So it has a number- California to vote in November to legalize weed

[B_VinylBoy]

I don't think it's marijuana that's keeping California's jails full.

What's staggering is that it costs over $50,000/ head to keep people in jail in CA, compared to $10-20,000 in all the Southern states - who's creaming off the system?

In Your State: Prison Costs . NOW on PBS

I think taxpayers should be a little more concerned with that!

$30,000 less spent * 171,000 inmates = $5.1 Billion savings!

That's more than the revenue they'd make in 10 years taxing the herb.

That's not an honest statistic for that kind of argument.
Marijuana possession is one of the top five reasons for arrest in this country. Its overall impact on our jail system and population is more than apparent. I provided a link stating this earlier in this thread.

We'd expect the prices of prisons in states like California and New York to be higher than most southern states just on the simple fact that the cost of living is much higher in these areas. In some twisted sense, people in prison can be financially measured on the same everyday necessities as free civilians. Food, water, electricity, heat, health, etc... it all applies. If states like California are supposed to simply drop their costs per inmate, then how do they do it without reducing the living conditions of inmates to be anymore barbaric than it already is? As much as we want to think of prisoners as ingrates who deserve no sympathy or rights, that doesn't give us the right to treat them like animals once they are detained.

SoYouWanna The ten most expensive U.S. cities to live in | SoYouWanna.com
America's 5 Most and Least Expensive Cities

Legalizing marijuana will eliminate a lot of arrests and cut down on crime rates, thereby saving the state a lot of money for Prison costs. Plus, revenue from marijuana can be taxed on the same levels of cigarettes which means even more money for the state. Over time, that would benefit a state more than just cutting the cost per inmate. Besides, where's the savings if you have one inmate in jail at $50K a year versus three potheads at $20K a year?

 

[B_crackoff]

That's not an honest statistic for that kind of argument.
Marijuana possession is one of the top five reasons for arrest in this country. Its overall impact on our jail system and population is more than apparent. I provided a link stating this earlier in this thread.

That's only half a statistic - 0.3% of the prison population are in jail for 1st time use. It's a myth to suggest otherwise.

We'd expect the prices of prisons in states like California and New York to be higher than most southern states just on the simple fact that the cost of living is much higher in these areas. In some twisted sense, people in prison can be financially measured on the same everyday necessities as free civilians. Food, water, electricity, heat, health, etc... it all applies. If states like California are supposed to simply drop their costs per inmate, then how do they do it without reducing the living conditions of inmates to be anymore barbaric than it already is? As much as we want to think of prisoners as ingrates who deserve no sympathy or rights, that doesn't give us the right to treat them like animals once they are detained.

Only 0.3% of the prison population is in jail for 1st time posession of marijuana for personal use.

You cannot be jailed in CA & some other states for 1st time personal usage .

Everybody else is in jail with conjunction for some other offence, trafficking, or parole violation.
http://www.ncjrs.gov/ondcppubs/publications/pdf/whos_in_prison_for_marij.pdf

Your comment on housing costs is completely erroneus. It costs $6,800/inmate - the healthcare costs are $3billion, or circa $20,000/prisoner! No wonder people live longer in prison than on the street.
As Calif. prison spending rises, so do concerns - U.S. news - Life - msnbc.com

Just to underline this massive cost, the NHS budget in the UK for 61 million people, arguably the most expensive "free" system in the world, is £108BN/$160BN, or $2,600/person. So CA spends 8 times more on inmate health! That's staggering, & a con. It's even more than the $7,400/capita in the USA as a whole, despite the fact that there are enormous economies of scale in treating at large institutions, with no missed appointments.

Someone is conning someone here. And wages in CA, are not 2 or 3 times that of Texas etc.

Otherwise, the only problem with legalisation is that, despite what other posters have written, fondly remembering people having a quiet puff at home, is that what actually happens is that everyone seems to go out & smoke it, as anyone in London could attest to when they briefly relaxed the law.

Add to this the increasing strength of the product & associated potential for psychosis, the fact that CA f*cking banned smoking in public places - so why advocate Ganga, & the fact that ecstacy is far more pleasant, non-addictive, & a tranquil empathetic drug, yet isn't being considered, & YOU WONDER WHY THEY'RE HOLDING A REFERENDUM.

But California isn't logical I guess - it's whichever lobby groups attract the most support, regardless of the contradictions.:smile:

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Only 0.3% of the prison population is in jail for 1st time posession of marijuana for personal use.

You cannot be jailed in CA & some other states for 1st time personal usage.

I never mentioned a thing about first time personal usage or offenses. You did. That's pigeonholing the issue to a very small factoid that doesn't address the real issue. Again, pot possession is one of the top five reasons for arrest for this country. That takes into consideration all reasons and offenses.

Your comment on housing costs is completely erroneus. It costs $6,800/inmate - the healthcare costs are $3billion, or circa $20,000/prisoner! No wonder people live longer in prison than on the street.
As Calif. prison spending rises, so do concerns - U.S. news - Life - msnbc.com

Let me repeat myself: In some twisted sense, people in prison can be financially measured on the same everyday necessities as free civilians. Food, water, electricity, heat, health, etc... it all applies. Where does that imply that they are exactly the same? Are you suggesting that an inmate in prison doesn't have similar needs as a regular civilian in regards to everyday necessity? Also, if your numbers were only geared to point out health care costs then you should have stated that previously. Your last post made no direct reference to that.

Just to underline this massive cost, the NHS budget in the UK for 61 million people, arguably the most expensive "free" system in the world, is £108BN/$160BN, or $2,600/person. So CA spends 8 times more on inmate health! That's staggering, & a con. It's even more than the $7,400/capita in the USA as a whole, despite the fact that there are enormous economies of scale in treating at large institutions, with no missed appointments.

Considering the fiasco that was HCL last year, I don't think it takes a rocket scientist to figure out why health care expenses are so high for inmates in certain states. Some states and plans saw anywhere up to a 35% rise in premiums. I'm more than certain that this is across the board and not just for free, law abiding citizens.

Add to this the increasing strength of the product & associated potential for psychosis, the fact that CA f*cking banned smoking in public places - so why advocate Ganga, & the fact that ecstacy is far more pleasant, non-addictive, & a tranquil empathetic drug, yet isn't being considered, & YOU WONDER WHY THEY'RE HOLDING A REFERENDUM.

Well, as an asthmatic I can let you know that second hand smoking does affect me in ways that I didn't even realize until it was pointed out to me. Being that I work in night clubs and bars on a regular basis (and also live in a city that banned smoking in many areas), I also believe that some of the laws banning cigarette smoking are excessive. There should be designated areas with proper ventilation available for people who do want to smoke. Even so, that's just a diversion from the subject of marijuana.

 

[B_crackoff]

VB - I can't be assed to quote, but I was staggered by the healthcare in CA costing more than the total cost in the South.

Inmates must come out in better shape, health, & with decent teeth I'd hope for that kind of money. The average American, or even the country as a whole, couldn't even begin to afford that kind of treatment - so there is some odd benefit to going to jail!

There may be a lot of arrests, but it's only 2,000/day out of 320Mn, so everyday 1 in 160,000 is arrested for marijuana, mainly as a result of searches relating to other offences of whom less than 1% go to jail for a 1st time offence.

While I've no problem with recreational drugs, used responsibly, i.e not when you're still under the effects at work the next day, driving, or looking after kids, we all know that there will be a reckless minority who will screw up that responsibility, causing the same laws to be enacted again.

It's not like there aren't loads of people getting legally high on prescription drugs however, who conversely have a very moral opinion on those who self medicate.

 

[TomCat84]

it's not like there aren't loads of people getting legally high on prescription drugs however, who conversely have a very moral opinion on those who self medicate.

ding ding ding ding ding ding!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[simbasa12]

Werd. It's supposed to only be for medical conditions, but it's so vague as to be de facto legal. I have a lot of friends who have a prescription for weed for stuff like "anxiety" and "general headache". Marijuana dispensaries have popped up all over the place. I have several within walking distance of my apartment.

It's a joke really. I smoked out the other day with some 17 year old who had his card. He asked me why I didn't have mine, as it's as simple as ordering at the drive thru at Mcdonalds. I guess I should hook one up, since I have headaches...from smoking too much. :biggrin1:


If it's made legal, I am just going to grow my own at home. So much for the government getting those tax dollars. Unless they start going after people for growing a plant or two at home. Nah, they wouldn't do that, would they?

 

[Industrialsize]

An interesting study on what would happen to the price of Pot if it were legalized;

A study released Thursday by the Rand Corporation claims that marijuana prices in a post-legalization California could drop by up to 80 percent, placing some of the most delicately cultivated buds in the world at less than $40 an ounce.
An initiative that would legalize California's most valuable cash crop will be on the state's Nov. 2010 ballot. Should it pass, individual counties and municipalities would be able to opt in or out of the legalized system; those which opt in would be given additional tax and enforcement options, and residents would be allowed to transport up to one ounce and grow plants in a five-foot-by-five-foot area.


Study: If California legalizes marijuana, prices could drop up to 80 pct. | Raw Story

 

[TomCat84]

It's a joke really. I smoked out the other day with some 17 year old who had his card. He asked me why I didn't have mine, as it's as simple as ordering at the drive thru at Mcdonalds. I guess I should hook one up, since I have headaches...from smoking too much. :biggrin1:


If it's made legal, I am just going to grow my own at home. So much for the government getting those tax dollars. Unless they start going after people for growing a plant or two at home. Nah, they wouldn't do that, would they?

Hehe, I'm coming over to your house. I'll bring the doritos :wink: