Signs of femininity

[redz_rule]

The fact that it may or may not be their opinion is irrelevant. If public opinion says you aren't a woman because your boobs are too small, are you going to respect that opinion? FUCK no, that's not what makes you a woman! Women should not have to fit themselves into a tiny little box so that they can call themselves feminine, and it appears that's what you are doing. This is where it starts babe.

You assume too much, you know nothing about me. I have not given my opinion on what I consider feminine and my initial response was merely a response to Incocknito. I didn't agree with his opinion. Neither do I agree with you singling out his response for chastisement when he gave his opinion, as requested. I'm not defending him - but he did what was asked and i don't see a great deal of difference between his posts and those using terms such as 'curves'. His was more vulgar, but it's the same diff. I'm not a kid, I really don't need the lecture thanks. That's me done.

 

[Incocknito]

My point was it was quite sexist. Insultingly sexist. Theoretically, men and women are equals. Treatment such as this works against that. I strongly disapprove, the reason I pointed it out in the first place. He's gone further than that?

Are you on crack? You want me to say men and women are THE SAME?

If men and women were the same they wouldn't be called men or women / masculine or feminine.

The point is that there are two glaring differences between men and women: tits and long hair.

And redz: Obviously most of the time I can tell someone is a boy or girl but I was saying that in extreme cases the only way to tell is to undress them.

Barring nudity, boobs and long hair are the only signs of femininity. Most people are aware of this. It's why the butch lesbians often have short hair and sometimes compress their boobs to make themselves look flat chested. It's a way to mask their femininity.

 

[Smaccoms]

^^^^okay, most of what you just said is not true. I did not say men and women are the same, only that they are equals. Two completely different things. Apparently, the concept of men and women being equals does not sit well with you.

The point I am trying to make here redz is that complacency can potentially contribute to the lack of progression in our society (think Switzerland). If you could debate with him to the point of swaying his conservative opinion of femininity, wouldn't you want to? This is where you start swaying public opinion to a less sexist one, in your own favor.

 

[Incocknito]

I don't know where you are getting that interpretation from. This thread is about signs of femininity. I don't think I have particularly derided women or made them out to be worth less than men.

I would be interested if you could quote what you seem to have such a problem with.

It is a fact that women with short hair can look like boys. And by definition if someone looks like a boy they can't look 100% feminine.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

The point is that there are two glaring differences between men and women: tits and long hair.[...]
Barring nudity, boobs and long hair are the only signs of femininity.

Really? You can't spot male/female hands? Male/female necks? Male/female ankles? Wow - some of the straight hunting trannies I knew in my college days would have loved you. To within an inch of your life, probably. :lmao:

ETA: 'Only signs of femininity'? You are mixing up being female and being feminine - the two are not dependent, that is (in case you choose to misunderstand) one does not have to be feminine to be female (see your own example of butches - though plenty would say they are their own definition of feminine - but this thread appears to be about traditionally held views of what is feminine) and one does not have to be female to be feminine (there are plenty of men and boys with feminine features - no, not just camp guys and not just gay guys either).

 

[Smaccoms]

It is a fact that women with short hair can look like boys. And by definition if someone looks like a boy they can't look 100% feminine.

This is complete bullcrap. I cannot believe you are still being so narrow-minded. You apparently know nothing of femininity. How would you like it if someone were to say, "The only thing which can prove a guy's masculinity are his massive muscles; without them he is not masculine." That's just as ridiculous AND sexist. I find this very insulting to say seriously.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

Sma, you're right - we both know you are, but you aren't going to change this guy's mind. He is very narrow-minded and has funny perceptions like this set in stone. I've discovered, over time, that he is not worth the bother. By all means state opposition - but don't bother to argue, he doesn't have the wit for an interesting debate and his old-fashioned mind is closed.

 

[Smaccoms]

Sma, you're right - we both know you are, but you aren't going to change this guy's mind. He is very narrow-minded and has funny perceptions like this set in stone. I've discovered, over time, that he is not worth the bother. By all means state opposition - but don't bother to argue, he doesn't have the wit for an interesting debate and his old-fashioned mind is closed.

Thank you for the advice. I would have kept trying to sway his opinion otherwise. I may continue the debate for my own good (develop my perceptions and ability to debate), but now I won't take it personally when his opinion doesn't change. Thank you very much!

 

[D_Dick_S_Lapp]

I don't think there's a true definition or example of what femininity is anymore. A lot of those notions have been shattered a long time ago. Ok maybe just bent lol.

 

[D_PooNaHoe]

Voluminous breasts and soft skin. Also, I like women who are opinionated. To me thats much more feminine than a quiet and unopinionated woman who holds everything in.

 

[Smaccoms]

I don't think there's a true definition or example of what femininity is anymore. A lot of those notions have been shattered a long time ago. Ok maybe just bent lol.

The issue is that it's a cultural construct. This doesn't mean it isn't important, just difficult to deal with. Human beings have been evolving culture as a means of survival of our species ever since social bonds first started to appear, with Homo Erectus about 1 to 2 million years ago. These cultural constructs are very much cemented into human consciousness and our self-identities. How they are defined in the overall culture in which we live in acts as a guideline to how it is defined in all the micro-cultures underneath it (like San Francisco in America). It acts as the reality in which we live, which is vital to our survival as a species (if climate gets colder, we build more fires rather than grow thicker fur. This can then be incorporated into culture).

Existing outside this framework is possible, though it is inhumane in every meaning of the word. This doesn't mean you have to accept or like the overall societal definitions in order to follow the survival instinct of our species. Quite the opposite actually. If these constructs evolve to work against the bonds tying a culture together, then it needs to be changed or scraped altogether for something new. If something works against a culture like that, it creates weak spots which can become exposed during times of great crisis. It's a driving force behind the progression of society in our species.

It's also important to note that homo sapiens are products of adapting to change. It has what created who and what we are today. This is why we should especially embrace something new, if the old isn't working to our advantage.

 

[D_Dick_S_Lapp]

The issue is that it's a cultural construct. This doesn't mean it isn't important, just difficult to deal with. Human beings have been evolving culture as a means of survival of our species ever since social bonds first started to appear, with Homo Erectus about 1 to 2 million years ago. These cultural constructs are very much cemented into human consciousness and our self-identities. How they are defined in the overall culture in which we live in acts as a guideline to how it is defined in all the micro-cultures underneath it (like San Francisco in America). It acts as the reality in which we live, which is vital to our survival as a species (if climate gets colder, we build more fires rather than grow thicker fur. This can then be incorporated into culture).

Existing outside this framework is possible, though it is inhumane in every meaning of the word. This doesn't mean you have to accept or like the overall societal definitions in order to follow the survival instinct of our species. Quite the opposite actually. If these constructs evolve to work against the bonds tying a culture together, then it needs to be changed or scraped altogether for something new. If something works against a culture like that, it creates weak spots which can become exposed during times of great crisis. It's a driving force behind the progression of society in our species.

It's also important to note that homo sapiens are products of adapting to change. It has what created who and what we are today. This is why we should especially embrace something new, if the old isn't working to our advantage.

What does the survival of the human race have to do with femininity? Or vice versa sorry

Editing this before i catch a flaming. lol I'm not asking what women have to do with the human race. Just femininity.

 

[B_ILIW]

I think it's important to remember that masculinity and femininity are societal concepts. What defines them occur in venues that the society holds in high regard, or has power over the masses. Some examples could be sports (especially the most famous ones), television, and literature.
These concepts are also just as much psychological. Self-esteem and confidence in knowing oneself as an individual can be the core of self-identity in any context, including a sexual/feminine one.
Overall, ones masculine or feminine identity is as much personal as it is social. Traits can shift and morph from one social context to another, which is why it's as important in one self-identity as it is when alone. For example, what makes me masculine as a gay man when with my siblings is different as opposed to when I'm with my Parkour CLub at school.
Thats just my opinion anyway. It may be a little abstract, but I hope it helps!

Men and women are different psychologically. I think it's too PC to say there are no gender differences, other than the obvious anatomical/physiological ones.

 

[The Dragon]

Voluminous breasts and soft skin. Also, I like women who are opinionated. To me thats much more feminine than a quiet and unopinionated woman who holds everything in.

I knew there was a reason why I like you so much!

The only time anything of mine gets held in is when I wear a corset and then "they" :wink: tend to overflow out the top.:biggrin1:

 

[Smaccoms]

What does the survival of the human race have to do with femininity? Or vice versa sorry

Editing this before i catch a flaming. lol I'm not asking what women have to do with the human race. Just femininity.

Sorry, sometimes I forget how vastly complicated this stuff is. I've organized it in my brain, but transferring that to paper is more difficult to do. *Deep breath* Okay, here goes...

As human beings evolved, we developed the ability to have a consciousness outside our natural instinct. This gave us the ability to care about one another as individuals. This is where human culture first started to develop. We, as a species, realized that we could manipulate our surroundings in order to survive rather than manipulate ourselves.
With animals, if a problem arises which prevents their survival, they evolve around or beyond that problem. The climate gets colder, they evolve thicker coats or heavier diets to make up for it. Human beings are unique; we alter our culture in order to make up for the change instead. If it got colder for example, thicker garments suddenly become a part of all ceremonies. This means ever since human culture has been formed, it has driven our evolution rather than our bodies or genetic expression. Thus, whatever drives culture drives our evolution, and thus our survival as a species.
Do you see the direction I'm going with this now? I think my brain needs a bit of a break...

 

[Smaccoms]

Men and women are different psychologically. I think it's too PC to say there are no gender differences, other than the obvious anatomical/physiological ones.

Again, I wasn't saying women and men are the same, only that they are equals. Also, it is extremely difficult (some say impossible) to know the root of these differences between the genders. The age old "nature vs nurture" debate, if you are familiar.

I believe you could be trying to distinguish the difference between sex and gender. This is very astute of you to mention...

Sex: what's between one's legs.

Gender: What's between your ears.

 

[D_Dick_S_Lapp]

Sorry, sometimes I forget how vastly complicated this stuff is. I've organized it in my brain, but transferring that to paper is more difficult to do. *Deep breath* Okay, here goes...

As human beings evolved, we developed the ability to have a consciousness outside our natural instinct. This gave us the ability to care about one another as individuals. This is where human culture first started to develop. We, as a species, realized that we could manipulate our surroundings in order to survive rather than manipulate ourselves.
With animals, if a problem arises which prevents their survival, they evolve around or beyond that problem. The climate gets colder, they evolve thicker coats or heavier diets to make up for it. Human beings are unique; we alter our culture in order to make up for the change instead. If it got colder for example, thicker garments suddenly become a part of all ceremonies. This means ever since human culture has been formed, it has driven our evolution rather than our bodies or genetic expression. Thus, whatever drives culture drives our evolution, and thus our survival as a species.
Do you see the direction I'm going with this now? I think my brain needs a bit of a break...

Ah well err. I mean i understand what your saying. Which is the reason i said that there is no longer a real concrete definition for what femininity is. We've evolved (for lack of a better word) into a race that can effectively confuse ourselves. With regard to physical appearances that is. Well except child birth and maybe some inner workings (vajayjay). Still there are those who've evolved with both "feminine" and "masculine" physical characteristics.

As far as the cultural meaning of it goes well thats kind of a nature versus nature convo isn't it? Do we as a race really dictate what is or what isn't or are we learning that things are way more complicated.

If we control our biology then a good 90% of us wouldn't be here right now. Cause of you know...hitler (haha i just confirmed the law!). And if our biology controls us how is it that people just change. Sexes i mean.

Ok seems what i wrote was already written so yeah there's that lol.

I will ask this though. Is femininity a gender topic or a sex topic? Cause that might start a very awesome convo.

 

[D_PooNaHoe]

I knew there was a reason why I like you so much!

The only time anything of mine gets held in is when I wear a corset and then "they" :wink: tend to overflow out the top.:biggrin1:

Oh sweet Jeebus! Well, I'm sure I could help tend the overflow. It's the gentlemanly thing to do.