student/teacher relations
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MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK
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I didn't read anything nefarious in his post either, to be honest. However, I am glad you two were able to come to an understanding and separation of the two worlds in which you both share. And, I think that having a teacher place the kind of trust in him that you are can serve as a valuable life-lesson for him and may ultimately lead to his being an even better person for him. So, you may not have only helped him in the ways of being young-and-hung but also in the ways of being a respectable and decent young man as well. Good for you, DMW!
Cheers,
Brit
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I never saw anything wrong with what Pete posted, either. I only saw some immaturity in his wording, but hey...he's a 17 year old. I don't think he meant to cause any harm, but people on here jumped to all sorts of conclusions without ever giving him the benefit of the doubt. Dee was the only one who gave Pete a chance all the other posters seemed to condemn Pete for what was not meant to be anything but him saying he was cool with things. Give the kid a break...he and DMW have things worked out, if it's cool between them, that's all that matters. Like Jonb said, is it really all that bad if the the blackmail topic was telling people that either one of them was hung?
Thanks, Prep.
Forgive me for raining on this relief parade, but I am still a little anxious for DMW and Pete in this situation. It's good -- and surprising -- that the two of you met up to discuss your meeting here in a frank and open manner. It seems like you both respect each other enough to keep this acquaintanceship here a secret. Thank the stars.
I've been catching up on the ethical and professional issues of family therapy this term, and I still can't help but feel a bit unsettled about how "happy" everything turned out. It's one thing that Pete and DMW can agree to happily coexist here. And I'm not denying Pete's right to be. He's a big boy quite literally and he could use the information.
However, it would be immensely different if this acquaintanceship were to leak out. If Pete were to let anything slip about DMW, then I wouldn't be surprised if the news spread quickly among classmates -- c'mon, 'cause kids who have nothing better to do gossip -- and, sooner or later, some other honcho might catch wind of it.
DMW, while the mood has settled for now, you must consciously accept and understand the risk of your ruin. If the wrong person finds out about your "inappropriate relationship" -- and yes, inappropriate doesn't necessarily mean that you're servicing the kid behind closed doors -- you can be fired from your school or even black-listed from teaching in your state. The teaching profession does not look kindly on such contact no matter how "innocent" or "friendly."
For your sake, you might want to reacquaint yourself on an ethical code for teachers in your state, if such a thing exists, to learn the ramifications of your situation. While I don't foresee Pete turning malevolent and telling everyone in Jena about DMW and his penis and his sexuality, I think DMW would be doing a great service to himself if he were to be better informed about the nature of his professional conduct.
Forgive me for raining on this relief parade, but I am still a little anxious for DMW and Pete in this situation. It's good -- and surprising -- that the two of you met up to discuss your meeting here in a frank and open manner. It seems like you both respect each other enough to keep this acquaintanceship here a secret. Thank the stars.
I've been catching up on the ethical and professional issues of family therapy this term, and I still can't help but feel a bit unsettled about how "happy" everything turned out. It's one thing that Pete and DMW can agree to happily coexist here. And I'm not denying Pete's right to be. He's a big boy quite literally and he could use the information.
However, it would be immensely different if this acquaintanceship were to leak out. If Pete were to let anything slip about DMW, then I wouldn't be surprised if the news spread quickly among classmates -- c'mon, 'cause kids who have nothing better to do gossip -- and, sooner or later, some other honcho might catch wind of it.
DMW, while the mood has settled for now, you must consciously accept and understand the risk of your ruin. If the wrong person finds out about your "inappropriate relationship" -- and yes, inappropriate doesn't necessarily mean that you're servicing the kid behind closed doors -- you can be fired from your school or even black-listed from teaching in your state. The teaching profession does not look kindly on such contact no matter how "innocent" or "friendly."
For your sake, you might want to reacquaint yourself on an ethical code for teachers in your state, if such a thing exists, to learn the ramifications of your situation. While I don't foresee Pete turning malevolent and telling everyone in Jena about DMW and his penis and his sexuality, I think DMW would be doing a great service to himself if he were to be better informed about the nature of his professional conduct.
Prep,
Love you dearly, but I think you should read all of the posts carefully before you make the sweeping statement that all of us jumped to all sorts of conclusions. Some did not attack Pete but merely suggested that he take his comments to DMW to a private setting. I think that many of our members may have reacted that way because of the flaming , stalking and other forms of harrassment that have taken place in the past. I know you can identify with that feeling. I am very glad that Pete and DMW have come to some type of agreement, but on the other hand a promising career could weigh in the balance. So it may be good for us all to try and be as prudent as possible in this matter.
Naughty
Love you dearly, but I think you should read all of the posts carefully before you make the sweeping statement that all of us jumped to all sorts of conclusions. Some did not attack Pete but merely suggested that he take his comments to DMW to a private setting. I think that many of our members may have reacted that way because of the flaming , stalking and other forms of harrassment that have taken place in the past. I know you can identify with that feeling. I am very glad that Pete and DMW have come to some type of agreement, but on the other hand a promising career could weigh in the balance. So it may be good for us all to try and be as prudent as possible in this matter.
Naughty
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Naughty--
Speaking as one who has been stalked, I know what you mean, but read some of the posts. A couple of the posts were just way over the line and that's why I think that Pete needs to be defended. Yeah, he's just a kid and doesn't know any better. From reading the post I never got the idea that he was going to do anything to hurt DMW, but I did get the idea that DMW better really watch his step.
I know from my job in church music that I have to constantly be on the look out for what people see me do. Church people have this knack for always being on the watch for what their church staff do--and when you serve in a church with a congregation of over 5,000 members, there is no way possible to know each and every member, but they sure know who their leaders are. When I'm in out in public, I always have to be on "good behavior", which means that if I'm at a restaurant I can't be seen drinking, I can't be seen acting the fool, going to questionable places, etc. I always have to be an upstanding citizen, because I represent my church when I'm in public, whether or not I like it, that's the way it is.
Anyone who serves in a public role is in the same boat.
DMW and Pete worked things out, which is good, and it seems like they are cool, but DMW is the one who really needs to be careful, because he stands to lose a lot more than Pete.
Speaking as one who has been stalked, I know what you mean, but read some of the posts. A couple of the posts were just way over the line and that's why I think that Pete needs to be defended. Yeah, he's just a kid and doesn't know any better. From reading the post I never got the idea that he was going to do anything to hurt DMW, but I did get the idea that DMW better really watch his step.
I know from my job in church music that I have to constantly be on the look out for what people see me do. Church people have this knack for always being on the watch for what their church staff do--and when you serve in a church with a congregation of over 5,000 members, there is no way possible to know each and every member, but they sure know who their leaders are. When I'm in out in public, I always have to be on "good behavior", which means that if I'm at a restaurant I can't be seen drinking, I can't be seen acting the fool, going to questionable places, etc. I always have to be an upstanding citizen, because I represent my church when I'm in public, whether or not I like it, that's the way it is.
Anyone who serves in a public role is in the same boat.
DMW and Pete worked things out, which is good, and it seems like they are cool, but DMW is the one who really needs to be careful, because he stands to lose a lot more than Pete.
I quite agree except that I am already well-informed on the code of ethics. I was tested on it, among other things, less than a year ago to receive my certification to teach. The precepts of the code are still fresh in my mind, and if I have any doubts, the printed copy is in my desk. Keep in mind that Jena is a small town ... about 11 sq. km. and about 3,000 people; everyone knows everyone else. Teachers are likely to know the families of their students outside of a scholastic environment. One of my students is also my next-door neighbour. Some degree of fraternising with students in a social contact is not particularly frowned upon. Chatting with a student on a site called The Large Penis Support Group, however, may well be a completely different, and unpleasant, kettle of fish. We should keep in mind that Pete can hardly bring up matters discussed here without admitting that he is a member as well, and that's not something that he's keen to do. I admit that it's a touchy situation, but I have no plans to desert LPSG ... it's been my home for too long to just drop it. I don't expect, or want, Pete to walk away either. This board can be a great service to teenagers in his situation. Not to chastise members who jumped on Pete ... I appreciate that members feel protective about each other ... but Pete has said that he's not going to post here again after other members treated him like he 'took a dump on my grandmother' (his words). I'm hoping that I can persuade him not to remain as just a lurker. Change his user name, start with a clean slate. He can find much here that he can benefit from, but I'm willing to bet that he also has a lot to contribute ... especially to the Young and Hung category. After all, that's where his life is at present. I realise there are risks, but I've decided to chance it. It's not my place to chase away kids whose only fault here is bad judgement.
Pete --
Don't go into hiding on account of us. If we released the hounds too quickly, you'll have to understand that we're just looking out for one of our most dependable and valued members.
My comments, in particular, may need some explanation. Your post did "bum me out", but only because it was such a reminder to me that the students I deal with -- mostly around your age -- may not be so magnanimous. Professionally, it'd be very uncomfortable for me to know that one of my current students were posting here. It was not intended as a slight against you in particular.
Stick around, man. Now that the terror alert has been lowered from red to blue, we're not frisking students at the door anymore. (Well, not till they're 18, at least...
)i am a teacher, and i have been approached by students before, but i flat-out told them it couldn't happen. i'm supposed to be a role model and a support figure for these kids, not just a teacher, and by having any sort of relationship with them outside of a school friendship is not acceptable.
kudo451: You know,
When I first saw this story in another thread I thought it was hilarious. But I'm not laughing anymore! I can't believe the level of fear and hatred sparked by so embedded in the hearts and minds of the members here that they felt completely justifed in castigating the honesty and integrity of a 17 year old Kid. It was like watching a lyching.
The sad irony here is that there is probably no person more in need of a free forum like this than a 17 year old. And while I recognize and respect the that the teacher involved is a long standing and respected member, it is little comfort or excuse for those who where so blinded with fear that they felt justified in doing to the kid exactly what they feared the outer public would do to the teacher.
I realise this situation was unconfortable for everyone but the need to talk about it openly is plain to see based on the resposes involved. Too right that teenagers can be niave, silly and vindictive. Too right that the world is intolerant of even the hint impropriety while all the day long they do and screw who they please ina whirlwind of hypocracy. Our teachers and our Ministers as well as those on the battle line of Social Service suffer the most from this miscarriage of justice and we should give a damn about all of that.
But when you think over what all the shit you have had to overcome coming up in this world, you need to keep in mind two things: One; real change in society doesn't begin with grown ups it begins with kids! Two; They need to be able to talk about what they are going through publicly in places like this. How much more of a person would you have been if you had this opportunity when you where a kid?
When I first saw this story in another thread I thought it was hilarious. But I'm not laughing anymore! I can't believe the level of fear and hatred sparked by so embedded in the hearts and minds of the members here that they felt completely justifed in castigating the honesty and integrity of a 17 year old Kid. It was like watching a lyching.
The sad irony here is that there is probably no person more in need of a free forum like this than a 17 year old. And while I recognize and respect the that the teacher involved is a long standing and respected member, it is little comfort or excuse for those who where so blinded with fear that they felt justified in doing to the kid exactly what they feared the outer public would do to the teacher.
I realise this situation was unconfortable for everyone but the need to talk about it openly is plain to see based on the resposes involved. Too right that teenagers can be niave, silly and vindictive. Too right that the world is intolerant of even the hint impropriety while all the day long they do and screw who they please ina whirlwind of hypocracy. Our teachers and our Ministers as well as those on the battle line of Social Service suffer the most from this miscarriage of justice and we should give a damn about all of that.
But when you think over what all the shit you have had to overcome coming up in this world, you need to keep in mind two things: One; real change in society doesn't begin with grown ups it begins with kids! Two; They need to be able to talk about what they are going through publicly in places like this. How much more of a person would you have been if you had this opportunity when you where a kid?
suaige: only teenagers????????????
I just ended a job of customer service and the really nice and respectful people were almost inevitably teenagers. The adults where the gate keepers of hell. In fact several of the teenagers kicked their parents off the phone becuase the were being so hostile.
I pretty much think that there are good bad and ugly in every race, age, nation, religion etc. While some Tend toward one side or the other.
Age hopefully will add maturity, but ...well... um... you know people who could take a lot of lessons from kids.
Life is confusing, and full of interesting twists and turns isn't it. Giving people the bene of the doubt can be pretty hard. Here is wishing us all the best.
P.S. no offense, but used to work for UPS, the worst were women in their 20s ( too many thought they were queen) and old people who used home shopping network ( too lazy to go to the store, but its too hard to stay home to get pkg. go figure.) its all ages all people.
I just ended a job of customer service and the really nice and respectful people were almost inevitably teenagers. The adults where the gate keepers of hell. In fact several of the teenagers kicked their parents off the phone becuase the were being so hostile.
I pretty much think that there are good bad and ugly in every race, age, nation, religion etc. While some Tend toward one side or the other.
Age hopefully will add maturity, but ...well... um... you know people who could take a lot of lessons from kids.
Life is confusing, and full of interesting twists and turns isn't it. Giving people the bene of the doubt can be pretty hard. Here is wishing us all the best.
P.S. no offense, but used to work for UPS, the worst were women in their 20s ( too many thought they were queen) and old people who used home shopping network ( too lazy to go to the store, but its too hard to stay home to get pkg. go figure.) its all ages all people.
I am stunned at the insensitivity on this thread. As a teacher for 27 years in the California public schools, I am proud to be co-director of the local chapter of GLSEN(gay, lesbian , straight
educators network). It is now state law (Assembly bill 537) that ALL SEXUAL ORIENTATIONS BE RESPECTED and tolerance/acceptance be taught as part of the social studies and counseling
curriculum grades k-12. I dont know where the young man is from, but I would encourage him to MOVE TO CALIFORNIA if , as a young adult of 18, and finishing high school, he sees no progress in the vicious climate of homophobia that is so pervasive in the south.No one has the right to "Out " you or ridicule you at school because of your sexual orientation.
In a different vein along the same theme, CA defeated the Briggs initiative in 1986 that would have outlawed gay teachers and cost me my professional career. I wrote a short story about coming out of the closet at my worksite, a public high school in Salinas, CA , and it will soon be published as part of an anthology published by Alyson books of Los Angeles.
Clearly there is much to be done, and our society has a long way to go.The first thing to do is
defeat GWB on Nov.2
educators network). It is now state law (Assembly bill 537) that ALL SEXUAL ORIENTATIONS BE RESPECTED and tolerance/acceptance be taught as part of the social studies and counseling
curriculum grades k-12. I dont know where the young man is from, but I would encourage him to MOVE TO CALIFORNIA if , as a young adult of 18, and finishing high school, he sees no progress in the vicious climate of homophobia that is so pervasive in the south.No one has the right to "Out " you or ridicule you at school because of your sexual orientation.
In a different vein along the same theme, CA defeated the Briggs initiative in 1986 that would have outlawed gay teachers and cost me my professional career. I wrote a short story about coming out of the closet at my worksite, a public high school in Salinas, CA , and it will soon be published as part of an anthology published by Alyson books of Los Angeles.
Clearly there is much to be done, and our society has a long way to go.The first thing to do is
defeat GWB on Nov.2
- jonb,
You're right. I don't see what the big deal about gay teachers is, personally. Now, I know homophobes like to argue that public schools are some kind of queer recruitment center, but that can be discredited fairly easily. If a teacher in your school district is fired because of homosexuality, here are some reference materials to cite in a challenge wrt the legitimacy of such worries:
A. Nicholas Groth and H. Jean Birnbaum, "Adult Sexual Orientation and Attraction to Underage Persons," Archives of Sexual Behavior, 7(3), 1978, pp. 175-181.
Kurt Freund, Robin Watson, and Douglas Rienzo, "Heterosexuality, Homosexuality, and Erotic Age Preference," The Journal of Sex Research, 26(1), Feb. 1989, pp. 107-117.
Kurt Freund and Robin Watson, "The Proportion of Heterosexual and Homosexual Pedophiles Among Sex Offenders Against Children: An Exploratory Study," Journal of Sex & Marital Therapy, 18(1), Spring, 1992, pp. 34-43, at p. 41.
Carole Jenny, Tom Roesler, and Kimberly Poyer, "Are Children at Risk for Sexual Abuse by Homosexuals?," Pediatrics, 94(1), July 1994, pp. 41-44.
Conclusion: Heterosexuals shouldn't be allowed around children.
A. Nicholas Groth and H. Jean Birnbaum, "Adult Sexual Orientation and Attraction to Underage Persons," Archives of Sexual Behavior, 7(3), 1978, pp. 175-181.
Kurt Freund, Robin Watson, and Douglas Rienzo, "Heterosexuality, Homosexuality, and Erotic Age Preference," The Journal of Sex Research, 26(1), Feb. 1989, pp. 107-117.
Kurt Freund and Robin Watson, "The Proportion of Heterosexual and Homosexual Pedophiles Among Sex Offenders Against Children: An Exploratory Study," Journal of Sex & Marital Therapy, 18(1), Spring, 1992, pp. 34-43, at p. 41.
Carole Jenny, Tom Roesler, and Kimberly Poyer, "Are Children at Risk for Sexual Abuse by Homosexuals?," Pediatrics, 94(1), July 1994, pp. 41-44.
Conclusion: Heterosexuals shouldn't be allowed around children.
Duane.Ament
Experimental Member
This thread is a great example of one that should be deleted due to its being started by a banned member...
Topics are presented and go where they go, unless there is something truly offensive or trollish in nature there should not be a reason for deleting the entire thread or its responses. I am somewhat curious though as to why you are pulling up so many long burried threads and then with ones such as this wanting it deleted--for any reason whether it be because a member was banned or something else. The topic had received no replies for more than 2 years and yet you dragged it out--Why>?
It's an even better example of a thread that shouldn't be dug up and posted to after two years of being dormant. What the hell is the point?
Weird to be reading a thread that's 4 years old (sorry,0 but it really struck me. And I agreed - there was a LOT of quick reacting and bashing of this poor guy. I know the current culture is to err on the side of being overprotective, and to assume the worst, but I think sometimes we forget how to react a little more tactfully and respectfully, and a little less immediately emotionally. But that said, it was nice to see people caring. :smile:
(Too bad these guys are both banned, for whatever reason that might be.)
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