Should Clinton bow out?

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by swordfishME, Mar 5, 2008.

  1. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    Now that McCain has officially secured the republican nomination, the democrats are looking at a protracted battle (the next big knock-out race is on April 22) which could hurt the party in the end.

    Should Hillary Clinton leave the race? Yeah, she won Ohio and Texas but it is still not enough for her re-take the delegate lead. Is it time for her to concede the race or still go on?

    Or do you think she should keep at it until all of the primaries are finished (because at this point it is impossible for anyone to secure the nomination in a two- way race based on pledged delegates alone)?
     
  2. Supersized

    Supersized New Member

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    If i were in her shoes I would fight to the end. I still want Obama to win though. I would respect Hilary even more if she didn't quit.
     
  3. vince

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    I don't think she should necessarily drop out. She could still win it. I remember past nominations going down to the wire. The '64 and '68 Republican nominations where decided in conventions. I think that maybe the heightened excitement and momentum coming out of a decisive convention could be good for the Dems. The republican convention will be a yawner, a non-news event because McCain has it wrapped up.
     
  4. Principessa

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    Win or lose she needs to ride this horse to the finish line.

     
  5. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    She gives up now then she loses all her clout at the convention. Real power lies with pledged delegates and so long as they're pledged to her, she's one of the two most powerful people at the convention. She won't concede them until she gets things in return.
     
  6. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    There is a chance that the longer the democratic fight goes on the more people are going to be turned off by the democrats. Face it, they will have to get more negative to try and knock the other one out of the race.

    But to what end and at what cost?

    What do you think that she would want that Obama could give her? I doubt she would want the VEEP slot, or a cabinet position. Maybe a SCOTUS nomination for herself?
     
  7. D_Gunther Snotpole

    D_Gunther Snotpole Account Disabled

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    I think there's as much chance that a protracted race will help the Dems as hurt them.
    So if she's simply looking at the party's good, there's no particular reason for her to drop out. She should, however, keep things reasonably clean. (Think she won't do that? Well, she must have learned by now that attacks on Obama have unpredictable effects, and she's not dumb and won't fail to realize that damaging the Democratic brand would be an offence that her fellow Dems would remember for decades.)
    And in personal terms, she has everything to gain by staying in.
    And while I doubt she can win, I don't think the odds against her are totally prohibitive.
    We have to see what last night's results do to Obama's momentum.
     
  8. D_Gunther Snotpole

    D_Gunther Snotpole Account Disabled

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    She might gets promises on the platform.
     
  9. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    If she wants to retain her dignity, legacy and political future......she Bows out with grace either shortly before or after the Pennsylvania Primary. The Delegate Arithmetic does not add up for her going forward.
     
  10. D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead

    D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead Account Disabled

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    You could make a case that both Clinton and Obama running still creates excitement for the Dems, because they are both such unique and trailblazing candidates.

    If they can go on running a relatively dignified race, the on-going contest might be a good thing. That's different from how things usually work politically, but there's some evidence in polling that Democrats and Independents want the race to continue, too.
     
  11. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    What part of last week of the Clinton campaign would you classify as "dignified"?
     
  12. D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead

    D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead Account Disabled

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    Industrialsize, in comparison to campaigns in the past, there has actually been less mudslinging in the last few weeks. The Clinton people learned that lesson the hard way when Bill Clinton took aim at Obama pre-South Carolina. She's been more negative than he has, but the level of negativity has been a) less than the Republican race this year when it was contested and b) less than the usual presidential primary race in general.

    With that said, she's been un-strategic and rotated too many messages thru her campaign, while Obama has run a much better campaign.

    I'm voting for Obama when my state's primary rolls around, but Clinton's attacks on Obama are maybe a 3 or 4 on a 1-to-10 intensity scale (10 being highest).
     
  13. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    My guess would be:

    Allow her to construct the platform for healthcare reform. She'll work on it in the Senate, meanwhile Obama as President lobbies congress for her plan. When its finalized they present it a joint plan between congress and the White House.

    Bring more money to New York in works projects. Earmarks for New York get passed more than others. Hillary takes credit.

    Bill gets to be Ambassador to the UN or a SCOTUS seat.

    Clinton supporters get plum appointments. Clinton supporters get contracts. Clinton supporters get special interest legislation passed without White House objection.

    The last, and perhaps most canny step would be to take the Veep slot and use it to be an active President of the Senate, essentially running the Senate as a majority leader would. Doing for the vice presidency in the Senate in its role of President of the Senate what Cheney did for the vice presidency in the White House. Harry Reid isn't all that popular. I don't find this scenario likely but it's the kind of thing she could ask for and get.
     
  14. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    This is true. Nobody's paying any attention to McCain. Problem is it costs a lot of money to keep a campaign going. Providing she can scrape-up the cash, this contest will keep the GOP marginalized simply for the headlines it grabs.
     
  15. swordfishME

    swordfishME Member

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    Is he even qualified for a SCOTUS seat after the lying about the Lewinsky mess?

    The Veep ideat with strong senate control could be tempting
     
  16. Industrialsize

    Staff Member Moderator Gold Member

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    I think a stronger case could be made that at the first opportunity, PRESIDENT Obama nominate HILLARY Clinton for the supreme court. She is a lawyer. Yes she has never been a judge but there is precedent for nominating a lawyer who has never been a judge. She would never have to worry about being elected again. She would be a thorn in the right's side for the rest of her life. She could push her liberal agenda with gusto with NO political repercusssions....I see a Cief Justic Hillary Clinton in the future. I think she would make a great supreme court justice.
     
  17. D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead

    D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead Account Disabled

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    The Republican party is just a terrible "brand" this year, too. Although McCain won, he has his work cut out for him because he's not great at raising cash, and the Dems are going to tie him to Bush every single chance they get. Get ready to see lots and lots of ads showing George W. and McCain together, to drive that point home.
     
  18. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    SCOTUS (like impeachment) is a political position. He may be disbarred and guilty of perjury but that's no impediment to a SCOTUS seat. All you need is an appointment and a confirmation. The Dems should be able to keep their majority for the foreseeable future and a simple majority is all that's required.
     
  19. D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead

    D_Chaumbrelayne_Copprehead Account Disabled

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    I agree with you. She's be an awesome mind to have on the court. She could also be majority leader in the Senate and do great stuff there.
     
  20. jason_els

    jason_els <img border="0" src="/images/badges/gold_member.gi

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    I don't think she'd go for it. The Senate is more powerful in terms of crafting legislation. She loves being in the circles of power and there are just too many restrictions on a justice being overtly political. It's a good place to go once you've been president, or your active political career is winding down, but not before.
     
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