Queer, offensive word?

fortiesfun

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Lots of good information here already.

Kalipygian's etomology work is very helpful, but doesn't quite tell the OP what he needs to know about the connotations of the word. The offensiveness of "Queer" is still there unless the word is used in carefully controlled, formal ways to mark it as an academic term, or very casually as an in-group joke. If you are a non-native speaker, like the OP, be careful about using it at all, as it is difficult to master the nuances of language that render it safe.

Just thought I might add that in an academic sense, as in Queer Theory, Queer is seen as an umbrella term encompassing all sexual non-conformists including gays, lesbians, transexuals, bisexuals, and asexuals. Gay is usually used in those same circles to mean more specifically just male-male homosexuality.

Gay is a medieval word but it wasn't until the 1920's that it was first used to mean specifically male-male homosexuality. And it wasn't until relatively recently, (Mid 80s?) that it became widely used in a perjorative sense, as in "That's so gay." In earlier literature and film you almost always hear "queer" used as the insult.
 

Hunkguy39

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Gay is a shorthand for sexual minorities, The fullest list is: gay, lesbian, bi, queer, questioning, transexual, transvestite, polyamorous, and straight allies.

The word homosexual is not old, it was made up in the 1860's by a Hungarian in Bavaria. It consists of a latin root with a greek modifier. Because of it's subsequent use as describing psychopathology, I prefer not to use it. (the 'scientific' equivalent of the christian sodomite)The word 'heterosexual' was made up around 1930.(also a greek/latin bastardisation. (the brits say: hoomoo-sets-yoo-el)

The real classical greek equivalent is paiderastos, (modern pederasty) it isn't used because it is now taken to mean having sex with a child. It literaly translates as boy love, but in classical greece it had a more general male - male love sense. Plato used 'philogynaikes', (loversers of women) for heterosexual men, 'philandroi' (lovers of men) for heterosexual women, 'etairistriai' (companions) for lesbian in the Symposium and Dialogues. (lesbian meant a literary woman)

'Homophile' would be a better all greek word, also a neologism. It doesn't imply that we are just about sex. There is also a classical greek word, 'isophile'.
Homophile=Ομοφυλόφιλος=being atracted to someone of the same sex
I find all other words like:
gay=always in the mood, happy,funny
queer=odd, strange,different
Fag=feminime guy,guy that acts like a girl, not appropriate.
 

kalipygian

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Homophile=Ομοφυλόφιλος=being atracted to someone of the same sex
I find all other words like:
gay=always in the mood, happy,funny
queer=odd, strange,different
Fag=feminime guy,guy that acts like a girl, not appropriate.

The modern greek term here is transliterated as:(h)omophilophilos, translated:'same love-love'

So, if we're not particularly fond of any of the terms applied to us, does that (eeek) mean we aren't very comfortable with ourselves?

Plato also referred to love of the soul, divine or heavenly love, 'eros ouranos', and (classical greeks were very misogynistic, sorry) he considered it could only exist between men, heterosexual love was 'eros pandemos', of all the people. Thus another 19thc term which didn't catch on: 'urning', from divine.
 

Lucky_Luke

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I consider 'queer' to be a much more accurate word of description and the one I use by preference, though homosexual is okay too.

The term 'gay' seems to apply to some stereotype identity that I don't identify with.
 

Knockernail

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Ok. Thanks everybody. Reading this i see how hick i become to be.

D, if you read this, forgive me. You know i´m just a rude donkey spanish-hick.

Anyway, isn´t easy being correct and polite nowaday; maybe the goodstuff is not using any label, yes. Maybe discussing, explainning and helping to comprehend would be a nice first step.

It´s difficult not difference a collective determined to being different. That´s how i see it. Just take a look at profiles. The great most of members have identificated their sexual orientation, gays and bis above all. There is a Day of pride. Being gay, homo (or just the name you ever want) become a way of life. I always thought that a gay was just a man who feels attraction towards men (or girl towards girls), but a man above all, with the virtues and defects of the rest of men. Seems that i was/am wrong. Being gay includes a behaviour, a form to understand life. You can be a woman, a man or a gay (queer?).

I´m not agree with it, but i accept it. The problem comes when i´ve got to deal with a gay. And, please, don´t tell me "as you´d do it with another". We all know that´s not entirely true. In fact, boys and girls have a careful treatment within them, like gays and heteros. Surely i´d let a friend of mine grabbing my pack, but i wouldn´t with a gay, as a girl lets do it to another girl (friend) but not to a boy.

While we keep on playing different roles, we´ll keep on needing labels and distances.

This is what i think and understand.
 

DC_DEEP

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That 'fag' or 'fagot' as a derisive term for gay people derives from us being burned at the stake is just conjecture, and not as likely as some other possible derivations, I think.

The death penalty was on the books and was carried out in britain and america, but not ever by burning, as far as I am aware. It was on the continent.

<...>
The Brits also use it to refer to cigarette butts and sausages.
I did not say it derived from us being burned at the stake. I said it derived from the perception of some fundamentals that we should. Big difference.

Cigarettes burn too, don't they?

A faggot is a bundle of kindling sticks. Do you have an etymology (not an anecdotal history, a real etymology) of "fag" (not faggot, but fag)? Especially in the context of being "fagged out"?
 

D_Elijah_MorganWood

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It's not one of my favorite words and not a word I use to describe myself but it's like a few others...it depends who's saying it and how it's being said. I may have to duck flying objects here but I noticed the really feminine guys picking up this term in L.A. in the very early 90's. Feminists are now attempting to do the same thing with the word cunt...take it back thus removing the power.
 
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Why continue to give these offensive words the light of day by posting them? As long as they continue to get an offended reaction from the people they are intended to hurt, the use will continue. The reaction is the desired result of these bigots. However, that does not mean it is acceptable to use them, or allow people to use them. Education, understanding and acceptance are so important. Ignorance and stupidity are hard things to combat. The words just need to go away.
 

husky14620

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I agree with several of the others who have responded that its offensiveness depends on by whom, and how, it is used. Much like black people, especially rappers, use the word ni..., some gay people routinely use words like fag, queer, dyke, fruit, etc. while others cringe at the sound. Even gay is used as a pejorative now by so many straights, i.e. "That's so gay!", that one treads on thin ice even using it in the wrong company.

As long as we are sensitive to the words, they will be used to inflict pain, and as long as there are those who would use them to inflict pain, we will be sensitive to them.
 

Standard Deviant

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This is a very important topic! The political and cultural implications are tremendous.

The term "queer" was totally perjorative 40-50 years ago. There was a transitional period in the 1980s when gays turned this around by claiming it as their own. This was an incredibly smart move! It evinced a feeling of being above the name-calling, a terrific sense of confidence and security.

There was a time in the very early 1970s when "the 'N' word" was on its way to being diluted in the same fashion, and I deeply regret that the effort failed, because now the WORD has become imbued with much more power as a result of the taboo surrounding it. I HATE the euphemism "The N word" even more than I hate the word itself. When discussing the history of the civil rights movement, we should simply use the actual word "nigger", in my opinion, as long as it isn't being used in a hateful way, but to refer to it in an intelligent context. I believe, based on the way the word "queer" was diffused, that this would eventually wipe out all the power of the word "nigger," as well.

The Guerrilla Girls, the activist feminst group from New York, have demonstrated that this can be effective in their reclamation of the term "girls," which was considered highly offensive by feminists when talking about women.

A willingness to be offended on occasion, especially in service of a good cause, a good intention, an effort to achieve a positive result, is part of what makes democracy work. The insistence that nobody must ever be offended results in Taliban-like societies, even when the intent is good.
 

headbang8

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The term "queer" was totally perjorative 40-50 years ago. There was a transitional period in the 1980s when gays turned this around by claiming it as their own. This was an incredibly smart move! It evinced a feeling of being above the name-calling, a terrific sense of confidence and security.

A willingness to be offended on occasion, especially in service of a good cause, a good intention, an effort to achieve a positive result, is part of what makes democracy work. The insistence that nobody must ever be offended results in Taliban-like societies, even when the intent is good.
A very sensible position, SD.

Tiptoe around words like fag and hag, and you just build their destructive power. Disarm them through usage, I say.

The word gay has almost reached such a state. Though the word sounds a little frivolous, I can happily call myself gay and be confident that it doesn't reflect badly upon me. More or less.

Many seem disturbed that modern teens use the word "gay" to mean sad. How do you combat it? Be gay, proud, and happy.

Besides, what might we say that's more politically-correct than gay? Queer is a little too broad. Homosexual is OK, but clumsy, and the shorter homo still carries a stigma. Bugger refers to sodomy--neither exclusively, nor universally, practiced by homosexual men. Differently Bloked? Vaginally-challenged? The first and most obvious change in my life on coming out is that I became differently bartendered.
 

basque9

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Queer? Gay? Either have become offensive connotations. I hate hearing either of them directed at anyone.

I could not agree more with your comments chicagosam...however, I am reacting strongly partially because I have known the word queer to be insulting and pejorative for many many years. If it has softened somewhat to younger ears, all well and good. When I hear it I bristle and my adrenalin surges and prepares me to fight! Fifty years ago queer was often preceded by the word dirty, filthy, slimy or "fuckin".

Gay definitely has a gentler, kinder, more civilized meaning and does not agitate me in the same way.

And please, do not use the word homosexual to describe someone's sexuality, with all of its clinical correctness, it is cold and sterile...like referring more to a laboratory specimen, than to a human being.:smile:
 

SteveHd

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...however, I am reacting strongly partially because I have known the word queer to be insulting and pejorative for many many years. If it has softened somewhat to younger ears, all well and good.
To my fifty-year-old ears, "queer" has softened. It isn't offensive to me unless the context suggests it. Word meanings change over time.
And please, do not use the word homosexual ...
That I agree with completely. Besides being clinical, Jerry Falwell and other fundies use that word to a degree which is annoying.
 

D_Coyne Toss

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Well, i think it is all matter of respect, if you know that a person is offended by certain words, just avoid to use them with him/her.

Anyway i think that the the offensivity of a word is in the user's more than in the receiver's mind. And it also depends on the social background where it is pronunciate (concept used by the Italian jurisprudence in matter on insults).
 

davidjh7

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Hate is hate. If someone says any word at you in hate, it is offensive. If someone says a word to you in love, and they know it is in love, then it is welcomed. Since people can often not know whether or not a word is used in hate, it is usually better to err on the side of not using a usually hatefull intentioned word. On the other hand, people can be TOO sensitive, too. For me, it really depends who says something to me. If I like and respect someone, and hear them use the terms queer or faggot as a putdown, then it hurts. If I don't care about the person, they have no effect on my emotions. Call me what you want, I don't care--I've been called worse, and probably recently....:rolleyes:
 

D_Garmanswait Glassnads

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It depends how soemone says it, I take offence by someone calling me gay even if I know they don't mean it or they're just joking. Just insecurities I geuss even though I'm pretty sure I'm straight now.

It's wierd because I'm the most open minded person and I actually like gay people, they're usually the most interesting people.