The only reason Gates was asked outside was so that they could arrest him for causing a public disturbance, which happened to be on his property caused by the police presence.
that is not true Jase...Gates followed him outside yelling at him...and that was not the reason, because Crowley warned gates *twice* once outside. Two verbal warnings, the next while showing handcuffs.
No police officer has the right to arrest someone just for being an asshole and saying what he or she likes in their own home. What part of this do you not understand? The police broke the law, not Gates.
no, he does not have the right to arrest someone for being an asshole in their own home, but, police are entitled to arrest someone for disorderly conduct in public, which, is where Gates was when he continued screaming and badgering Crowley...while in public, he received two warnings.
he did not simply ask him outside, then arrest him the second he got on the porch. That is untrue. If that was the case you would be right based on what you have said above. But that is not what happened at all. Gates was not arrested, until he had come outside, continued to berate the officer and refused to comply with two warnings.
you can yell and scream whatever you like at the police...you can even give them the finger...but, if you do it, and are loud and obnoxious in public, that falls under a variety of statues regarding disorderly conduct.
You know that as well as i do...you can yell and scream at a cop all you like, and not be arrested for yelling and screaming at a cop...thye know that...but it would not be advisable, since yelling and screaming at cops, in public, is and can be classified as disorderly conduct or violations of other public statutes.
The law does NOT give a shit about whether someone was verbally abusive or angry or indignant. It gives a shit about what the letter of the law is. This is why justice, properly administered, is blind.
yes jase you are right, but the law does state to the letter, that someone causing a disruption or being disorderly in public, can be arrested for it.
Gates was no longer inside, he was still yelling and berating the officer while outside, received two warnings while outside, and the mistake he made was doing it in public. once you are in public, disturbing the peace, disorderly conduct, interfering with police business and a host of other laws are all in fact, in play. Screaming, insulting, and berating an officer in public is not illegal...causing a public disturbance, is.
The law the police violated first and foremost is arguably the highest law of the highest legal document in the land, the US Constitution. Sorry Officer, but you don't get to judge who is free to speak or what they say in their own home.
that was never violated. he was not arrested for speaking or saying anything in his home...you are too smart for that Jase...he was arrested outside...was it retaliatory for what went on in the house? maybe...but the fact is, when he did it outside the house, he had not been arrested yet...he was not under arrest nor in his house... he kept on doing it though, outside, at the officer and defied two warnings outside, he gave up any constitutional protections he had of being an asshole in his own home once he went outside. once you are out in public, and are acting like an asshole, if that assholishness is deemed to be disorderly, you can be arrested.
You weren't physically or verbally threatened so that means you have to, by Constitutional right, shut-up and take it. If you can't, then get out of law enforcement. It's simple as that.
that is not true at all Jase...you cannot arrest some one for being verbally mean and abusive...but if they are doing it loudly and in public, they most certainly can be arrested for disorderly conduct, disturbing the peace, and a host of other statutes. it is a built in protection for cops, so that they do not in fact have to sit there and take abuse.
That means the cop, nor you if you were in the same situation, get to break the law because you're simply fed-up. Doing so exposes your department, your fellow officers, and the municipality you serve and protect, to legal action by the person you illegally arrested. You may even find yourself being charged with false arrest and disciplined or lose your job or even incarcerated.
indeed, but he was outside, and was being disorderly...ipso facto, disorderly conduct. note, he was not arrested for anything related to burglary or anything involving the home...it was Gates' choice...he risked arrest for taking the option of abusing a cop in public, because while that is not a crime, being disorderly certainly can be and is. He fucked up.
You do not fuck with the law you're sworn to protect and uphold. You are held to a higher standard because of your unique powers to arrest and even kill your fellow citizens. If you can't deal with that, then find another job.
The point I hope I'm hitting home as blatantly as possible is that there is never any excuse for a police officer to abuse or misuse the law for any reason even in the face of aggravation.
i am not suggesting there is...i am saying that Crowley was within the law to arrest him for disorderly conduct in public, when his conduct, outside the home and in view of the public, in fact, became, disorderly.
Crowley's statement below does not agree with what he wrote in his report. Crowley asked Gates to come outside the house. To state that Gates could have resolved the issue by, "going back inside," directly contradicts the statement that he made in the report when he asked Gates to come outside while Gates was in an aggravated state thus inviting, aiding, and entrapping Gates to break the law while still on his own property. Gates was arrested as soon as he stepped outside. He had NO opportunity to, "resolve," the issue by going back inside of his own accord.
1. i do not see the statement below so i am not sure which one you are referring to.
2. AGates was not arrested the second he stepped outside. untrue. he was screaming and yelling and received two warnings before being arrested. There were several other officers there, so we shall see what they say. Crowley even ordered Gates uncuffed, then recuffed in the front so it would be more confortable for Gates after Gates complained the cuffs were too tight, and he would have trouble walking with his hands behind his back.
That is not the behavior of a cop who was just trying to "entrap" him. Tosuggest this was entrapment on Crowley's part is *HIGHLY* questionable.
The cop is a goddamn liar looking to cover his own ass and, as usual, the thick blue line is there to back his story no matter how ridiculous it is.
I would be careful with that accusation Jase. This is not a rogue cop. There is no evidence he is a "goddamn liar" yet.
Right now the City of Cambridge has to be shitting its pants. Crowley has exposed the city to a law suit by a man with an impeccable reputation who has the greatest legal minds in the country at his disposal. Crowley has also inadvertently caused the City of Cambridge PD to face scrutiny from not only its own citizens, but the entire world. When a popular President of the US calls the actions of your department's actions, "stupid," you've already lost in the court of public opinion.
not really...POTUS is already backtracking vigorously...see Gibbs' statements today and Obama's interview that he suddenly granted today...the court of public opinion, is hardly in Obama's favor yet on this one...in fact all the police organizations are coming out criticizing Obama in varying degrees...we shall see what public opinion says on the matter in the coming days
So make all the excuses you want, the fact it that the reputation of Crowley, his department, and the city for which he works has been badly damaged and should Gates file charges or sue in civil court, Cambridge will pay dearly for it.
that is debatable Jase. the facts are on Crowley's side in both cases, even though civil court requires less proof.
1. If gates pursues a case based simply on the arrest, well, Gates was arrested outside, after two warnings, on disorderly conduct charges. he was outside and he was disorderly.
2. if gates pursues a race based case, there is no proof whatsoever. Crowley never once mentioned race. he has the backing of several black cops. He has his teaching credentials as a respected instructor on the issue, appointed personally by a black superior, and he also has the very compelling attempts he made to resuscitate, by mouth to mouth and CPR, a well know and respected black athlete (Reggie Lewis). I find it hard to believe that a rogue racist cop, would be selected to teach classes aimed against racial profiling and then to top it off, lock lips with member of a race that he obviously considers inferior, to attempt to save his life.
doesn't really add up
Now do you understand why a cop MUST always stick to the letter of the law no matter how provocative the situation?
I understand completely...and as long as Crowley arrested him outside, after two warnings to calm down, for causing a public disturbance, legally, the letter of the law has been followed. Causing a public disturbance or being disorderly in public, is against the law.