Romney let Detroit go

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
Last edited:

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
Why would Romney deny it? He didn't besides. He even cited his op-ed in the course of the last debate.

Did you at least bother to read the op-ed?

Do you really understand what "bankruptcy" means in the United States?


"A managed bankruptcy may be the only path to the fundamental restructuring the industry needs. It would permit the companies to shed excess labor, pension and real estate costs. The federal government should provide guarantees for post-bankruptcy financing and assure car buyers that their warranties are not at risk."
 

AtomicMouse1950

Cherished Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
May 30, 2011
Posts
2,968
Media
22
Likes
460
Points
218
Age
73
Location
Placerville , Ca.
Verification
View
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
Romney lied about his op-ed piece. And he tried to say, after he had written that piece, that he supported the bailout. (Which was a LOAD of DUNG!)
BTW... part of the credit for the auto bailout can go to GW Bush. He was drafting a proposal to bail Detroit out. Obama coming into office, fine tuned the bailout proposal.
Mitt Romney: 99 Facts


Why would Romney deny it? He didn't besides. He even cited his op-ed in the course of the last debate.

Did you at least bother to read the op-ed?

Do you really understand what "bankruptcy" means in the United States?


"A managed bankruptcy may be the only path to the fundamental restructuring the industry needs. It would permit the companies to shed excess labor, pension and real estate costs. The federal government should provide guarantees for post-bankruptcy financing and assure car buyers that their warranties are not at risk."
 

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
One only has to check GM's stock price to grade the performance of the bailout. GM's competitors are doing much better.

A managed bankruptcy would have yielded better results IMO.
 

AtomicMouse1950

Cherished Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
May 30, 2011
Posts
2,968
Media
22
Likes
460
Points
218
Age
73
Location
Placerville , Ca.
Verification
View
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
One only has to check GM's stock price to grade the performance of the bailout. GM's competitors are doing much better.

A managed bankruptcy would have yielded better results IMO.

Actually you're wrong. President Obama & GW Bush were correct. Ask the people in Michigan, and Ohio, and Illinois, and Indiana... they knew it was the right thing to do. Had it been Romney, he would have stripped to company, and sold off the parts to China, where he has investments, still to this day. And he still gets money from Bain Capital. It's why we haven't seen much of his income tax records. Both of the ones he released were missing hundreds of pages. Yeah, I'm quite certain Romney would have yielded a nice profit.
 
Last edited:
D

deleted15807

Guest
One only has to check GM's stock price to grade the performance of the bailout. GM's competitors are doing much better.

A managed bankruptcy would have yielded better results IMO.

Details. Who was going to fund this bankruptcy?
 

AtomicMouse1950

Cherished Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
May 30, 2011
Posts
2,968
Media
22
Likes
460
Points
218
Age
73
Location
Placerville , Ca.
Verification
View
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
There were not venture capitalists available to work with the car companies at the time. Did Bain, reach out to help the auto companies? No. Banks wouldn't touch the situation. Banks weren 't even, according to them, solvent to lend money. So the Government was the only alternative. And the auto companies, paid the Government back with interest. Did Wall Street do so?? the Answer is, NO! There wasn't even a provision to do so. The Republican's pushed it through so hard and so fast. And I'm sure the RW Congress got some kickbacks because of the WS bailout.
 

Bardox

Loved Member
Joined
Jul 1, 2009
Posts
2,234
Media
38
Likes
551
Points
198
Location
U.S.
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
Romney doesn't just change his mind about policy, he goes off into the alternate reality where he never said anything about these policies and even argues for people to look up what he said before. He has to know that these things are on record and youtube is loaded with these things. I think this is a sign of mental illness.
 

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
Actually you're wrong. President Obama & GW Bush were correct. Ask the people in Michigan, and Ohio, and Illinois, and Indiana... they knew it was the right thing to do. Had it been Romney, he would have stripped to company, and sold off the parts to China, where he has investments, still to this day. And he still gets money from Bain Capital. It's why we haven't seen much of his income tax records. Both of the ones he released were missing hundreds of pages. Yeah, I'm quite certain Romney would have yielded a nice profit.

Sent from my iPhone (*)

(*) Made in China by underage workers working in Dickensian conditions.

 

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
Actually you're wrong. President Obama & GW Bush were correct. Ask the people in Michigan, and Ohio, and Illinois, and Indiana... they knew it was the right thing to do. Had it been Romney, he would have stripped to company, and sold off the parts to China, where he has investments, still to this day. And he still gets money from Bain Capital. It's why we haven't seen much of his income tax records. Both of the ones he released were missing hundreds of pages. Yeah, I'm quite certain Romney would have yielded a nice profit.

I am afraid GM's stock price is not subject to right-or-wrong debate.

You can certainly say you hate the rain, but you can't argue about the fact that it is raining when it is.
 

AtomicMouse1950

Cherished Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
May 30, 2011
Posts
2,968
Media
22
Likes
460
Points
218
Age
73
Location
Placerville , Ca.
Verification
View
Sexuality
99% Gay, 1% Straight
Gender
Male
GM's stock price was the prime reason for the structured bail out. So it's mute point, as far as I'm concerned. GW Bush and President Obama did the right thing. Since you'd prefer to side with that pirate, Romney, who doesn't give a wit about jobs, dismantling companies, shipping equipment and jobs off to China, just for a profit, and his bottom line. The last thing Romney is, is a job creator. More like a job destroyer. He's not patriotic and I would never trust him to to tie my shoes. Let alone something like GM, or Chrysler. Romney is just a looter, who happens to wear a suit and tie.
 

Dakota Kid

Admired Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Mar 5, 2009
Posts
359
Media
9
Likes
829
Points
373
Location
Cavorting between fresh and salt water peninsulas.
Verification
View
Sexuality
No Response
Gender
Male
Ask the people in Michigan, and Ohio, and Illinois, and Indiana... they knew it was the right thing to do.
As someone who was born in Detroit and raised in southeast Michigan all my life, I was not in favor of what GW and Obama did bailing out GM and Chrysler. All the bailout money did was go to the unions ahead of the bond holders.....blatantly against the law! You know who held those bonds......older retired folks who invested in the company they or their family had worked for. They were kicked to the curb when they should have been payed off first. And what really amazes me is that people think Obama saved GM and Chrysler from bankruptcy..........WRONG!!! They both went through bankruptcy after they recieved the bailout. Romney's position was let them go through bankruptcy (as they actually did!) and let private investors loan them the money to come out leaner and more competitive with the government backing the private loans. This would gaurantee vehicle warrantees to nervous prospective buyers. Obama didn't save the auto companies......he just paid off his union backers :rolleyes:
 

h0neymustard

Experimental Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2012
Posts
2,668
Media
0
Likes
4
Points
73
Location
United States
Sexuality
100% Straight, 0% Gay
Gender
Male
As someone who was born in Detroit and raised in southeast Michigan all my life, I was not in favor of what GW and Obama did bailing out GM and Chrysler. All the bailout money did was go to the unions ahead of the bond holders.....blatantly against the law! You know who held those bonds......older retired folks who invested in the company they or their family had worked for. They were kicked to the curb when they should have been payed off first. And what really amazes me is that people think Obama saved GM and Chrysler from bankruptcy..........WRONG!!! They both went through bankruptcy after they recieved the bailout. Romney's position was let them go through bankruptcy (as they actually did!) and let private investors loan them the money to come out leaner and more competitive with the government backing the private loans. This would gaurantee vehicle warrantees to nervous prospective buyers. Obama didn't save the auto companies......he just paid off his union backers :rolleyes:
You got a good head on yah, kid.:smile:
 

HUNGHUGE11X7

Superior Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Feb 21, 2005
Posts
2,353
Media
154
Likes
6,729
Points
468
Age
48
Location
Earth/USA/GA! DEEP IN YOUR THROAT,See vid TO SEE H
Verification
View
Sexuality
80% Gay, 20% Straight
Gender
Male
Romney doesn't just change his mind about policy, he goes off into the alternate reality where he never said anything about these policies and even argues for people to look up what he said before. He has to know that these things are on record and youtube is loaded with these things. I think this is a sign of mental illness.


Hahahaha Well on two occassions now, two members of his own family, first ANN, then his son JOSH, have made statements about him being mentally unstable lololol


HH
 

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
GM's stock price was the prime reason for the structured bail out. So it's mute point, as far as I'm concerned. GW Bush and President Obama did the right thing. Since you'd prefer to side with that pirate, Romney, who doesn't give a wit about jobs, dismantling companies, shipping equipment and jobs off to China, just for a profit, and his bottom line. The last thing Romney is, is a job creator. More like a job destroyer. He's not patriotic and I would never trust him to to tie my shoes. Let alone something like GM, or Chrysler. Romney is just a looter, who happens to wear a suit and tie.

Right, and look at the results:

GM is far less "alive" than its competitors, which didn't get rescued by taxpayers. The price tag of the bailout is rising by the day.

GM was drowned by its own incompetent, overpaid management and by its union thugs. They are now paying the price, Detroit (as a city, what's left of it) is paying the price, and of course taxpayers are paying the price.
 

b.c.

Worshipped Member
Verified
Gold
Joined
Nov 7, 2005
Posts
20,540
Media
0
Likes
21,779
Points
468
Location
at home
Verification
View
Gender
Male
As someone who was born in Detroit and raised in southeast Michigan all my life, I was not in favor of what GW and Obama did bailing out GM and Chrysler. All the bailout money did was go to the unions ahead of the bond holders.....blatantly against the law! You know who held those bonds......older retired folks who invested in the company they or their family had worked for. They were kicked to the curb when they should have been payed off first. And what really amazes me is that people think Obama saved GM and Chrysler from bankruptcy..........WRONG!!! They both went through bankruptcy after they recieved the bailout. Romney's position was let them go through bankruptcy (as they actually did!) and let private investors loan them the money to come out leaner and more competitive with the government backing the private loans. This would gaurantee vehicle warrantees to nervous prospective buyers. Obama didn't save the auto companies......he just paid off his union backers :rolleyes:

LOL. And where were all these "private investors" chomping at the bit to loan money to bankrupt companies, and how many workers, their families, and auxiliary companies would've been sitting around waiting for that to happen.

Typical REPUBLICAN lack of vision on how PEOPLE are negatively impacted by CALLOUS actions of others.

But what I find interesting are other comments written in the article. They say "the DEVIL IS IN THE DETAILS" and every once in awhile Romney, or Ryan or some other party candidate or affiliate let slip WHAT THEY MEAN, INSTEAD OF WHAT THEY SAY. (hmmm...title for my next thread??)

Like Romney's "Big Bird" comment in the first debate (plans to slash funding for public television) or his brief reference to unions going to the back in the last debate (plans to bust unions and effectively put an end to all COLLECTIVE BARGAINING).

Or like Ryan's latest comments on how he envisions the funding of benefit programs like Medicaid and Family Assistance programs (doling out block grants to states to figure out how they'll use the money), or Palin's latest looney "shuck and jive" comment aimed at Obama, or Trump's insulting bullshit money offer.

Or GOP candidate Richard Mourdock's comments on abortion (I've always wondered how they figure that one - that life begins at contraception, that abortion is murder, but not murder in the case of rape or incest? Thank's Mourdock for clearing that up for us and letting us know what y'all really think).

Or even Florida GOP senate candidate Connie Mack's more FRANK expose on what Republican style foreign policy will REALLY be like: "United Nations should be kicked off of American soil." Their idea of "world peace", no doubt.

And then there is what Romney says in "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt":

"...huge disadvantage in costs relative to foreign brands must be eliminated. That means new labor agreements to align pay and benefits to match those of workers at competitors like BMW, Honda, Nissan and Toyota."

Translation: Auto workers are being paid too much. Pay 'em what they pay in Japan.

"retiree benefits must be reduced so that the total burden per auto for domestic makers is not higher than that of foreign producers."

Translation: After you busted your ass on the job for some 25 - 30 years you sure as hell don't deserve all that money you've been contributing to your RETIREMENT. You can manage with LESS.

"Companies in the 21st century cannot perpetuate the destructive labor relations of the 20th. This will mean a new direction for the U.A.W., profit sharing or stock grants to all employees and a change in Big Three management culture."

Translation: Fuck unions, and kiss your profit sharing goodbye.

"accepting sanity in salaries and perks."

Translation: See all the above.

To his credit he does however say that executives should "Get rid of the planes, the executive dining rooms — all the symbols that breed resentment among the hundreds of thousands who will also be sacrificing to keep the companies afloat."

Yeah. Getting rid of those planes and executive dining rooms must be HELL.
 
Last edited:

Domisoldo

Expert Member
Account Deletion Pending
Joined
Jan 23, 2008
Posts
4,007
Media
0
Likes
117
Points
283
Sexuality
Unsure
Gender
Male
thing is there was none

Creditors.

Note that even the WSJ recommended the firing of the incompetent management. It was also a precondition to most of the restructuring plans floated out there at the time.

Yes, the CEO & lieutenants were overpaid and their pay was not justified by their (in)competence.

However, there is only 1 CEO, and the compensation of 1 grossly-overpaid CEO is but a drop in the ocean of structural costs resulting from union labor costs, especially costs associated with the pension and health care of former GM employees.