The 9/11 Offical story Poll

[scotchirish]

Here are some good reasons to care.
Iraq. Afghanistan. The patriot act. Infraguard. Should I keep going?

The point is that none of that is going to suddenly be fixed by confirming that the attack was a conspiracy. The rest of the world would castrate us if we suddenly withdrew all our people from Iraq and Afghanistan, leaving them in complete shambles. Congress had the option not to renew the patriot act but they didn't, so that is no longer the blame of 9-11. I don't know what infraguard is and i'm too lazy right now to look it up. very little, if anything, can be accomplished at this point except confirm that the government can't be fully trusted, which we all know already.

 

[Stretch]

At this point I have to say, "Who cares?" If it truly was a conspiracy set up by the Bush administration, they're all or mostly all out of the job now. If it really was Islamic terrorists then we're already covering that contingency. Anyone who thinks that the government couldn't do something of this caliber is clearly delusional. There's not really anything that can be done about it at this point anyway, as far as I know of.

How about bringing to justice those who are actually responsible for the deaths of so many people? I think the families and friends looking for closure, as well as the rest of the world deserve to know. I don't really follow your reasoning scotchirish. If somebody committed a heinous crime against somebody you know, at what point would you have to say "Who Cares?"

 

[scotchirish]

How about bringing to justice those who are actually responsible for the deaths of so many people? I think the families and friends looking for closure, as well as the rest of the world deserve to know. I don't really follow your reasoning scotchirish. If somebody committed a heinous crime against somebody you know, at what point would you have to say "Who Cares?"

Ok, from the pov of those directly affected by the attack, bringing to justice those responsible would be of huge importance. I have no problem with them turning over every rock they can to find the truth. What I see as pointless is the people who live in small town AZ, who knows nobody that knew anyone affected and spend all their time trying to prove it was the government. Beyond emotional relief, we really wouldn't see anything beneficial out of it being proven that the government was behind the attacks.

Edit: I'll add this. I am an emotionally distant person. I don't feel things the same way most people would, I tend to think more logically than emotionally. Think of the main character on Bones, but not quite to that extreme.

 

[B_New End]

Occams razor doesn't apply to history. Try the Iran-Contra conspiracy, the Robert Clive conspiracy, or propaganda due conspiracy. Those were incredibly complex, and kept quiet for years.
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???
A personal echo?

 

[gnadfly]

I've got a nut uncle-in-law who is always screaming "false flag attack" (by the US govt)... Is there any documented significant false flag attack by the US govt or any other govt? I say significant because one could say a soldier firing a gun into the air was a false flag attack.

 

[D_N Flay Table]

I've got a nut uncle-in-law who is always screaming "false flag attack" (by the US govt)... Is there any documented significant false flag attack by the US govt or any other govt? I say significant because one could say a soldier firing a gun into the air was a false flag attack.

Gulf of Tonkin Incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USS Liberty incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Reichstag fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Operation Northwoods - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[MercyfulFate]

Gulf of Tonkin Incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USS Liberty incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Reichstag fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Operation Northwoods - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In the crazier circles it's always Israel that seems to be involved with the false flag attacks.

Even the Oklahoma City Bombing, witnesses reported seeing a middle eastern man with Tim McVeigh, yet the FBI refused to follow up on it and confiscated all the tapes from the area.

If Israel was involved, chances are the US would know about it too and be allowing it which would obviously raise a lot of questions.

Like I said before though, the FBI themselves admitted there is NO evidence Bin Laden was the mastermind or involved with 9/11 at all. Add to that, there was more than one video of him after the attacks. One was him saying "We had nothing to do with this" and another, the one everyone knows of him saying they did do it.

To me Bin Laden is Emmanuel Goldstein, if you've ever read 1984.

 

[Satsfakshun]

Operation Northwoods - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'd love to know who was involved with this. How about E. Howard Hunt? Who also happened to be in Dallas the day Kennedy was shot. (Funny, when the Nixon staffers were discussing why it was important to get cash to Hunt after the Watergate break in, there's 18 mins. of deleted tape.)

It would also explain how a "communist" like Lee Harvey Oswald was able to move back and forth between Russia, Mexico, etc. without ever being questioned - at there was no record of questioning - in between "missions." Of course, he was just a h.s. dropout who was dishonorably discharged - even though he was trained in advanced satellite systems and learned to speak Russian like a native... Oh yeah, he was pretty good with a rifle, too. People with those skills don't usually get dishonorable discharges unless there's some strategic reason.

But I digress... My feeling is that in the months before 9/11, the Bush people anticipated an act and could have been strategically neglectful - expecting something smaller, along the lines of a Cole attack. I'm sure they were shocked by what actually happened. The Project for a New American Century which served as the blueprint for the Bush presidency - most of it's authors served as officials - recommended removing Saddam Hussein, but admitted there would be little public support short of a some terrorist event they could tie to Iraq - which is exactly what they did with 9/11, in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

 

[MercyfulFate]

I'd love to know who was involved with this. How about E. Howard Hunt? Who also happened to be in Dallas the day Kennedy was shot. (Funny, when the Nixon staffers were discussing why it was important to get cash to Hunt after the Watergate break in, there's 18 mins. of deleted tape.)

It would also explain how a "communist" like Lee Harvey Oswald was able to move back and forth between Russia, Mexico, etc. without ever being questioned - at there was no record of questioning - in between "missions." Of course, he was just a h.s. dropout who was dishonorably discharged - even though he was trained in advanced satellite systems and learned to speak Russian like a native... Oh yeah, he was pretty good with a rifle, too. People with those skills don't usually get dishonorable discharges unless there's some strategic reason.

But I digress... My feeling is that in the months before 9/11, the Bush people anticipated an act and could have been strategically neglectful - expecting something smaller, along the lines of a Cole attack. I'm sure they were shocked by what actually happened. The Project for a New American Century which served as the blueprint for the Bush presidency - most of it's authors served as officials - recommended removing Saddam Hussein, but admitted there would be little public support short of a some terrorist event they could tie to Iraq - which is exactly what they did with 9/11, in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

E. Howard Hunt's son claimed he told him the truth about the Kennedy shooting on his deathbed. However Hunt was in the throes of dementia at this point, so who knows?

I've never really liked the lone gunman theory. It always seems too convenient.

 

[D_Donald_ T_Rump]

Remember, remember, the ninth of November

 

[gnadfly]

Gulf of Tonkin Incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

USS Liberty incident - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Reichstag fire - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Operation Northwoods - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So my understanding of the defintion of a "false flag attack" is that actual attack of the citizenry/property of a country by that countries own govt and the intentional attribution of that attack to another country. This being the case, it doesn't appear that any of your examples qualify..

Gulf of Tonkin...there was a battle two days before...
USS Liberty...attack by the Israelis
Reichstag fire...Dutch guy did it according to your article
Operation Northwoods...appears that no attack actually occured

 

[Satsfakshun]

E. Howard Hunt's son claimed he told him the truth about the Kennedy shooting on his deathbed. However Hunt was in the throes of dementia at this point, so who knows?

I've never really liked the lone gunman theory. It always seems too convenient.

I'm pretty certain LHO fired three shots that day. I'm not at all convinced he was alone, although he may have not known who else was around. For a conspiracy such as this, each disparate part needs no knowledge of every other part. With only pieces of the puzzle they would simply sound crazy if they talked.

I'm pretty certain Hunt's part in the JFK coverup is what Nixon and Halderman were discussing and why they felt they needed to come up with $1 million in cash for him after he was arrested at the Watergate bldg.

 

[MercyfulFate]

I'm pretty certain LHO fired three shots that day. I'm not at all convinced he was alone, although he may have not known who else was around. For a conspiracy such as this, each disparate part needs no knowledge of every other part. With only pieces of the puzzle they would simply sound crazy if they talked.

I'm pretty certain Hunt's part in the JFK coverup is what Nixon and Halderman were discussing and why they felt they needed to come up with $1 million in cash for him after he was arrested at the Watergate bldg.

Yeah I don't think he operated alone, too many assassinations get pulled off by a lone guy...something doesn't add up.

Sirhan Sirhan, James Earl Ray, Lee Harvey Oswald, Mark David Chapman, etc.

Every single person assassinated was shaking up the establishment, and we're expected to believe lone crazy people wanted to kill them when no one else did? Look at how many people hated Bush and now Obama, no one's taken a shot at them even.

 

[Satsfakshun]

Yeah I don't think he operated alone, too many assassinations get pulled off by a lone guy...something doesn't add up.

Sirhan Sirhan, James Earl Ray, Lee Harvey Oswald, Mark David Chapman, etc.

Every single person assassinated was shaking up the establishment, and we're expected to believe lone crazy people wanted to kill them when no one else did? Look at how many people hated Bush and now Obama, no one's taken a shot at them even.

On the other hand, many famous assassinations/attempts were part of broader conspiracies: Lincoln, Archduke Ferdinand, Harry Truman, Caesar... with multiple assassins.

 

[ColoradoGuy]

You know, just as this website exists for the well-endowed and their admirers, you can find plenty of conspiracy websites to join and offer your explanations for the Kennedy assassination, the Proctor & Gamble corporate logo, the Apollo moon landing, and whatever else needs "explained".

There's a reason why the 'conspiracy theory' moniker is usually used in a derogatory fashion, ya' know. While I understand that fringe theorists exist everywhere and that they would prefer to believe that AIDS is man-made, water fluoridation is a Communist plot, and that the "Illuminati" are real and promote a new "World Order", I take the opposite approach and ponder qui bono.

People who promote conspiracy theories are usually bent on a political or social agenda and "explain" historical events or current events with a particular interest in supporting that agenda. Don't like the current President? Become a "Birther"! Didn't like the Democrat before him? Claim that he had Vince Foster murdered because he 'knew the truth about Whitewater'!

Even Hollywood loves a good conspiracy theory. Mel Gibson starred in a 1997 film on the subject. And, we shouldn't forget Men in Black: not only is the theme of this movie predicated on the existence of UFOs and aliens and the government's attempt to suppress "the truth", Tommy Lee Jones reads a National Enquirer-esque rag and claims it's the only newspaper that actually reports on what's really going on.

For those (usually) off-the-wall theories that don't fit neatly into a political or social agenda, I'd offer up they exist and evolve for the same reason that early societies needed to invent organized religion to answer the void of scientific or factual information about how or why the world was created and what man's purpose is in it.

I'm not criticizing those of you who subscribe, promote, or invent these theories -- I'm trying to offer up an alternative response as well as point out an unfortunate truth. While all of this earnest debate is going on, there is great injustice in the world occurring that doesn't require a convenient conspiracy theory -- just the simple acts of individuals to make a difference. Why don't those issues get nearly as much attention? Are they just not interesting enough?

 

[Satsfakshun]

You know, just as this website exists for the well-endowed and their admirers, you can find plenty of conspiracy websites to join and offer your explanations for the Kennedy assassination, the Proctor & Gamble corporate logo, the Apollo moon landing, and whatever else needs "explained".

There's a reason why the 'conspiracy theory' moniker is usually used in a derogatory fashion, ya' know. While I understand that fringe theorists exist everywhere and that they would prefer to believe that AIDS is man-made, water fluoridation is a Communist plot, and that the "Illuminati" are real and promote a new "World Order", I take the opposite approach and ponder qui bono.

People who promote conspiracy theories are usually bent on a political or social agenda and "explain" historical events or current events with a particular interest in supporting that agenda. Don't like the current President? Become a "Birther"! Didn't like the Democrat before him? Claim that he had Vince Foster murdered because he 'knew the truth about Whitewater'!

Even Hollywood loves a good conspiracy theory. Mel Gibson starred in a 1997 film on the subject. And, we shouldn't forget Men in Black: not only is the theme of this movie predicated on the existence of UFOs and aliens and the government's attempt to suppress "the truth", Tommy Lee Jones reads a National Enquirer-esque rag and claims it's the only newspaper that actually reports on what's really going on.

For those (usually) off-the-wall theories that don't fit neatly into a political or social agenda, I'd offer up they exist and evolve for the same reason that early societies needed to invent organized religion to answer the void of scientific or factual information about how or why the world was created and what man's purpose is in it.

I'm not criticizing those of you who subscribe, promote, or invent these theories -- I'm trying to offer up an alternative response as well as point out an unfortunate truth. While all of this earnest debate is going on, there is great injustice in the world occurring that doesn't require a convenient conspiracy theory -- just the simple acts of individuals to make a difference. Why don't those issues get nearly as much attention? Are they just not interesting enough?

I'm not too interested in conspiracies, per se. I don't seek them out. I think the Kennedy situation is a little different for 2 main reasons: 1) There are still so many unanswered questions and 2) This event caused significant change in the direction our country was going and not for the better. Some people benefitted greatly and still do.

 

[B_New End]

Tommy Lee Jones reads a National Enquirer-esque rag and claims it's the only newspaper that actually reports on what's really going on.

The russian spy is a "femme fatale".
Mainstream media is as much a joke as The enquirer. In fact, my stepdad used to subscribe to the Enquirer and Star... and they were surprisingly good journalism for their topics.... celebrity gossip.

I really cannot stomach watching cable news anymore... it's just that ridiculous to me to watch. You might think I am blowing it out of proportion, but really, I am not.... it is nothing but a stomach twisting cacophony of propaganda. Onmce you recognize it, every minute of cable news becomes water torture of People are gonna believe that!?... Oh My God!?... That's a simplification of a very complex.... That's just a fucking lie... people are gonna believe that?....

If I ever see a minute or two of it, I think, "this is what shapes peoples perceptions of reality." it's a fucking joke. I saw it in a bank yesterday, as Obama gave his financial reform bill speech. I can just imagine all the talking heads afterwards pitching what is just another big win for bankers as some kind of left/right split, and how the bankers are the most upset about it.