The District of Columbia spends $13000 per pupil!!

[Wyldgusechaz]

And I see in another thread we blame President Bush for the failure of No Child Left Behind. How sad.

The Wall Street Journal has a terrific editorial/article on education in D.C. today. The folks here who blame President Bush and lack of funding need to get a grip on the truth. $13000 is a mind boggling number. Astronomical. For the worst math and 2nd to last in reading performance nation wide. A voucher program called Washington DC Opportunity Scholarship can and is doing a better job for $7500. And liberals argue against vouchers, even when confronted with a tax tab of $13000/child on YOUR tax dollars. Thats just idiotic.

Give vouchers a chance, please.

 

[WifeOfBath]

Per year or over the lifetime of the student? If it's over the lifetime of the student, that's quite a pittance for what should be one of our our top national priorities.

 

[naughty]

It must be in total because I know their schools are in bad shape. There is a young woman there now that Adrian Fenty has brought in to over haul the system but it still remains to be seen what if anything may change. It is systemic, though people complain about the teachers it is not that simple there seems to be a break down between parent teachers and administration with an increasingly violent student body. Teachers need combat pay.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

Per year or over the lifetime of the student? If it's over the lifetime of the student, that's quite a pittance for what should be one of our our top national priorities.

$13000 per year!!!!! For 12 years thru high school thats $156000 in present dollars.

Liberals, please give vouchers a chance. You are killing the chances of our young people with your allegiance/worship/bootlicking to the education cartel and the teacher's unions.

We neocons get it. If you libs don't get it soon you will condemn our disadvantaged youth to a life of poverty and maybe incarceration. We have a clear conscience. Do you?

President Bush can at least sleep easy on this one issue. He tried. The progressives just twiddle while our kids brains are emptied. Or actually never filled.

 

[DC_DEEP]

$13000 per year!!!!! For 12 years thru high school thats $156000 in present dollars.

Liberals, please give vouchers a chance. You are killing the chances of our young people with your allegiance/worship/bootlicking to the education cartel and the teacher's unions.

We neocons get it. If you libs don't get it soon you will condemn our disadvantaged youth to a life of poverty and maybe incarceration. We have a clear conscience. Do you?

President Bush can at least sleep easy on this one issue. He tried. The progressives just twiddle while our kids brains are emptied. Or actually never filled.

Give us a link to a spreadsheet that shows precisely where those $13000 per year are going, or you are just talking out your ass.

Vouchers are a bad plan. And it's not just the liberals who oppose them, dear. No, you neocons don't get it. I dare you to try to do a teacher's work for a teacher's pay for one year. I dare you.

Again, you go on with your jingoistic right-wing soundbytes, but you present nothing of substance.

See, the problem with vouchers is this: how do you decide who gets them? I'm not sure I want my tax dollars paying for someone else's kid to go to private school. If you want your kid in a private school, then put him there. Don't you understand that vouchers actually go against what a conservative ought to believe? If you want my tax dollars to fund private schools, then every single student should be in a private school... and then guess what? The private schools have suddenly become public schools.

 

[tripod]

Another smackdown rendered by DC!!!! :twak:

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

Give us a link to a spreadsheet that shows precisely where those $13000 per year are going, or you are just talking out your ass.

Vouchers are a bad plan. And it's not just the liberals who oppose them, dear. No, you neocons don't get it. I dare you to try to do a teacher's work for a teacher's pay for one year. I dare you.

Again, you go on with your jingoistic right-wing soundbytes, but you present nothing of substance.

See, the problem with vouchers is this: how do you decide who gets them? I'm not sure I want my tax dollars paying for someone else's kid to go to private school. If you want your kid in a private school, then put him there. Don't you understand that vouchers actually go against what a conservative ought to believe? If you want my tax dollars to fund private schools, then every single student should be in a private school... and then guess what? The private schools have suddenly become public schools.

How really stupid. Why do I need to provide a spreadsheet? Thats what it costs. The Wall Street Journal did the study. I don't particularly care where the money goes, it is what it is. The question is "Can it be done cheaper and better?" Until we try, how will we know? We do know now it ain't working. So throw more money at it? OK. You first.

What you are saying in effect is "even tho I recognize its broken, I won't do anything innovative to fix it. I am content with condemining todays youth to a substandard education just to maintain principle."

I say bullshit. I say let poor white, black, hispanic, immigrant parents have the same ability as rich parents to send their kids to whatever school they see as the best chance to educate their kids. You are enslaving them basically, forcing them to go to crummy schools with unmotivated kids and absentee parents. What a shit attitude.

Teacher's pay? Let's see: If a teacher had 25 kids/class and each kid had a voucher for $7500, you could easily give the teacher $3000/head or $75000 to teach that class for nine months. That would leave $4500 for books and basketballs and facilities. The class would be filled likely with the children of poor parents who care. My guess is they will be more motivated to learn. Talk about an ideal learning environment.

Of course the public schools would be left with nothing but the kids of non motivated, absentee parents and disciplinary kids but you want the poor good kids trying to learn to be stuck in those classes anyways. Why?

Smackdown? I guess if you like smacking down poor motivated kids, you are right Tripod. Nice work. Hope you can sleep well knowing you hate poor kids. I want them to have a shot at least in an environment that nutures them. You hate them and condemn them to appease the education cartel. Yuck.

 

[DC_DEEP]

How really stupid. Why do I need to provide a spreadsheet? Thats what it costs. The Wall Street Journal did the study. I don't particularly care where the money goes, it is what it is. The question is "Can it be done cheaper and better?" Until we try, how will we know? We do know now it ain't working. So throw more money at it? OK. You first.

Yes, you are really stupid. You are throwing around numbers and dollar signs, but I see no indication that you know what the fuck you are talking about. And you are really a stupid cunt if you want to insinuate that I EVER advocated "throwing more money at the problem."

What you are saying in effect is "even tho I recognize its broken, I won't do anything innovative to fix it. I am content with condemining todays youth to a substandard education just to maintain principle."

And again, you show your ignorance and soundbyte solutions. I have suggested many innovative solutions in many similar threads over the past 4 years. If you can't be bothered to know what the hell you are talking about when you address me, then go fuck yourself. I don't really care.

Teacher's pay? Let's see: If a teacher had 25 kids/class and each kid had a voucher for $7500, you could easily give the teacher $3000/head or $75000 to teach that class for nine months. That would leave $4500 for books and basketballs and facilities. The class would be filled likely with the children of poor parents who care. My guess is they will be more motivated to learn. Talk about an ideal learning environment.

How about a little logic here? Explain to me, exactly, again rolleyes who decides which kids get vouchers? And once you explain that, tell us all how and why one school can better utilize $7500 than another school can.

Drop the insults, sweetcheeks, and answer the questions.

 

[manofgreatrenown]

And I see in another thread we blame President Bush for the failure of No Child Left Behind. How sad.

The Wall Street Journal has a terrific editorial/article on education in D.C. today. The folks here who blame President Bush and lack of funding need to get a grip on the truth. $13000 is a mind boggling number. Astronomical. For the worst math and 2nd to last in reading performance nation wide. A voucher program called Washington DC Opportunity Scholarship can and is doing a better job for $7500. And liberals argue against vouchers, even when confronted with a tax tab of $13000/child on YOUR tax dollars. Thats just idiotic.

Give vouchers a chance, please.

Wyld,

It is refreshing to see your posts and your views. Unfortunately, I am guessing you will soon be banned.

Be careful not to succumb to the name calling started by others

 

[DC_DEEP]

Wyld,

It is refreshing to see your posts and your views. Unfortunately, I am guessing you will soon be banned.

Be careful not to succumb to the name calling started by others

How interesting that you join 5 days ago, you "know" what will get someone banned, and 4 of your first 5 posts are "supporting" wyldgusechase or whatever his name is.

Something you want to tell us?

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

Yes, you are really stupid. You are throwing around numbers and dollar signs, but I see no indication that you know what the fuck you are talking about. And you are really a stupid cunt if you want to insinuate that I EVER advocated "throwing more money at the problem."And again, you show your ignorance and soundbyte solutions. I have suggested many innovative solutions in many similar threads over the past 4 years. If you can't be bothered to know what the hell you are talking about when you address me, then go fuck yourself. I don't really care.How about a little logic here? Explain to me, exactly, again rolleyes who decides which kids get vouchers? And once you explain that, tell us all how and why one school can better utilize $7500 than another school can.

Drop the insults, sweetcheeks, and answer the questions.

OK I will decide.

Whomever is below the federally mandated basic poverty level gets the whole $7500/kid. As you step up in income the voucher gets smaller. So a young single African American mom working as an LVN midnight shift at about $10/hour with 2 kids gets 2 vouchers for $15000 total to send her kids wherever she wants. Like in Boston she can send them to the Latin School where the Kennedy's went. Or in DC she can send them to wherever the Senators send their kids. No questions asked.

Or you DC Deep can create a non religious charter school for the disadvantaged and implement whatever ideas you have for bettering those kids lives and learning. You get $7500 per kid. Can you do a better job or do you need $13000 like Wash DC gets now?

Your turn.

 

[Guy-jin]

So a young single African American mom working as an LVN midnight shift at about $10/hour with 2 kids gets 2 vouchers for $15000 total to send her kids wherever she wants. Like in Boston she can send them to the Latin School where the Kennedy's went. Or in DC she can send them to wherever the Senators send their kids. No questions asked.

You really don't have any idea what you're talking about, you know that, right?

 

[DC_DEEP]

Or you DC Deep can create a non religious charter school for the disadvantaged and implement whatever ideas you have for bettering those kids lives and learning. You get $7500 per kid. Can you do a better job or do you need $13000 like Wash DC gets now?

Your turn.

OK, you answered one of my questions: how to decide who gets vouchers. You didn't answer the other question. It's not my turn until you finish.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

You really don't have any idea what you're talking about, you know that, right?

Another liberal whiner without offering a speck of solution to our educational problems. I may not know what I am talking about but I know what ain't working now.

Offer anything Guy_jin since you are so smart.

Or be a critic only. A critic is someone who surveys the battle field from afar, and then when the battle is over casually strolls down the line and shoots the wounded. What a coward. Offer a solution or STFU.

 

[marleyisalegend]

Go DC Go DC GO!!

say it with me now!

Go DC Go DC GO!!

Go DC. It's ya birthday
Ya made a good point like it's ya birthday
Fuck vouchers cuz it ain't ya birthday
I don't wanna pay for some kid to fuck girls in the stairwell and drop out cuz it's ya birthday!

 

[visualalert]

Wyldgusechaz - you may be arguing with a gov't employee (teacher) or two here...they have a financial interest in the status quo and won't respond to logic. It doesn't matter how poorly the gov't monopoly schools do, private schools and vouchers are income threats and the folks feeding at the public trough will always invent some way to protect their incomes.

Or, as in the case of Guy-jin, they'll just insult you without offering anything of substance.

DC_Deep really cracks me up with this tripe:

"See, the problem with vouchers is this: how do you decide who gets them? I'm not sure I want my tax dollars paying for someone else's kid to go to private school. If you want your kid in a private school, then put him there. Don't you understand that vouchers actually go against what a conservative ought to believe? If you want my tax dollars to fund private schools, then every single student should be in a private school... and then guess what? The private schools have suddenly become public schools."

"How do you decide who gets them?" Easy: anybody who wants one, regardless of income.

"I'm not sure I want my tax dollars paying for someone else's kid to go to private school." Well, I'm not sure I want my tax dollars paying for someone else's kid to go to school, period. But since I have no choice in the matter, I'd just as soon my tax dollars didn't go to an education industry that consistently produces a defective product (graduates who can't read, write or do math). Maybe private schools will fail but I'd rather fund them to see if they'll succeed. We already know the gov't approach is a failure.

"Don't you understand that vouchers actually go against what a conservative ought to believe? If you want my tax dollars to fund private schools, then every single student should be in a private school... and then guess what? The private schools have suddenly become public schools."

Middlebrow, high-school level debate trick. Take the most ridiculously extreme position, extrapolate it to an even more absurd conclusion, pretend that's what your opponent is arguing, then knock it down. It's called a "straw man." All that's being argued here is that people be allowed to choose where to spend their money to educate their kids. DC_DEEP is opposed. 'Nuff said.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

OK, you answered one of my questions: how to decide who gets vouchers. You didn't answer the other question. It's not my turn until you finish.

How do you decide what school gets the vouchers? Let the parents decide, ideally. They know best. It wouldn't take long to see which schools do the best.

But if I had the choice, I think it should be non religious and privately run. I would make it so its standards are higher than the public schools. For example if the average SAT of a public school in the same locale is 875, the charter school might have to hit 1050. This off the top of my incredibly handsome noggin but you get the drift.

Your turn. And don't chicken shit out like you did with the last post. This is free exchange of ideas. Show me some stuff.

 

[Lex]

We have discussed this before. Per pupil expenditure is a misleading figure. Some districts spend more per pupil than others and the achievement does not always follow the money. Some districts spend less and their student achieve more. Some districts spend more and their achievement scores are also high, while others spend more and their scores are not very high.

Keep in mind that schools are funded by property taxes so that urban and rural districts typically have less revenue from which to spend.

A more telling figure is per pupil wealth, that is, the amount of revenue a school district has after all expenditures have been made. Again, districts with lower expenditures and higher amounts of tax revenue typically have much more money available per student to spend.

Also, keep in mind that about 67-75% of a school districts spending actually goes to employee salaries and maintenance of the physical plants of school buildings.

 

[Lex]

Additionally, Education Statistics are available Here:

National Center for Education Statistics

Under Data Tools, you can choose to build your own custom table or look at school/district profiles.

 

[Wyldgusechaz]

Howard University tuition for undergrads is $13000. For a well rounded college education. They do a good job educating students. Turn the entire fucking DC public school system over to the admin of Howard University ( a private, likely capitalist school) and let them do what they do best, train and educate students.

Get it out of the hands of the entrenched public education cartel.