The emerging economies are plutocracies.

[Drifterwood]

Whilst we in the West are rallying against the 1%, it is a sobering reality that the emerging economies, the BRICS, are plutocracies under the control of the .0001%

Vladamir Putin is allegedly the richest man in the World now, supported by the so called oligarchs; though plutocrats would be a more correct term imo.

In China, 90% of the new millionaires owe their success to political connection. The families of the political elite run the business and natural resources of the country. The corruption of local officials that you may hear about, is in reality an asset grab race.

India tries to have justice from time to time and a strong middle class is developing, but the vast majority are destitute poor and no one gives a damn about them, whilst the seriously rich are in hyper drive.

Whilst you may not like the capitalist reality within your liberal democracy, take a moment to peep over your shoulder and see what is coming.

 

[eurotop40]

Whilst we in the West are rallying against the 1%, it is a sobering reality that the emerging economies, the BRICS, are plutocracies under the control of the .0001%

Vladamir Putin is allegedly the richest man in the World now, supported by the so called oligarchs; though plutocrats would be a more correct term imo.

In China, 90% of the new millionaires owe their success to political connection. The families of the political elite run the business and natural resources of the country. The corruption of local officials that you may hear about, is in reality an asset grab race.

India tries to have justice from time to time and a strong middle class is developing, but the vast majority are destitute poor and no one gives a damn about them, whilst the seriously rich are in hyper drive.

Whilst you may not like the capitalist reality within your liberal democracy, take a moment to peep over your shoulder and see what is coming.

Are you surprised?

 

[dandelion]

And the UK isnt a plutocracy?

 

[Drifterwood]

Are you surprised?

No. Not at all. But I am deeply concerned as to the effect this will have as the emerging has to cooperate with the emerged and vice versa. As an old friend said here a long time ago, I am a globalist, I believe we face challenges in the world that will need global collaboration. It concerns me that the interests of a diminishing number of people may steer our futures and the decisions that are made.

 

[Drifterwood]

And the UK isnt a plutocracy?

No where near to the same degree.

 

[B_theaussieone]

No where near to the same degree.

because the countries you mention are developing a middle class, the british middle class is shrinking. every country is capitalist, even liberal democracies. liberal democracy is a political system, capitalism is an economic system.

 

[vince]

because the countries you mention are developing a middle class, the british middle class is shrinking. every country is capitalist, even liberal democracies. liberal democracy is a political system, capitalism is an economic system.

The lines blur. For example, corporations in the USA have been granted the same political rights as human beings.

 

[vince]

Drifter, the first B in BRIC stands for Brasil. What is your opinion on the prospects of them being able to maintain a democractic political system as their economy expands?

 

[Drifterwood]

Drifter, the first B in BRIC stands for Brasil. What is your opinion on the prospects of them being able to maintain a democractic political system as their economy expands?

I am fairly ignorant about Brasil, I admit. I do meet Brasilian business people in the Far East and I have had several Portugese/Brasilian friends in the past. As previously a member of Greenpeace, big industry certainly is extremely powerful and poverty and human rights abuses were extreme in many places. The cynic in me says that democracy is often just a fop for the people so long as they don't get in the way of the big interests.

I suspect given the above, that real wealth and power is firmly held by a smallish elite, though as in the cases of Russia and China the overall increase in common wealth is enough to make people happy at the moment.

How about Turkey (and my thoughts to the earthquake victims)? She has a strongly growing economy as well. You don't want to bail out Greece do you?

 

[Klingsor]

. . . the vast majority are destitute poor and no one gives a damn about them, whilst the seriously rich are in hyper drive.

Whilst you may not like the capitalist reality within your liberal democracy, take a moment to peep over your shoulder and see what is coming.

"Let them eat cake."

And we know how that worked out.

 

[vince]

Thank God the EU didn't want us. It's pretty much mutual actually.

Like everywhere, the elites here either are the political class or they own them. This has been the case since the founding of the republic, regardless any myths people may want to believe about Mustafa Kemal. Although in those days, there wasn't much to own except land. In recent years a new party with an Islamic identity has taken over and while they are much better technocrats, and the economy has expanded tremendously, the government is still corrupt. Even blatantly, as in the case of Erodoğan. So yes I think Turkey is pretty plutocratic. Not at the level of Russia, but somewhere down the scale nearer to the other western nations.

But the fundamentals of the nation are good in my opinion. Turkish people are hard workers. The population demographics are nearly perfect at the moment and there are still huge opportunities to improve in almost every sector. Of course the elites are going to skim the cream, but as long as the masses see some betterment in their lives, things will follow a normal course.

 

[dandelion]

No where near to the same degree.

Its just well disguised, but might better be described as an oligarchy.

 

[Jason]

The degree is very different.

In the UK, recent PMs haven't been short of a penny or two but they are certainly not plutocrats. Thatcher is a grocer's daughter; Major the son of a circus acrobat. Brown is a son of the Manse. Both Blair and Cameron have upper-middle backgrounds, but neither are super wealthy. I doubt there is a single plutocrat in the UK parliament. Yes rich people in the UK do have some clout - but by no means all try to use it.

The contrast with Russia and China is stark.

 

[deleted213967]

Thank God the EU didn't want us. It's pretty much mutual actually.

Ironic. The EU cited relationship with Greece as 1 factor driving its decision not to admit Turkey...

..the same Greece that is now fucking the EU over.

 

[deleted213967]

Funny though, I came across a recent study showing that after the US and Japan, France had the most millionaires.

I was expecting China to even beat Japan in that respect.

 

[deleted15807]

What we have is a brave new merger of government and corporations known as:

Corporatocracy, in social theories that focus on conflicts and opposing interests within society, denotes a system of government that serves the interest of, and may be run by, corporations and involves ties between government and business. Where corporations, conglomerates, and/or government entities with private components, control the direction and governance of a country, including carrying out economic planning (notwithstanding the "free market" label).
​

 

[Drifterwood]

Funny though, I came across a recent study showing that after the US and Japan, France had the most millionaires.

I was expecting China to even beat Japan in that respect.

I think that I have seen a figure of 1.5 million millionaires for China. I would guess that that figure is well under the truth because of the hidden wealth of officials. Do you remember the study?

 

[Drifterwood]

What we have is a brave new merger of government and corporations known as:

Corporatocracy, in social theories that focus on conflicts and opposing interests within society, denotes a system of government that serves the interest of, and may be run by, corporations and involves ties between government and business. Where corporations, conglomerates, and/or government entities with private components, control the direction and governance of a country, including carrying out economic planning (notwithstanding the "free market" label).
​

Corporations are just the legal cooperative of wealthy individuals and concerns such as pension funds etc. In a sense they just mask the collective activities of the wealthy. But again, in the West, they represent the interests of a wider section than in some emerging economies in which for example, the whole of the steel industry can be owned by a single family.

 

[deleted213967]

I think that I have seen a figure of 1.5 million millionaires for China. I would guess that that figure is well under the truth because of the hidden wealth of officials. Do you remember the study?

https://infocus.credit-suisse.com/app/article/index.cfm?fuseaction=OpenArticle&aoid=323370&video=true&coid=118&void=324171⟨=EN

 

[Drifterwood]

https://infocus.credit-suisse.com/a...70&video=true&coid=118&void=324171⟨=EN

They want to put a cookie in my computer for thirty days to read their report.