Should spanking kids be illegal? (Canada)

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by D_Tintagel_Demondong, Jun 20, 2008.

  1. D_Tintagel_Demondong

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    Senators approve anti-spanking bill

    A proposed law that could see parents charged for spanking their children is heading to the House of Commons after clearing a major hurdle in the Senate.

    The bill, supported by the Liberal majority, quietly passed third reading in the Senate on Tuesday night despite Conservative objections to the legislation. The vote count was not recorded.

    Bill S-209, which needs House approval to be made into law, proposes to eliminate Section 43 of Canada's Criminal Code, which allows parents, teachers and caregivers to use reasonable force to discipline a child and correct their behaviour.

    Liberal Senator CĂ©line Hervieux-Payette first introduced the bill in December 2004, shortly after the Supreme Court denied a challenge to Section 43 and upheld the right of adults to physically discipline children between the ages of two and 12.

    --CBC News
     
  2. DC_DEEP

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    Some of our states here in the USA have similar laws.

    I find it truly interesting (and puzzling) that the various governments flip-flop so often on so many different issues on whether a minor child is a citizen, a ward, or a chattel.
     
  3. B_Mademoiselle Rouge

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    When a child begins to communicate verbally, its very easy to hold things hostage that they want to do or play with in order to get things out of them. If my daughter doesn't want to listen about cleaning up her messes she's made....she gets to go to bed really early that night (which is something she absolutely hates to do)

    If a parent is clever, spanking isnt necessary. Now if shes getting very sassy mouthed or throwing a huge fit and not listening, she might get a little wack on the butt. I know it doesnt hurt as much as it gets her attention and shes so damn dramatic that she makes a big deal out of it and how i hurt her feelings. Then afterwards we can talk about what she did that was out of line and how we can do better to listen and not act like a baby.
     
  4. B_Monster

    B_Monster New Member

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    Not illegal but, I wouldn't spank my child
     
  5. ZOS23xy

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    I avoided it, but we did give him a warning. If caught playing with matches, he'll be spanked. He's a bit bigger than I am now, but fifteen. The warning did work.
     
  6. omgiswatdeysay

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    I think its rediculous that they have laws to where you cannot discipline your child. Its not child abuse for christ sakes, its an attention getter. IT DOES however become child abuse when something other than a hand is used. I had an old southern grandma that would make YOU go get a switch so SHE could tan ya with it...lol that was an attention getter for sure. But in all seriousness, spanking a child is not a bad thing..its not going make them hate you. its not going make them go and abuse themselves, etc.

    Spare the rod, Spoil the Child, I say.
     
  7. Dave NoCal

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    https://mantis.csuchico.edu/login?u...rue&db=psyh&AN=2002-01514-001&site=ehost-live

    Some psychological research suggests that the use of corporal punishment does not provide children with the learning opportunities that come with consistent verbal conflict resolution. One of the problems with corporal punishment is that some parents hit their children out of anger and many children die yearly.
    It's important to understand some of the cultural issues. For example, many years ago I worked with youth in rural Georgia. There it was totally commonplace for boys, especially teenagers, to be whipped with a belt. In many cases, these children could explain the predictable consequenses of specific behaviors. For example, lying to one's parents would result in three licks. These boys did not seem traumatized, in the least, by this kind of discipline.
    Dave
     
  8. D_Marazion Analdouche

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    Too Shocking - Men's Extreme Entertainment Source. Shocking videos, humor, and more!

    I don't think you should smack your kid for not picking up his or her socks. But giving them a little whack for those moments when they reaaaaallly need it isn't a bad thing.

    I've posted my opinions on this before so I'm not going to go too far into it. I think as a hole we parents are spending waaaay too much time "reasoning" with kids. They start becoming pretty smart at an early age and know saying what you want to hear will get them out of a lot of stuff. Children need to be taught what real consequences are, time outs or losing Xbox rights doesn't always work. So kids it may, some it won't, parents shouldn't have the way to raise their kids dictated to them.

    We are raising a very soft generation of kids, this isn't going to be good for anybody.
     
  9. exwhyzee

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    I agree. I was never spanked as a kid. Not once. My parents were older and more clever than that. I think parents should exert themselves to rise above physical violence as an attention getting device.
     
  10. B_Mademoiselle Rouge

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    i was spanked, my brothers were always getting spanked. My parents have learned a lot about patience and how to deal with things now that they dont have a housefull.

    I've spanked my daughter, its worked in some cases and not in others. And now that she is very verbal we are able to move on to more productive and informative ways to deal with the problems.
     
  11. flame boy

    flame boy Account Disabled

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    Regardless of if its children or adults, I think resorting to "violence" (blanket term) shows a lack of communication skills - However this being said, I do realise how trying kids can be sometimes. I wouldn't ever have kids, but if I did I certainly wouldn't hit them. I think you can discipline a child without resorting to this level.
     
  12. B_Mademoiselle Rouge

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    I dont see spanking as a violent act, i do see where it could be termed as such when people lose control. My daughter has been spanked as a concenquence and was warned ahead of time that it was going to happen and it was very matter of fact. One or two swats on her butt, not in a violent manner. I wasnt yelling and screaming at her.

    I've experienced and been around a lot of kids who have been verbally abused as a form of punishment, and its not nearly as affective as a swat or two on the bum if you ask me.

    Some kids can't be reasoned with, some kids also cant comprehend the communication no matter how many times you tell them to stop messing with the cat. A little bit of physical pain does get the message through.

    It's always the people who never have kids who set these kinds of rules for other people who do.
     
  13. Eaglepath

    Eaglepath New Member

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    I don't see spanking as a violent act either. There is definitely a difference between a spanking and a beating.
    I was always been told to be strict while a child is young, and it wouldn't be such a hard job when they get older.I feel it is much more damaging for a young person to grow up without being responsible for their actions, and also learning there are consequences to all actions to consider first .
     
  14. D_Marazion Analdouche

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    This is why people are sticking their noses in places where it doesn't belong....like the lives and houses of other people.

    Giving your kid a whack on the ass is not "phyiscal violence". Labeling it with this type of description is just rediculous and looking for a way to make something sound 100 times worse than it is.

    As an example beating your kids and leaving bruises is abuse and always has been. Spanking when done properly is not, so let's stop with calling it physicaly violence shall we?
     
  15. D_Marazion Analdouche

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    QTF!
     
  16. flame boy

    flame boy Account Disabled

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    You're quite right, I incorrectly used the term "voilent" to describe spanking, voilent is too much of a strong word, accept my appologies for this. What I meant was I personally chose to verbalise my feelings rather than convert them into physical actions. This isn't to say I condone people who smack their kids. I hope I'm not talking a load of old shite.

    You're also right about the fact it's always the people who aren't involved that set the rules. x
     
  17. B_Mademoiselle Rouge

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    I think its strange that the non-spanker committee is always filled with the following people:

    People who were never spanked

    People who don't have kids

    People who were physically abused


    I never see kids like myself who were spanked in normal context come out against spanking because we don't feel damaged, abused or become violent people in life.

    Some of the most violent children i've ever seen were kids whos parents were complete pushovers or verbally abusive because they never followed through with anything they were threatening all the time.
     
  18. B_Mademoiselle Rouge

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    I'm a HUGE communicator such as yourself. Having an autistic child makes you learn to break down your communication to little particles that most kids could digest. Before my daughter was able to speak (about 3 years old) spanking was rare, but it was more necessary to keep her from hurting herself on things because she didnt understand the dangers of objects and also had some major tandrums because of her lack of being able to verbalize her feelings.

    She is 6 years old and is quite elaborate verbally, but we are dealing with a phase of her starting to cry when she is told to do something she doesnt like and now we are going back to the "Just tell me what you are thinking/feeling and we can talk about it"
     
  19. B_mitchymo

    B_mitchymo New Member

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    It was banned in the UK a few years ago now and as much as this was an achievement for children's rights groups etc i think that in the end it is counter-productive.
    Making into law actions to protect the few children at risk from bad parents is taking away a valuable tool for discipline which will result in unruly behaviour later down the line.
    Kids in the UK are very anti-social when they are empowered with the "you ca'nt touch me" attitude. Abuse of teachers in schools are commonplace and i work in a store where the abusive kids are more intimidating than abusive adults on the grounds that your hands are tied dealing with children...you can physically remove an adult from the store safe in the knowledge that if you are assaulted by them then you can justifiably defend yourself but with a child you ca'nt do anything.
    I and most of my peers grew up with smacking and as much as it is unpleasant at the time it has had no negative effect on us and besides it is MEANT to be unlikeable, thats the point.
    The carrot and stick method is very effective...take away the stick and you get chaos!
     
  20. Bbucko

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    Not so. When I was a kid a parent would have had to land their child in the hospital before anyone even noticed, if then. It was only after some huge problems that awareness was raised regarding child abuse.

    First, although you don't need me saying so, you do sound like you're doing a great job with your autistic daughter. My second sister, who is ten years younger than I, has been special needs all her life. My mother wasn't equipped to handle her the way you do yours.

    The issue here is whether or not "spanking" is just a whack or a wallop, and when punishment turns into degradation.

    When my mom was just a drunk, things were bad but mostly manageable. When she started mixing Valium and sleeping pills into the mix, all her angst and horrors were unleashed on me and my two younger sisters.

    We experienced the uncontrolled rage of a very disturbed woman who should probably never have had kids. But she did. And the rage was always masked as "discipline" and "punishment", even when we'd done nothing wrong.

    Parents will always hit their kids, irrespective of laws, when they feel it's their entitlement or duty as parents. Whether or not it should become of interest to the larger community is an issue of child safety now, not family "privacy" as before.
     
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