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The "mainstream liberal media"

Discussion in 'Politics' started by SilverTrain, Oct 29, 2008.

  1. SilverTrain

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    OK, one of the hallmarks of our society is the free market principle, right?

    The market will dictate the flow of commodities, right?

    For example, apples are consumed in great quantities because they are desired by a large segment of our society. Figs are consumed in much smaller quantities because they are desired by a much smaller segment of society.

    Popular television shows stay on the air because there is demand for them (and thus televised advertising can be sold in large quantities and rates). Unpopular television shows do not stay on the air due to the lack of demand for them (and the inability to sell advertising time on these shows).

    How is it then, that "liberal media" dominates the airwaves and printing presses of the country? Why is there not an even balance of "conservative" and "liberal" media, reflecting the consumption preferences of American society? How is it that this one commodity, apart from all others in our society, our marketplace, defies the laws of the market? How is it that a product that is truly undesired by half the consumers in America nonethless thrives?

    I'll tell you why. Because the "liberal media" concept is a crock. The media we have is a result of the collective consumption desire of our society. The laws of the marketplace say that we have a media that directly reflects the perspectives of our constituents. We have an "American" media, that is reflective of our "American" society.

    Demand for a wholly liberal media would wither. The marketplace would adjust to the demands of its consumers. And we would have what we, in fact, have. A media product that satisfies the desires of the citizenry/market.

    Concept of "Mainstream Liberal Media" = a crock
     
  2. SpeedoGuy

    SpeedoGuy Sexy Member

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    Concept of "Mainstream Liberal Media" = Convenient scapegoat of adherents to a discredited political philosophy.
     
  3. stratedude

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    This is a very intelligent, well thought out, and beautifully articulated question.

    But it is missing some crucial facts that would explain the reality of "liberal media".

    The answer lies right in your post:
    "CONSUMPTION PREFERENCES"

    The fact is that if you take a cross section of your average viewers of mainstream television shows, chances are you are looking at a relatively high percentage of liberals. The majority of people that listen to FM radio stations that play pop music are going to be liberals. People that spend all night posting on internet forums - mostly liberal.
    Many conservatives don't put popular "media consumption" as high on their "preference" list as liberals do. They like to do other things. They spend more time with their families, enjoy a hobby, work long hours, or whatever else. The reason AM radio listeners are overwhelmingly conservative and liberal programs fail on AM is because the people that listen to it are working alone - usually small business owners or salesmen.

    As far as nightly cable news goes, the fact that FoxNews obliterates the liberal competition for the past 8 years should tell you something else. Conservative really are out there. They just don't prefer to consume the same crap as liberals.
     
  4. D_Fiona_Farvel

    D_Fiona_Farvel Account Disabled

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    I entirely reject the notion of a liberal or conservative media.
    Whatever the assumed, or accused, bias in the media of the day, fundamentally, people are capable of independent thought.
     
  5. stratedude

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    The question I'm thinking is "what people?" and "what percentage of people?"

    Anyway you are nieve. When the media is talking negative about one candidate and positive about another, after a while the polls reflect this bias.

    I mean think about it - people are capable of independent thought? OK many of them, but what about the people that believe the 9/11 conspiracy? They believe that the people that don't believe it have been brainwashed by the government and unable to think independently. The ones that believe the truth think the conspiracy theorist are incapable of rational and idependent thought.

    They get stuck until Popular Mechanics comes out with the truth, but even then, a large percentage still think the government did 9/11.

    People are crazy. People believe things that to you and me are obviously false. Media bias has a measurable effect.
     
  6. D_Fiona_Farvel

    D_Fiona_Farvel Account Disabled

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    Cite an independent study, or I'll even take a peer reviewed, published journal, on the "measurable effect" of media bias.

    All of the things you mentioned are incidences of independent thought. Whether you agree with them or find value in their existence is another topic. Your naivete is showing.
     
  7. stratedude

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    Maybe you're right. It didn't work for you guys in 2004...

    A single kid with a couple of YouTube videos single-handedly got thousands, possibly millions to believe that the government did 9/11, some even believed that the PLANES were faked!
    A single man was able to convince thousands for DECADES that there was something called Bigfoot. He used carvings to make the footprints.
    Don't even get me started on the JFK conspiracy theories and the UFO sightings...
    These are examples of DEPENDENT thoughts not independent. Just because you think you and everyone you know have independent thoughts doesn't mean that there is not a huge population of puppets out there. Wake up!
     
  8. D_Fiona_Farvel

    D_Fiona_Farvel Account Disabled

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    You guys? :rolleyes:


    Citation? :rolleyes:
    Someone determining what they believe, and what they choose to view, read, and who they choose to associate with for discussion in reinforcing their thoughts, are actions of an independent mind. Imo.
     
  9. sargon20

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    Yep that basically sums it up. Anytime you feel threatened, unsure, challenged just sling the label and wow instantly you will feel better. You don't have to think anymore. It hurts to think. Bush and Cheney practiced it throughout the run-up to the war.
     
  10. B_starinvestor

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    Blah blah blah blah blah. Politics are only an issue in this country once every 4 years, genius. The loathsome liberal media/propoganda machine only offends people for a few months every 4 years with slanted campaign coverage and misleading election opinions.

    When your darling Barry slips up a few times, wait until your beloved media crucifies him and his administration. :wink:
     
  11. Penis Aficionado

    Penis Aficionado Legendary Member

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    Media is a little different than fruit.

    Fruit can go straight from the grower to the consumer, but media requires a middleman -- the writer, editor, cameraman, designer, etc. And these people overwhelmingly tend to be liberal.

    That said, I used to work in "the media," and here's what I don't quite get: The average person working at your city's daily newspaper is a liberal Democrat, sure. But they're the pragmatic, non-ideologue kind of liberal Democrats. They want everybody to have decent health care and a living wage. But they're not the kind of liberals you find on university faculties, the kind who want to teach gay sex to fifth-graders and send a bouquet of daisies to Osama bin Laden and give the country back to the Indians. So I really don't know where this notion of the elite, anti-American liberal media comes from. I do believe there are "elites" in America who basically hate their country, and want to see it humiliated. But for the most part they don't work at your local daily paper.
     
  12. stratedude

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    You seem to completely reject the idea of pursuasion or even open-mindedness.
    You are clearly mistaking "independence of thought" with "hard-headedness".
    What is the use of discussing anything with someone like you?
     
  13. stratedude

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    It's not how liberal we think they are, it's how one sided their coverage is.

    And if they were as moderate as you (and I) thought they were, then they should be realizing their mistake to support Obama at this point. He is just shy of a Communist. He is friends with some of the worst people on earth that are anti-jew, anti-white, anti-American, some are admitted terrorists, etc. What is going on here?
     
  14. Penis Aficionado

    Penis Aficionado Legendary Member

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    Here's where I think you are wrong about Obama. There's no evidence that he is "friends" with the people you are referring to with the exception of his former pastor, Rev. Wright. It appears to me that Ayers, Farrakhan, etc. are more like accquaintances, and -- here is the key point -- people you can't help but be acquainted with if you are involved in Chicago politics.

    I believe the problem a lot of people like you have with Obama stems from this: He is from the central part of one of America's largest urban centers. That is highly unusual for a presidential candidate. And what people from Middle America may not realize is that if you get involved with your community on any level in the middle of Chicago or New York or LA, you are going to meet people with crazy, radical views. They may be fun, charming people. They may state their arguments very well. They may even do a lot of good works in their community. But their ideology is radical and crazy.

    Now, someone like Sarah Palin has probably never in her life actually met someone like Bill Ayers. And so she thinks that a responsible person, upon meeting Bill Ayers, should basically spit in his face, shout "I disown thee" and storm out of the room.

    But in Chicago, Bill Ayers is a *respected member of society.* He hobnobs with business leaders, country club members and Republicans. They don't spit in his face, and neither did Barack Obama, because -- well, what would be the point? Doing so would have made him many enemies, no friends and done nothing to help him become an effective Chicago politician.

    This is the same problem, in my opinion, that sunk Rudy Giuliani's presidential campaign. A lot of Republicans in places like Iowa and South Carolina liked him from afar, but when they learned about his pal Kerik, or his dressing in drag for a skit at a charity ball that has no equivalent in their communities -- combined with his ethnic mannerisms and big-city sarcasm -- they deserted him.
     
  15. D_Marazion Analdouche

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    Getting a bunch of morons and retards to believe that 9/11 was an inside job is far from proving a point. These people were delusional and paranoid to begin with and were just looking for something to cling to......fail.
     
  16. sparky11point5

    sparky11point5 Sexy Member

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    I think the key issue is that media is a convenient scapegoat. If anything, media seems to have a sensational or trivial bias. That is why is we get stories about Bill Ayers and $150,000 wardrobes. These are emotional, easily understood issues. I think if the media were really in the tank for Obama we would have not seen any coverage of the spurious issues about his place of birth, "associations", and other campaign-generated issues.

    On the other hand, there are actually similar illegitimate questions about McCain that have received almost no coverage in the main stream media. Here are are few -- an unreported fatal car crash in 1964, his actual conduct as a POW, his actions during the Forrestal fire, adultery, how many planes he crashed, and others. I think that we have not seen much of these questions tells us more about the probity of the Obama campaign than media bias, since the media loves a car crash.

    As an anti-war Liberal, the worst example of media bias in my opionion was the uncritical, unthinking, passive behavior prior to the start of the Iraq war. We were betrayed as a nation to simply have no real public debate about how and when to commit this country to a war.

    But, as John Stewart points out, "reality has a well-known liberal bias".
     
  17. vince

    vince Legendary Member

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    This is an example of independent thought? Seems to me you have a preferred favour of Kool-Aid yourself.

    On balance the Republicans have had far more time in power since 1980.--

    If there is a 'liberal' bias in American media, and that media is so influential in determining political outcomes, why have Republicans controlled the Presidency for 20 of the last 28 years? They've controlled the Senate for 18 of the last 28 and I'm not sure, but I think they had the House for 10 years.

    This whole myth of a liberal media, has been around since Spiro Agnew condemned the eastern media elites as 'nattering nabobs of negativity'.
     
  18. JP0724

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    The Media is what it is

    Liberals are going to watch Katie Couric and Conservatives are going to watch Bill O'Reilly. People watch whatever caters to what they think. People like to hear people reaffirm what they believe.

    If your really as open minded as you say you are, then why don't you give the conservative shows a try if your a liberal and vice versa. Get all the facts from both sides point of view before making a decision on an issue.
     
  19. vince

    vince Legendary Member

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    QFT.
     
  20. mindseye

    mindseye Experimental Member

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    This is a red herring. People too often equate being 'open-minded' with 'having to give two sides of an argument an equal chance'. As if after watching a Discovery Special on the moon landing, I'd have to spend an hour watching some nutjob tell me how the Earth is really flat and the moon landing was faked, otherwise I'm not being "open minded".

    Fundamental to JP0724's red herring is the idea that one can "get all the facts from both sides point of view": Facts are independent of point of view -- the earth revolves around the sun; four is an even number; Virginia has 13 electoral votes.

    Being open-minded doesn't require that I watch FOX, and thereby reward its divisive behavior, its sloppy fact-checking, or its advertisers. It requires that out of the media that I do patronize that I (1) read or watch it critically (2) distinguish facts from presented opinions (3) verify assertions of fact through other sources, and (4) form my own opinion independently without automatically adopting the one presented.
     
  21. quercusone

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    I don't know where this liberal media is. Every city I've ever lived in was dominated by center/right and right wing newspapers.
     
  22. faceking

    faceking Banned

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    Ummmmmmm, well kiddo they have, you just haven't noticed.

    Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Dennis Miller, Michael Savage vs Air America. Great example. Notice how immensely huge conservative talk shows are, and the lone liberal outlet in Air America barely has any listernership. How can that be? Because the likes of NPR and the myriad of liberal local talk shows balance it out.

    The demand AND supply for liberal radio outlets were already there, thusly why conservatives had said enough is enough, and the explosion and continued dominance of folks like the above. There was no need for Air America, the liberal radio outlet already exists.
     
  23. faceking

    faceking Banned

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    Ouch Q... get out of fly over country for once.
     
  24. D_Tyrone_Tittickler

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    I agree with Silvertrain's observation that we have an "American Media" for an American society. We have become so conditioned to having everything, including our news, instantaneously. The next time that you watch the news or listen to it on the radio, note critically how the news is delivered to the viewer or listener, and then, when the opportunity arises, watch BBC Worldnews or CBC News and compare what you saw or heard locally with these news organizations. I think that you will see that we, partly due to our tastes, get shortchanged.
     
  25. javyn

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    The media does not operate in a free market, so your theory is flawed. Just like the oil industry, the media when you get down to it is owned and controlled by a very few people. Oligopolies function completely different than free markets.

    I believe there is a conspiracy in the media, but it's not a liberal one simply because I think the right/left, liberal/conservative dichotomy is a lie.

     
  26. SpeedoGuy

    SpeedoGuy Sexy Member

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  27. Calboner

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    Don't try your liberal-media bias on me! It was conservative commentator Stephen Colbert who said that.
     
  28. stratedude

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    I sure hope you take the time to explain this more. I am very curious what you mean by this...
     
  29. javyn

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    IMO this is a classic case of divide and conquer. I can assure you conservative and liberal politicans do not hate each other the way we think they do. They are two sides of the same coin, and both benefit from our misery. The only way to make things better is to come together as a country and stand up to them. But they have us hating each other instead. For instance, the very last thing they want is for poor black and poor whites to realize they have much more in common than they do with an uber wealthy person of any race.

    For instance, do you think just because Obama is half black that he's going to do anything at all to improve black peoples' lives? Hell no. He has his own interests in mind, as well as his buddies in Washington on both the right and left.
     
  30. quercusone

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    I lived in Cali for a while......da OC though.
     
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