can agree on one thing -- after 8 years of presidential orders on issues like this, they want to be included in creating the Gitmo plan, and are not willing simply to fund the Administrations.

    I know this is a subtle point of politics, and does not really fit into Star's ongoing morality play titled "Liberals are Really Bad and Obama is Just Popular!"
     
  15. midlifebear

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    Isn't there enough room at Fort. Leavenworth to house the Gitmo guys? After all, that's the hallowed ground where the military trains our brave soldiers on how to ferret out, deal with and otherwise engage modern terrorists. I'm sure Obama has enough pull to transfer all of the Gitmo detainees to Leavenworth. During WWII, Obama's mother, Ann Dunham, was born at the fort while her father was stationed there. I'm sure there's at least one marker Obama can call in just for that fact alone. Plus, Kansas has lots of room.
     
  16. Flashy

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    well, the events of this morning (last night)

    just sealed the deal.


    three of these four men that tried to blow up two Jewish temples were americans, who converted to islam in prison.

    no way in hell Obama can bring anyone to the US from Gitmo now.

    dangerous islamic terrorists, in US prisons, with a large population of angry, jailed men, who have converted to Islam in prison?

    recipe for disaster.

    we shall see how this plays out...but this just gave republicans and democrats opposed to the plan to bring these terrorists up to the USA from Gitmo, all the ammo they need...

    and rightly so.

    Leave them in Gitmo, and leave it open. do what needs to be done to monitor their well being, but don't let them anywhere near this country.
     
  17. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    fyi

    Obama Revives Guantanamo Tribunals : NPR

    Bush III

    :banghead2:
     
  18. b.c.

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    Why Bush III? Is everything with you either black or white?

    Sounds like a person trying to uphold legal procedure and fair prosecution while trying to undo the effects of the legacy Bush's policies of torture have wrought. From the article you cite:

    But the tribunals will include new legal protections for terror suspects, President Obama said in a three-paragraph statement. "This is the best way to protect our country, while upholding our deeply held values," he said.

    and:

    White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said the new tribunals are designed to provide detainees better protections in court than the earlier commissions. He said the new tribunals "represent a far different system" than the earlier commissions under the Bush administration.

    Among the new rules: restrictions on hearsay evidence; any evidence collected through torture or abuse will be banned; detainees can change their military lawyers; and detainees won't be sanctioned if they refuse to testify.

    Maybe not perfect, but a start. Nor, as you suggest, is the Demo's lack of support for housing Gitmo's prisoners on U.S. soil a "blow up" in Obama's face. I wouldn't support it either. This is a work in progress, and most (in their right minds at least) including McCain, agree for Gitmo's need to close, wherever the detainees are housed.
     
    #18 b.c., May 21, 2009
    Last edited: May 21, 2009
  19. SilverTrain

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    Since US prisons are already brimming with serial murderers and rapists, there is no legitimacy to the "furor play" being acted out on the national political stage.

    Prisons are designed to detain society's most dangerous criminals. Every state in the union has many, many extremely dangerous sociopaths housed in some very sophisticated and secure prisons. Ever heard of Pelican Bay?

    So this is a political football. And Obama seems to be the only one with the balls to speak honestly, forthrightly, maturely, and to be willing to tackle some tough decision-making. Everyone else, including Republican and Democratic politicians, are succumbing to playing with the chickenshit fear cards.

    "Don't put the brown people near us," Seems to be the prevailing sentiment.

    "Manson, McVeigh, they're ok. But no furriners."
     
  20. midlifebear

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    Again, there's plenty of room at Fort Leavenworth, but that would mean bringing foreign detainees onto US soil and we CAN'T have THAT, now . . . can we? No. The USA needs a "special" place on the shores of a "communist" country where the US military can conduct illegal clandestine torture and not be held accountable for it.

    I just made the effort to pull down both Obama's speech given yesterday and Cheney's speech railing at Obama about the same time. Hasn't anyone told Cheney that he is no longer the Vice President of the United States? Biden may be a blowhard, but Cheney is outright evil. He's been churning up bad advice in the White House since Nixon was listening to bad advice on how congress might be convinced to repeal the Republican Bill that limited the terms of the US President to only two terms. It's time someone gently set their fasers to "fabulous!" and stunned the ex VP into a harmless Martha Stewart hobby that will keep him out of harms way and happy until his ticker stops ticking.
     
    #20 midlifebear, May 22, 2009
    Last edited: May 22, 2009
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