Secession

wallyj84

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Honest question.

A lot of talk right now about secession from the usual suspects. What do you guys think of it? Would you support secession? Do you think it would benefit the population as a whole? How Do you think it could actually work on a practical level?

I can see the cultural and political benefits of secession, but I don't think it works practically. What do you think?
 
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deleted15807

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Have the divisions in the US become unreconcilable?

A Texas state lawmaker has vowed to introduce legislation allowing a referendum for voters to cast their ballots on whether to secede from the United States.

"The federal government is out of control and does not represent the values of Texans. That is why I am committing to file legislation this session that will allow a referendum to give Texans a vote for the State of Texas to reassert its status as an independent nation," Texas state Rep. Kyle Biedermann (R) shared on Facebook on Tuesday.

Texas lawmaker to file bill calling for vote on secession from US
 
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deleted15807

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Which states would secede? You seriously think everyone in those states would go along for the ride? You'd see mass migrations, both ways. We're talking India and Pakistan.

Other than all that, yeah, brilliant idea.

It would be messy for sure but that said I don’t think the differences at this stage are reconcilable. We are moving in opposite directions at light speed. Half the country is quite comfortable with an authoritarian form of government. What’s left to discuss?

I don't care who's wrong or right
I don't really want to fight no more (too much talking babe)
Let's sleep on it tonight
I don't really want to fight no more
This is time for letting go



 

longstroke7

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The traitors who want to secede don't realize that their neo confederation would collapse pretty fast without the US federal tax dollars that they currently get because Blue states pay for the bulk of the country.

This goes back to the end of the Civil War. Lincoln let these traitors get off lightly with his foolish 10% plan. The Union should have gathered every single confederate leader and general, put a bull rope around their necks in public and strung them all up. No exceptions. Instead, they chose to let the disease fester and here we are again, the hell spawn of these traitors want to do this song and dance.

Donald Trump needs to be thrown in prison and Nancy Pelosi needs to punish the members of the House who engaged in sedition. But she won't, because she is gutless.
 

longstroke7

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Have the divisions in the US become unreconcilable?

A Texas state lawmaker has vowed to introduce legislation allowing a referendum for voters to cast their ballots on whether to secede from the United States.

"The federal government is out of control and does not represent the values of Texans. That is why I am committing to file legislation this session that will allow a referendum to give Texans a vote for the State of Texas to reassert its status as an independent nation," Texas state Rep. Kyle Biedermann (R) shared on Facebook on Tuesday.

Texas lawmaker to file bill calling for vote on secession from US

Sedition.

Maybe Donald Trump reinstating firing squads as a method of execution will be beneficial after all. Because clearly we have some domestic enemies who need to be taught a lesson.
 
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b.c.

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Sedition.

Maybe Donald Trump reinstating firing squads as a method of execution will be beneficial after all. Because clearly we have some domestic enemies who need to be taught a lesson.

Well, it would essentially be his OWN idea, wouldn't it?

Have the divisions in the US become unreconcilable?
A Texas state lawmaker has vowed to introduce legislation allowing a referendum for voters to cast their ballots on whether to secede from the United States.

"The federal government is out of control and does not represent the values of Texans. That is why I am committing to file legislation this session that will allow a referendum to give Texans a vote for the State of Texas to reassert its status as an independent nation," Texas state Rep. Kyle Biedermann (R) shared on Facebook on Tuesday.

Texas lawmaker to file bill calling for vote on secession from US

Hey... might work.

IF they no longer benefit from any U.S. government assistance, support for health, education, welfare, are no longer considered citizens of the U.S. and IF all Congressional legislators and federal employee who reside in Texas are ousted because they are no longer citizens, and IF Texas pays trade tariffs and the like, as a foreign entity, and have to maintain their own army... and IF they no longer can vote, or serve in the U.S. military.

AND, of course, they'd have to give up all national sports teams like the Dallas Cowboys and that other one.

So... might..be a plan.
cool.gif

 
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deleted15807

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Well, it would essentially be his OWN idea, wouldn't it?



Hey... might work.

IF they no longer benefit from any U.S. government assistance, support for health, education, welfare, are no longer considered citizens of the U.S. and IF all Congressional legislators and federal employee who reside in Texas are ousted because they are no longer citizens, and IF Texas pays trade tariffs and the like, as a foreign entity, and have to maintain their own army... and IF they no longer can vote, or serve in the U.S. military.

AND, of course, they'd have to give up all national sports teams like the Dallas Cowboys and that other one.

So... might..be a plan.
cool.gif

The second all those Social Security checks stop and Medicare reimbursements stop suddenly the hate and disdain for the federal government will face an abrupt reality check.
 
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zinderel

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Lawmakers Who Backed Texas Lawsuit Should Be Barred From House


Rep. Bill Pascrell (D-N.J.) has called on House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) to bar 126 GOP representatives from the House, arguing that their support for the failed, baseless Texas lawsuit seeking to hijack the presidential election violated the Constitution.

Pascrell accused the House members who signed an amicus brief supporting the action — including House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) — of violating the Constitution by seeking to nullify Americans’ votes and instead choose a “dictator.” He cited Section 3 of the 14th Amendment, enacted after the Civil War and designed to keep traitors out of government.

The section prohibits anyone who had gone to war against the union or given aid and comfort to the nation’s enemies from running for federal or state office.

The Pennsylvania brief responding to the Texas lawsuit referred to its “seditious abuse of the judicial process.”

Of course, Democratic Party leadership won’t have the strength of character to actually do this, but they absolutely should. The Trump brigade and everyone who supported these lawsuits are goddamn traitors who tried a failed coup. If we can’t try them FOR treason, we should be able to deny them power, based on their behavior. Not ‘because they are Republican‘, or ‘because we are oppressing their religious freedom and expression of faith (*barf*)’, but because they supported and praised a man pissing all over the document and nation he was sworn to uphold...and actions should have consequences. ESPECIALLY for those in power.

Those who supported an attempted coup, and threw their lots in with a wannabe dictator with no respect for anything America was founded on (other than ‘white male landowners are all that matter’, anyway...) do not deserve to take part in a government they have tried so hard to undermine, delegitimize, and destroy. Nor should they be allowed to take positions of power over a nation whose will they attempted to subvert. That’s all there is to it.

“Comfort and succor to our enemies”, indeed...
 

zinderel

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I say let them secede. Heck, let’s help them leave more easily! Of course, the seceding states don’t get to keep the military bases or hardware, or any of the interstate commerce or US-paid infrastructure, and we will be reclaiming all federal land and sell it to the seceding states at market value. We will reclaim all federally funded material from the state and local governments, law enforcement and so on. They will be required to pay back federal taxes dating back to the original, failed attempt at secession, of course. What? National debt is good! A deficit is good for businesses! It spurs innovation!

Right...?!

Once we have removed everything American from their soil, they can have their gross racist wall, and stay on the other side of it and starve, for all I care. They can take all of their their non-productive states that drain welfare money by the billions, and their lack of any real form of entertainment other than hitting in their cousins and the Bible. They can have their high infant mortality rates, high obesity rates, high welfare recipients percentages, low education standards, religious fundamentalism, all the guns they want (provided they pay the tariffs on imported goods, unless every gunmaker goes with them. Which would be stupid. Not just because the US military is their main client, but also given how many ‘liberals’ out there own guns, too...), and plenty of legalized cousin-fucking.
 
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deleted15807

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I say let them secede. Heck, let’s help them leave more easily! Of course, the seceding states don’t get to keep the military bases or hardware, or any of the interstate commerce or US-paid infrastructure, and we will be reclaiming all federal land and sell it to the seceding states at market value. We will reclaim all federally funded material from the state and local governments, law enforcement and so on. They will be required to pay back federal taxes dating back to the original, failed attempt at secession, of course. What? National debt is good! A deficit is good for businesses! It spurs innovation!

Right...?!

Once we have removed everything American from their soil, they can have their gross racist wall, and stay on the other side of it and starve, for all I care. They can take all of their their non-productive states that drain welfare money by the billions, and their lack of any real form of entertainment other than hitting in their cousins and the Bible. They can have their high infant mortality rates, high obesity rates, high welfare recipients percentages, low education standards, religious fundamentalism, all the guns they want (provided they pay the tariffs on imported goods, unless every gunmaker goes with them. Which would be stupid. Not just because the US military is their main client, but also given how many ‘liberals’ out there own guns, too...), and plenty of legalized cousin-fucking.

Yep. They want a failed state so let them have it.
 
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zinderel

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Yep. They want a failed state so let them have it.

Honestly, though...what does Texas produce that we need? Other than shitty public school education standards for White GOP Jesus?

what does Florida have, other than the exploits of Florida Man and more cemeteries - and meth - per square foot than any other state?
 

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California is the 5th largest economy in the world, if it were a standalone nation. Larger than Great Britain.

Texas is apparently 10th, were it independent (which I’m sure chaps their ASSES, that California is better than them...)

We’d be fine.
 
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deleted15807

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Honestly, though...what does Texas produce that we need? Other than shitty public school education standards for White GOP Jesus?

what does Florida have, other than the exploits of Florida Man and more cemeteries - and meth - per square foot than any other state?

We have Texas and Texas East(Florida) and up to Moscow Mitch's Kentucky with an island of sanity in and around New Orleans that are moving further and further into their own Fox and Friends reality and now Newsmax and OANN twilight zone. Just when you think we couldn't get any more detached from reality we go one further.
 
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zinderel

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Oh come on chaps it all about the Trump effect and his cronies trying to get brownie points. Would Texas have even thought about going it alone had Trump won?

If they are saying this stuff and don’t mean it, they should still face the consequences. It doesn’t matter if Texas is ‘serious’. They are weakening the nation with talk of secession and acts of sedition. That should have consequences.
Period.
 
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deleted15807

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If they are saying this stuff and don’t mean it, they should still face the consequences. It doesn’t matter if Texas is ‘serious’. They are weakening the nation with talk of secession and acts of sedition. That should have consequences.
Period.

Agreed but as we've seen in the last 4 yrs of Trumpian greed, corruption, incompetence, malevolence there isn't much Trump supporters won't excuse and cheer anyway.

The GOP couldn't be any clearer than in the days since the election. Votes not for us do not count. To say nothing of supporting a man that calls Neo-Nazis "good people". We need to be very clear about what they tried to do and so far have failed. Overturning elections means we are done as a country. You have to ask what these Republicans think would happen in this country if the courts overturned the election and state legislators installed Trump as president again despite Biden having won the election, both the popular vote and Electoral College, by a landslide. Do they think the 80 million people who voted for Biden would accept their coup and go away quietly. Do they not recognize that there would be civil unrest and violence on an epic scale? Are they that stupid or delusional?


...Republican leaders now stand for a new notion: that the final decisions of voters can be challenged without a basis in fact if the results are not to the liking of the losing side, running counter to decades of work by the United States to convince developing nations that peaceful transfers of power are key to any freely elected government’s credibility.

How the G.O.P. Tried to Topple a Pillar of Democracy
 
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Freddie53

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Honest question.

A lot of talk right now about secession from the usual suspects. What do you guys think of it? Would you support secession? Do you think it would benefit the population as a whole? How Do you think it could actually work on a practical level?

I can see the cultural and political benefits of secession, but I don't think it works practically. What do you think?
Let's see. In 1860, some in the South thought secession to be a good idea. The South did secede. As a result, the South was almost destroyed. There was a huge loss of life and lifelong injuries.

Secession is not a good idea. The South lost its war against the North.

In 1867, the Supreme Court made a ruling that it is unconstitutional for a state to secede from the union. 0

We are all suppose too be Americans, not enemies! Members of just one nation!