Rant about people having kids

[Jason]

Women may have got away with this once upon a time but now lone parents have to go on Jobseeker's Allowance. They have to sign on. And they have to seek work once their children are at nursery/school. The problem area is those women who have more than one child with the same partner and who persist in presenting themselves as lone parents. These tend to be women who have been on benefits for a number of years and have learned how to work the system.

I know this is the theory. But we are just going into a recession and the jobs are not there, so women in this position are very often not getting jobs.

Actually I doubt whether they should necessarily be working, and I'm not in favour of dragooning into work. Children from a single family need all the care they can get, and that may well mean they need a mum at home. My problem is that single mums are making the decision to have children in the first place. Today we have contraception. Most ofthe time it works.

 

[DaveyR]

Most of the time it works.

Yes but it at least needs to be used in the first place

 

[Runco]

Not all. There are single mums who work, or guys who support their partners and ex-partners although they are not married. But most (=well over half - there are government statistics which you could find) of single mums do little or no work, with the result that they and their children are supported through the benefit system. This represents a lack of opportunity for the kids, and a real problem for the state that has to fund.

I am not convinced this is true. Around 70% of lone parents work. Of the remaining 30%, some are at home for legitimate reasons (i.e. they cannot find childcare or they have kids who need specialist help). The rest are at home because they don't want to work (but this will change under current reforms). Around one third of all UK households are dependent on benefits. Of these 67% are households with children - both single parent and two parent households. These benefits tend to be child tax credits, child benefits and where eligible, working family tax credits. The difference is the extent to which two parent homes are dependent vs the extent to which single parent households are dependent. In many single-parent homes with two children, the proportion of families that would be financially crippled without state support is now as high as 61 per cent. That compares with just nine per cent in a two-parent home. But the point is there are far more single parents at work than people realise. We just keep hearing about the ones who are not at work.

 

[Runco]

I know this is the theory. But we are just going into a recession and the jobs are not there, so women in this position are very often not getting jobs.

Actually I doubt whether they should necessarily be working, and I'm not in favour of dragooning into work. Children from a single family need all the care they can get, and that may well mean they need a mum at home. My problem is that single mums are making the decision to have children in the first place. Today we have contraception. Most ofthe time it works.

I am not being funny but perhaps men should give some thought to using contraception particularly as it seems so many of them are prepared to turn their backs on the kids once they are made. While a woman can take the pill, any man who lies down with a woman without the benefit of a condom is an idiot - particularly in this day and age of deadly disease.

 

[Rubenesque]

It's bizarre that you can't adopt an abandonned dog without jumping through hoops but any half wit human can breed!

 

[DaveyR]

It's bizarre that you can't adopt an abandonned dog without jumping through hoops but any half wit human can breed!

QFT

 

[ZOS23xy]

Do not have kids if:

You are not prepared.

You are not mature.

You do not have money.

If you use drugs habitually.

You have no job.

You think it will bring you two closer together

You think it will make you mature.

You flip burgers for a living.

etc....

 

[Jovial]

This is just mother nature at work. She tricks people into reproducing.

Attempts at getting people to stop reproducing or to reproduce more are called unethical.

It sucks, but what can we do?

 

[marleyisalegend]

It has to mentioned the blame must be put on the fathers who simply skip town and dont provide for the children they have fathered. The man is a big part of the problem too.

It has to mentioned the blame must be put on the fathers who simply skip town and dont provide for the children they have fathered. The man is a big part of the problem too.

Now the women are just as much to blame. Some of these women aren't waiting for good, stable men. They have babies for the first (and sometimes for every) guy who says "You're pretty." It takes two to make a baby and, yes, the father is wrong for skipping town. BUT, the mother is just as wrong for spreading her legs for every loser that compliments her eyes.

 

[sdbg]

More and more was and is beng taken from those who work hard and given to those who have no intention of ever supporting themselves. I believe in a decent welfare system but not one that means people are better of by not working and providing for themselves.

Amen! When are we going to wake up here in the US? If these people who pop out kids and lay around had to support themselves or perish, this crap would stop really fast. Girls wouldn't get pregnant so easily if they knew that they would have to fend for themselves. I'm tired of paying for losers who take no responsibility for their actions. Then to have a goverment reward them for their screwed up behavior is maddening. A work program should be tied to welfare to stop the easy money.

 

[D_Fiona_Farvel]

I'm sick and tired of people reproducing like it's no big deal. I just wish people knew how much they're screwin' up the world by irresponsibly bringing children in it that they're ill-equipped to raise properly. The little bastard you bring into the world today is going to be robbing me in 15 years so PLEASE stop treating reproduction like it's a sitcom where any problems that are introduced meet a happy ending in 20 minutes.

Rant over, that is all.

Maybe, maybe not, as no one can predict criminal behavior.
I have found that those who should be the best parents can produce the worst children and those who come from a challenged and deeply disadvantaged background can produce the best (e.g. Oprah Winfrey, Maya Angelou). There’s no rhyme or reason, some children excel no matter the situation of their upbringing, others fail to thrive no matter the conditions of their upbringing (e.g. Dylan Klebold, Leopold and Loeb), and most, probably maintain and aspire to maintain a similar standard as their parents.

Due to the variation and possibilities, I tend to step back from this sort of (lamenting) discussion because there are no definitive standards by which one can state another should not reproduce.

Although many try.

 

[8060]

Yeah, kids are bad. When I was a kid, adults used to get excited when we came around. They always wanted us to tell them a story or do that cute thing we do. Any adult in our neigborhood, vacinity for that matter, could check us if they needed to, and that was it, concerning our behavior. If you tried to check a child today, they'll start poppin' off on you either by mouth or pistol. It's not their fault either. They're just being created by immature, unresponsible people and children need guidance. If they're taught what is right and wrong, what to do and not to do, then they wouldn't get buck wild from doing what they want to do. That kind of behavior sends ripples through society.

If a couple isn't married, then neither one should trust the other when it comes down to the birth control. When you get in the bed, do a quick question check. "I've got mine (rubber in hand). Do you have yours?" Being pregnant and not having the resources to provide for your new baby creates a carelessness in some women. That's where the states assistance comes in. I know a woman with 9 children (7 fathers) getting $1200 a month in food stamps. I could eat a seven course meal three times a day off of $1200 a month in groceries. And with all of those kids, she's getting cash assistance too. She's never worked a job and is about 2 or 3 years older than me. She is addicted to that first of the month check.

After she had her first one, it was "aww, he's cute. You're a mama." After the third one, third father (trying not go 'there'), I was like "Damn, you're pregnant again? Did you get married? Where do you work?" Then that's when she starts telling some crazy story about how she 'got played' out of the necessary things that she needs. My state has a work program in place that those seeking assistance need to participate in regularly concerning employment in order to get cash assistance. The state will provide the food assistance without the program attendance. The kid's gotta eat, right?

The really sad part is that she doesn't plan on getting a job because if she did, then the state will discontinue her benefits and no way could she find a "job" to support her expenses with all of those children without something concrete like a career.

 

[Calboner]

A woman next door to us has 8 babies from 5 different fathers. She's big as a refrigerator and acts like a vending machine

Laughter and horror contend with each other in me as I read that.

You have got to see this video if you haven't seen the movie already:

YouTube - Meaning of Life Part 2 - The Third World

Be sure to watch the first twenty seconds carefully.

 

[marleyisalegend]

Due to the variation and possibilities, I tend to step back from this sort of (lamenting) discussion because there are no definitive standards by which one can state another should not reproduce.

Although many try.

That's just semantics bullshit. There are ample studies that show a correlation between child-rearing and criminal behavior. Obviously there are exceptions, but the relationship between absent fathers and crime, poverty and crime is one that shouldn't be ignored.

 

[Principessa]

That's just semantics bullshit. There are ample studies that show a correlation between child-rearing and criminal behavior. Obviously there are exceptions, but the relationship between absent fathers and crime, poverty and crime is one that shouldn't be ignored.

I agree. How do you stop these donor daddys from getting women pregnant and then running like their ass is on fire? It would be great if society could look down upon and shun deadbeat dads as it does single moms.

I bristle when I hear some older person (usually) say with disdain that, "Tracy done got herself pregnant." What? Really? All by herself, how did she do that? Seriously birth control is the responsibility of the male and the female and when it fails the resulting child is the responsibility of both as well.

 

[DaveyR]

[/b][/color][/size][/font] Seriously birth control is the responsibility of the male and the female and when it fails the resulting child is the responsibility of both as well.

I agree entirely but far too many times it becomes the responsibility of the state. Nothing will change until that stops.

 

[Mr. Snakey]

Laughter and horror contend with each other in me as I read that.

You have got to see this video if you haven't seen the movie already:

YouTube - Meaning of Life Part 2 - The Third World

Be sure to watch the first twenty seconds carefully.

Oh im a big Monty Python fan. I think thats their best movie. I have it on dvd. They were great. The meaning of life is a masterpiece from start to finish.

 

[Principessa]

I agree entirely but far too many times it becomes the responsibility of the state. Nothing will change until that stops.

I don't know about that. Something many people don't realize is that you only get an average of $40 extra, for food stamps, per child that you have on Welfare or General Assistance in the United States. Also, the money has to be paid back if you win the lottery or become gainfully employed. There have been instances in New York and New Jersey where a welfare mom won a significant sum of cash in the lottery and it was all taken away by the state to cover what they had already paid her in welfare and food stamps. I distinctly remember an instance in the 1970's where Mayor Koch waived that so the woman could start a new life with her family off of welfare.

 

[DaveyR]

I don't know about that. Something many people don't realize is that you only get an average of $40 extra, for food stamps, per child that you have on Welfare or General Assistance in the United States. Also, the money has to be paid back if you win the lottery or become gainfully employed. There have been instances in New York and New Jersey where a welfare mom won a significant sum of cash in the lottery and it was all taken away by the state to cover what they had already paid her in welfare and food stamps. I distinctly remember an instance in the 1970's where Mayor Koch waived that so the woman could start a new life with her family off of welfare.

I was talking from a UK perspective. I'm not familiar with how your welfare system works in depth.

 

[D_Fiona_Farvel]

That's just semantics bullshit. There are ample studies that show a correlation between child-rearing and criminal behavior. Obviously there are exceptions, but the relationship between absent fathers and crime, poverty and crime is one that shouldn't be ignored.

I wasn't discussing absentee fathers.
My issue was the belief that there has to be a certain set of criteria met before people should reproduce or that reproducing without meeting that criteria means they are bringing criminals into the world.

Your friend and his girlfriend, and their two parent environment, will most likely produce average children, even though they may not meet the standards of independence that some wish they would.

[/B][/COLOR][/SIZE][/FONT]I agree. How do you stop these donor daddys from getting women pregnant and then running like their ass is on fire? It would be great if society could look down upon and shun deadbeat dads as it does single moms.

I bristle when I hear some older person (usually) say with disdain that, "Tracy done got herself pregnant." What? Really? All by herself, how did she do that? Seriously birth control is the responsibility of the male and the female and when it fails the resulting child is the responsibility of both as well.

I agree. I dislike the focus on the girl who 'got herself into trouble'.
However, in communities where men impregnate multiple women, and disappear, or women exist with multiple children from different partners, their history is not unknown.

So responsibility really falls on the person who gets involved with the individual, as they have proven to be incapable of making sound decisions. If you are having unprotected sex with a woman who has 4 or 5 kids, with an equal number of men, or with a man with 4 or 5 kids, with an equal number of women... you know what's probably going to happen. Just for some reason the reality of the situation is ignored.

I think it is a fundamental issue of self-valuation and esteem. Until we tackle the basic issues of lack of self-respect and self-worth, of never being taught that they are of infinite value. That having a child does not mean you finally have something that's 'yours'. Or, that children are not a binding force or show of commitment in a relationship. If these issues are not brought to the fore and steps taken to improve the feelings of worth in these communities, we face a generational phenomenon.

And, at least in the Black community, attached to that is real possibility of endemic HIV infection in certain populations. Tragic. :frown1: