Safe sex and your HIV status

[Bbucko]

EDIT - I decided to make it a PM rather than a public post.

That's a shame but remains your choice: it was a valuable contribution to an otherwise toxic OP.

 

[novice_btm]

That's a shame but remains your choice: it was a valuable contribution to an otherwise toxic OP.

I totally agree. I thought it was a great post.

 

[D_Sparroe Spongecaques]

I don't begrudge anyone health care and free care at that (and not just because i'm a nurse who nurses a fella who HIV pos) but the OP is allowed to state his opinions.Other posters are not forced to like it but all the same he is allowed.

Is anyone who replied not HIV positive?......apart from me.

No offence,just asking.

 

[IntoxicatingToxin]

I'm not HIV positive. But I know a handful of people that have either died from it or are living with it, so maybe I am "biased" in some way. Though I like to just think of myself as sensitive and open-minded. :tongue:

And novice, lovely post. :smile: Thanks for that. I feel that you're right in so many ways.

 

[luka82]

HIV positive people get free meds in Serbia.
Why? Because it`s the right thing to do.
Why would we let anyone die?
I believe the real question should be-Why are the meds so expensive, and why so many people die in Africa when they don`t have to.

 

[MarkLondon]

I have a question for all and please do not take this the wrong way nor am I trying to start a flame war either but I need to ask this because I have posted other places and the readers took it the wrong way.

For people who are newly infected did you not know that Hiv was around or did you maybe have a lapse in judgement? Lets not forget the other diseases you can receive from another human being.

My question is the following...Why should the govt help you pay for meds when it was your CHOICE to engage in casual sex(safe or otherwise) you knew the risk and yet you engaged and now if you cannot afford it, you want some assistance with keeping you alive when you made the choice to have sex. I myself have only been with 3 men in 12 years and all in a relationship and I choose not to have sex period because of the nuts out there but that is my choice and I have to live with the fact that I am not having fun like the rest of the world but at least I take confort knowing I will die being somewhat healthy..

Like I said, I am not starting a flamewar but just something I wanted to tell your guys and girls on this websight... thank you

EDIT - I decided to make it a PM rather than a public post.

That's a shame but remains your choice: it was a valuable contribution to an otherwise toxic OP.

I totally agree. I thought it was a great post.

OK, here it is:-

Ladsonbehr, I'm of a similar age to you and was sexually active and hoping to find a partner in London when the epidemic started in north America in the late 70s. In fact I was aware of the threat before most people over here because I subscribed to scientific magazines which were reporting the first cases of what was then known as GRID (gay-related immune deficiency) when the cause was unknown.

Being a bit of an amateur epidemiologist I figured it was most likely a new STD even while speculation ranged over poppers, lifestyle burnout and other possible causes. I was quickly convinced in my own mind that anal intercourse was the most likely transmission route in gay men while the authorities just coyly referred to gay sex without any specifics. If only they'd said it was fucking that was responsible - use a condom! By the time they did it was too late for most of my cohort who couldn't face a life of celibacy and isolation.

I withdrew from the gay scene and became almost sexually inactive, concentrating on my work life. I was something of a Cassandra figure amongst my friends (the woman in Greek mythology cursed by Apollo with the gift of accurate prophesy which no-one would believe) on the subject of the new disease.

In 1986 some of my closest friends were diagnosed hiv positive and I was hearing of the deaths of old aquaintances. Then the illnesses and hospital-visiting started. I did not say "I told you so, I tried to warn you" - what would have been the point? They already knew and had to live and die with that. 1990 began my years of funerals. I was honoured to participate in the eulogy at some. I concentrated on the good times and the happy memories of what good people they were and the contributions they had made to the world.

But it was all having its toll on me and by 1992 I was virtually an urban hermit when my last surviving hiv friend saw I was in a bad state and took me to a charity that catered for people affected as well as those infected by hiv. There I met, among others, newly-diagnosed people, gay and straight, and heard many stories.

Stories of mistakes, bad judgements, naivity, wrong assumptions, ignorance, misguided love, betrayal by partners, even rapes. The common factor was human interaction.

There will always be new infections until a cure is found. Especially with the three-month window between infection and testing positive. It is pointless to apportion blame after the fact - treatment, support and education are the only valid responses to the ongoing crisis. Every new infection is a tragedy with repercussions that go beyond the individual concerned.

In an ideal world there would be no new infections, but we don't live in an ideal world and if we are to be judged at all, it will be on how we reacted to these tragedies. Whether we showed care and sympathy or disdain.

You might die "somewhat healthy" (lol!), but what comfort will you take in having missed out on not just the "fun", but also the humanity, compassion and interaction that is the actual point of life.

I've now lived long enough to lose friends and loved ones to other causes. And that's the common factor. We all die in the end. There's far more to life than tax dollars.

I only feel able to say this to you because I could easily have taken the same point of view as you now have, but I realised it was leading me nowhere.

EDIT: I did recieve a reply from Ladsonbehr which reveals that he is not the heartless unaffected monster one might assume from his OP.

 

[TomCat84]

I have a question for all and please do not take this the wrong way nor am I trying to start a flame war either but I need to ask this because I have posted other places and the readers took it the wrong way.

For people who are newly infected did you not know that Hiv was around or did you maybe have a lapse in judgement? Lets not forget the other diseases you can receive from another human being.

My question is the following...Why should the govt help you pay for meds when it was your CHOICE to engage in casual sex(safe or otherwise) you knew the risk and yet you engaged and now if you cannot afford it, you want some assistance with keeping you alive when you made the choice to have sex. I myself have only been with 3 men in 12 years and all in a relationship and I choose not to have sex period because of the nuts out there but that is my choice and I have to live with the fact that I am not having fun like the rest of the world but at least I take confort knowing I will die being somewhat healthy..

Like I said, I am not starting a flamewar but just something I wanted to tell your guys and girls on this websight... thank you

I will answer your question with another question- should we ration and/or price care using the levels of personal culpability/responsibility in getting a condition?

 

[TomCat84]

I appreciate the insight, I have compassion for the survivors of the 80's but to the ones in this day and age who become infected with all the knowledge we have and yet continue to engage in sex and for whatever reason whether it is a lapse of judgement or just plain foolish thinking, I just do feel they should run to the govt if they cannot afford the meds, that is their problem and not the govt. Aids is completely avoidable and yes I am celebrate by choice....and happy with my decision. And I have noticed with speaking with men who are poz, it would appear that they are not happy because men will not want to date them. I know this is just from what I have heard from others.


n the shower on my out the door to a late-ish dinner, it dawned on me that the OP would also agree that anyone injured in a car wreck who was not wearing a safety restraint should be left on the side of the road to die, too.

Once again, it is a choice if they choose not to wear a seatbelt knowing that the chance of being smashed into or hurt, you made the choice not to wear one and nobody told you not to wear a seat belt.

I do not understand why the human race has a problem with rules and regulations and when the chips are down, I need help with my foolish decisions in life. Sorry guys and gals but I live my life with rules and I make sure that I follow them.

Another instance, if someone is under 21 and the young adult gets preg, I feel they should not ask for a handout to help out taking care of the baby. Get a job and ask your parents or the parents of the father, NOBODY TOLD YOU TO OPEN YOUR LEGS AND GET PREG....I wonder how many young adults would abstain if they knew the govt would not help them with anything? it is the same way with handouts, you must be responsible is all I am saying...but thank you again for your responses.

Oh for CHrists sake....so we should punish the unborn child for being born to a whore? Good lord.

 

[Bbucko]

EDIT: I did recieve a reply from Ladsonbehr which reveals that he is not the heartless unaffected monster one might assume from his OP.

I'll just have to take your word for it; from my cheap seats he just seems agenda-driven and purposefully provocative, so my Ignore list finally grew a little bigger.

Thanks for the re-post, ML.

 

[joe bltsflk]

Ladsonbehr, many people do stupid things because many people are stupid. Have you not yet realized this? If the average IQ is 100, that means half the population is below that. What do you propose we do with them? Concentration camps? Human beings also have an amazing ability to act against their own best interests and believe that "it won't happen to me." You are already doing all you can by living your life to a certain standard. You can't expect anyone else to live up to YOUR standards. Oh, in a republic, you don't get a line item veto on how your tax dollars are spent.

 

[bambulance]

Ladsonbehr, many people do stupid things because many people are stupid. Have you not yet realized this? If the average IQ is 100, that means half the population is below that. What do you propose we do with them? Concentration camps? Human beings also have an amazing ability to act against their own best interests and believe that "it won't happen to me." You are already doing all you can by living your life to a certain standard. You can't expect anyone else to live up to YOUR standards. Oh, in a republic, you don't get a line item veto on how your tax dollars are spent.

I agree, but IQ has nothing to do with making the right choice about something that is common knowledge.

So people can do whatever they want and live on the dole forever and we shouldn't say anything about it?

 

[zpacifico]

everybody has the right for medical help, with or without being able to afford it and no matter how somebody got ill in the first place. there are many ways of getting infected.
medical assistance is a human right, no matter of how one got infected or ill.
there is many people suffering from diabetes and heart-attacks and yet those people are not stigmatized like the ones with HIV.
it is nothing but the hypocrisy because we all have sex and we all do like it.

 

[Viking_UK]

Why stop at HIV/AIDS? Extrapolating from the original post, if someone hasn't made an effort to live a healthy life, they deserve all they get and shouldn't be entitled to any medication or medical intervention, so that means that anyone who is overweight, has ever drunk alcohol, smoked, had unprotected sex, driven a car, flown, ridden a bike or any number of other "risky behaviours" should be left to die like the dog they are unless they can afford to pay all of their own medical expenses.

Not in my book. I'd like to think I have a little more compassion than that

 

[novice_btm]

Is anyone who replied not HIV positive?......apart from me...

Negative here, just tested last weekend, and with a few months since I've even been within 10 feet of someone naked, and much longer since engaging in actual sex, no "window" worries.

I'm not HIV positive. But I know a handful of people that have either died from it or are living with it, so maybe I am "biased" in some way. Though I like to just think of myself as sensitive and open-minded. :tongue:

And novice, lovely post. :smile: Thanks for that. I feel that you're right in so many ways.

I hear ya, Meg, and thanks for the kind words.

 

[BadBoyCanada]

It's actually a great thread in a lot of ways. I believe people are losing their ability to be compassionate, so discussions like this can allow others to rethink their positions.

Here in certain parts of Canada, certain cancer drugs aren't covered, either by government or private plans. The cost can be outrageous. Yet, few people would say that those in need shouldn't be covered.

My father is quite far right in his political views. However, he did say something that strikes a cord. Medication should be part of any universal health plan. It creates most of the cost and therefore is the #1 thing we need to control. A lot of the patented medicines come from labs that are heavily government funded or from private donations. The government should nationalize prescription medicine in order to control costs, it's the only way.

If we ration health care based on risk factors, we're all screwed!

 

[ladsonbehr49]

I have come back to this as I am busy in my real life and not on this website. All I am saying is be responsible. At least know the man or woman more than 5 minutes and ask yourself, is it worth having some stranger in bed with you that you barely know? to me, no. Currently I am doing long distance dating with someone whom I am interested in and when he comes for a visit he will need to have hiv test before I will have a romp in the bed and yes he will be eventually moving in together.

And I am a diabetic Type 2, and I blame myself for overeating and not taking care of my self and smoking. I have stopped smoking and I pay for my own meds because I am responsible and I had no one to blame but myself. I know my family history played a role in my health history but it could have been avoided I think.

Finally just say no if you have a bad feeling about that rather pretty gal or sexy man, condoms do not work and safe sex is not totally safe....And thank you for at least being civil with me.

 

[FeroxFemina]

I have come back to this as I am busy in my real life and not on this website

Too busy to notice that this post essentially ended in August 2010?

 

[aninnymouse]

I have come back to this as I am busy in my real life and not on this website. All I am saying is be responsible. At least know the man or woman more than 5 minutes and ask yourself, is it worth having some stranger in bed with you that you barely know? to me, no. Currently I am doing long distance dating with someone whom I am interested in and when he comes for a visit he will need to have hiv test before I will have a romp in the bed and yes he will be eventually moving in together.

And I am a diabetic Type 2, and I blame myself for overeating and not taking care of my self and smoking. I have stopped smoking and I pay for my own meds because I am responsible and I had no one to blame but myself. I know my family history played a role in my health history but it could have been avoided I think.

Finally just say no if you have a bad feeling about that rather pretty gal or sexy man, condoms do not work and safe sex is not totally safe....And thank you for at least being civil with me.

Here's something to ponder.

We cannot see the world in pure black and white. There are thousands, if not millions of shades of grey involved in every single decision we make, even if we're not making the decisions consciously or making an informed decision. Anything potentially "COULD" be avoided, but oftentimes is not.

People make mistakes. They have sex without condoms, they believe people's lies, they get caught up in the moment because their hormonse are surging and their synapses are firing. Sometimes, none of that is a factor. People can know each other for YEARS and not be aware of someone's past or potential HIV infection. I know someone who got infected with HIV because her husband was on the Down Low, and she didn't know about it. By the time she realized he wasn't who she though he was and they divorced, the damage was done. Now, she has to live at or below the poverty line just to get her meds.

The real shame of the scourge of HIV infection is that due to drug companies' greed, many people have to live in poverty just to get their meds, which at times can be over $1,000 per month. For some people its either take the government "welfare" or not be able to eat and feed their family. That is a decision no person should have to make.

You talk about Type 2 Diabetes, which is preventable. It is also potentially curable. If you lose weight, can be active and quit smoking, you can potentially start making enough insulin. Plus, the medicines are not nearly as expensive as HIV meds.

Essentially, you cannot make quick snap judgements. Being human is messy, and stuff happens.

 

[jjsjr]

I didn't want to write a brand new thread about this, but rather find a thread about HIV AIDs.....

I've noticed recently, that those with the virus have a particularly unique scent to their breath almost similar to a sweet bread.

This might be my observation, but it's fairly constant among my friends who happen to be positive. Has anyone else ever heard of such a thing?

 

[Bbucko]

I didn't want to write a brand new thread about this, but rather find a thread about HIV AIDs.....

I've noticed recently, that those with the virus have a particularly unique scent to their breath almost similar to a sweet bread.

This might be my observation, but it's fairly constant among my friends who happen to be positive. Has anyone else ever heard of such a thing?

No, and a pox on your house for resurrecting this noxious thread: seriously, fuck you!

Ugh! :frown1: