The U.S. Mortgage Clusterfuck

Discussion in 'Politics' started by bananaclubcock, Oct 9, 2010.

  1. bananaclubcock

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    I hope every American (yanqui to my Latin friends) here is at least a little aware of the latest news regarding U.S. mortgages. It turns out that many of the mortgages issued in the bubble years (probably 2004-2007/2008) weren't handled properly by the various issuing parties. This means that many of the foreclosures in the past few years were illegal! The documents needed to foreclose didn't exist, so the banks paid sleazy firms to create them out of thin air!

    The full implications of these issues are far from being known, but we are likely on the cusp of another very serious mess. The link below is to an interview with Janet Tavakoli, an expert an structured finance, who posits this is the "biggest fraud in the history of the capital markets". This could mean that mortgage-backed securities are worth even less than currently imagined, that the banks are even more rotten than many cynics imagined, and that the financial crisis is even farther from over than imagined.

    I know this dick site is a random place to get worked up about this, but I been in a few fights and I know gay dudes are pretty good about having your back (all you'll get from me! ha!). I certainly don't have the whole picture, but this really has been underreported and many, many more people need to know about this.

    Ezra Klein - 'This is the biggest fraud in the history of the capital markets'
     
  2. DexterMorgan

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    Yes...I am very familiar with this issue....and yes, it is absolutely staggering that "reputable" banking firms (LOL) have been outright fabricating documents to proceed through the court process of foreclosure....

    See naked capitalism marketticker.com: The Leading Stock Tickers Site on the Net for more information on this...

    People still don't appreciate the depths of the financial crisis the world is experiencing (or that its still getting worse !). The central banks all lie and try to reassure everyone...but they're SCARED....really SCARED !!!!!
     
  3. bananaclubcock

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    Cool. I follow those sites, especially NC. Would like to think others knew this stuff too. The Teabagger types are still drinking the Kool-Aid on deadbeats (i.e. 'lazy minorities') as the cause of the crisis. I just hope more people get truer picture of where the blame lies.

    If you are in Miami, I really hope this is big news. I have a journo friend down there, saw the bubble go up and then go way down. Some really rank BS.
     
  4. DexterMorgan

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    Las Vegas may be "ground zero" for this whole mess....CDOs (Collateralized Debt Obligations...plus CDS (Credit Default Swaps)....have totally poisoned (destroyed) the credit markets (They both should be illegal...but, of course they aren't because Wall Street owns Washington).
     
  5. piercedjobbie

    piercedjobbie New Member

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    Until the American public understands and buys into the concept of "no debt" the crooks on Wall Street in conjunction with the crooks in DC will continue to fuck over the American taxpayer. It seems to me that the number of thieves in DC, in particular, multiply faster than rabbits. We can vote them out, but that is assuming the new people will not be corrupted, which happens. Perhaps the only way to control them is to close off the money flow.

    When this country was founded the leaders were focused on creating a successful and enduring state. Now, it is how can I get re-elected, how can I avoid paying into Social Security, how can I look good and still screw my constituents? We need term limits, politicians that participate in Social Security and "our " health program, and who are interested in bringing manufacturing (and jobs) back to the U.S.

    Without a doubt, from a historical standpoint, there has been pro and con on what shoud be done, however, if we back up and look closely at the Declaration of Independence and at Lincoln's second inaugural address we would see a collective beacon of good premises upon which we, the people, would indeed, govern. This would be worlds above the garbage that they legislate now. Who, may I ask is currently in office that has the ability and integrity to write what Jefferson and Lincoln wrote....by themselves - no help from a bunch of pansy writers looking to line their pockets. Enough said.
     
  6. B_Marius567

    B_Marius567 New Member

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    Can I still get a mortgage with no money down?
     
  7. SeeDickRun

    SeeDickRun New Member

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    Piercedjobbie, I couldn't agree with you more. The only hope is that we get some new blood in this election, and the next two elections, and clean house of all those in Washington right now. (Maybe let Lieberman stay. I think he's a man of integrity. I used to think McCain was in the same category, but no longer have that opinion.) Let those getting in stay for three terms in the house, and two terms in the senate, then "out they go". By that time, they would have learned the ins and outs too well, and would have slipped into the same abyss the present seat occupants are in.

    I have great faith in the people of this country to wake up and see the light all around. It doesn't much matter which party is in power. They're all wickedly evil right now. I think that the assumption on the part of those in power that the "senior" senators or representatives should chair all the committees should be turned on their heads, bounced up and down a few times on the cold marble floors until they come to their senses and give up those chairmanships. Unless those committees change the leadership, they won't change. And, I guess one could question why all those committees are needed anyhow.
     
  8. B_New End

    B_New End New Member

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    This is hilarious.
    BAC cant foreclose on all these properties, because if they do, then property prices will plummet. Seized houses, worth half what they were than bought, are massive losses. But worse, if BAC has to foreclose, like they threatened to, then they have properties nobody wants to buy. UH OH... still gotta pay taxes and maintenance on those properties. more losses.

    However, if they don't foreclose, more and more people will realize they don't have to pay their mortgages. Some will rejoice and stop intentionally, but most will do so out of necessity... and then find themselves pleasantly surprised when after 6 months of no mortgage payments, nothing happens.
     
  9. DexterMorgan

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    Very well said, my friend !
     
  10. faceking

    faceking Well-Known Member

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    So you are saying homeowners were making payments and the banks still foreclosed?

    Thought so.

    This is a deplorable technicality, if that. Move along, nothing to see here ppl.

     
  11. B_New End

    B_New End New Member

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    except a fifty state wide moratorium on foreclosure by Bank of America and a 20 state moratorium by another mortgage company (cant remember their name)
     
  12. bananaclubcock

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    HA! You are supplying comedy gold! It's only a 'deplorable technicality' if you don't believe in the rule of law. This is about violations of ancient legal principles, not 'Librul' consumer protections dreamt up by Henry Waxman or Lyndon Johnson or even FDR.

    In fact, just to help you out, here is a credible story about an at
    tempt to foreclose on house bought WITHOUT any mortgage.
    Man Who Had No Mortgage Faced Foreclosure Anyway: Ann Woolner - BusinessWeek The banks have fucked up on this big, big time. Imaging anything else is just delusional.

    Now that we have that out of the way, do you have anything substantive to add? Whining about minorities, FNM/FRE, or the CRA is just plain boring. If there is a real flaw in what I said, please share. But just parroting the FNC line is tiresome, so please don't bother.
     
    #12 bananaclubcock, Oct 9, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2010
  13. B_New End

    B_New End New Member

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    Oh that's right, I forgot, because Obama just slid that little veto right in his pocket a few days ago too. whoops... now you see it, now you don't. I wonder if a bill regarding state to state mortgage notarization legitimacy being pocket vetoed by Obama is related.

    :confused:

    you don't think, do you?

    LoL

    Nothing to see, folks.
     
  14. bananaclubcock

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    I don't know. A lot of the sleazy lenders who pretended that that was an acceptable way to do business are defunct. Their managers made their money off the scam and have moved on to living off the proceeds.

    What so many don't get is that lender has serious responsibilities under law. There is a line of BS about the borrower carrying all the responsibility ("deadbeats!", etc.), but the lender has a more clearly defined obligation to be scrupulous. Even then the frauds and misrepresentations have involved lenders more than borrowers.
     
  15. cute5

    cute5 New Member

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    Not unless your FICO is about 900.
     
  16. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    They are still handing out FHA mortgages that require only 3% down, and folks are lining up for them.

    The irresponsible consumer won't ever go away. As long as gov't keeps insisting that low-income people should own a home, the foreclosures will continue to amass.

    Let's see; I wonder how many people that saved up 20% for a downpayment and purchased a home that way (from 2002 - 2008) are in foreclosure?

    Yeah. Exactly.
     
  17. sargon20

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    ^ The usual blame the poor and big government.


    ........data suggest that many of the well-to-do are purposely dumping their financially draining properties, just as they would any sour investment.

    More than one in seven homeowners with loans in excess of a million dollars are seriously delinquent, according to data compiled for The New York Times by the real estate analytics firm CoreLogic.

    By contrast, homeowners with less lavish housing are much more likely to keep writing checks to their lender. About one in 12 mortgages below the million-dollar mark is delinquent.


    Biggest Defaulters on Mortgages Are the Rich
     
    #17 sargon20, Oct 10, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2010
  18. bananaclubcock

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    To claim this is all about "irresponsible consumers" is just ignorance, this is about fraud and corruption of the capital markets. I agree that there was a scary political dynamic where left and right cooperated to encourage home ownership than they should have, but there are many, many more problems.

    If the firms that paid out billions in bonuses are unable to properly account for the mortgage notes, then they deserved to be sued. And someone who calls himself "starinvestor" should understand that the biggest, nastiest suits will come from RMBS investors, not 'homeowners'.

    And if you are going to call yourself "starinvestor" I'd recommend making decisions based upon data, not just gut feeling. Both of us have no idea how many 20% payment homes are in foreclosure. Since the banks did such crap record keeping, they have tried to foreclose on properties that never had a mortgage! Recognize that the bad record keeping is its own serious issue.
     
  19. bananaclubcock

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    Thanks for sharing. People need to understand that corporations default on loans all the time. The canard about 'deadbeats' is offensive, since the rich are most likely to view this as nothing but business.
     
  20. sargon20

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    'Gut feeling' is how is the propaganda works. Hard evidence is not required.
     
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