To US students Beethoven's a dog, Michelangelo a virus

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by maestro071, Aug 18, 2010.

  1. maestro071

    Verified Gold Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2007
    Messages:
    1,722
    Albums:
    4
    Likes Received:
    504
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    In your bed, lol
    Verified:
    Photo
  2. Pendlum

    Verified Gold Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2008
    Messages:
    2,151
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Verified:
    Photo
    Shows what they know, Michelangelo was a ninja turtle.
     
  3. Bob Ross

    Verified Gold Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2009
    Messages:
    1,237
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    121
    Gender:
    Male
    Verified:
    Photo
    LOL

    Let's just hope the percentage of students actually GRADUATING from universities is less...Although that may be too much to hope for
     
  4. DiscoBoy

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2009
    Messages:
    2,706
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    That's quite the bark Beethoven's got.
     
  5. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    Universities are a joke these days -- just big businesses about giving free rides to those who run a ball around a field.

    College degrees have 0 value in our society, unless it allows you to practice a practical profession (accounting, nursing, etc).

    I know rednecks that make zillion times more than my philosophical friends (not that learning for learning's sake is really about making money:biggrin1:)

    Suck my big peter, universities!
     
  6. vince

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2007
    Messages:
    14,785
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    540
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Asia
    To each, his own.

    Finishing a four year degree is not always an easy thing for many students. A university is not only academically challenging, there are also really heavy financial and emotional pressures that come into play. A BA or BsC degree may or may not be a useful thing these days, but it does say to me that this person had the character at 22 years old to stick to it and complete it when they could have had a job or being out having fun every night or what ever. My kid had to study really hard to make it though her school, there was no free ride.

    I have a working life that i really enjoy and if I had not gone to university, it would not have turned out this way.

    Making zillions of dollars is not everyone's end all and be all you know. And in any case every report I've read on the matter shows that a people with university degrees earn more money on average than those with a HS diploma.
     
  7. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    Making zillions of dollars has never been my goal, either.

    I have a Master's in linguistics, so you're not talking to someone who has never gone to university (got my Master's in Australia).:biggrin1:

    I'm talking more about universities in the US anyways. I feel sorry for the serious students who come out with so much debt and no job.
     
  8. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    Universities in this country can still suck it.
     
    #8 bigbull29, Aug 19, 2010
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2010
  9. pleasureboy

    Verified Gold Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2007
    Messages:
    641
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    22
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    New Orleans
    Verified:
    Photo
    meh those studies tend to be so inflated. I spent years working in the European educational systems. Trust me, compared to other countries, the average US student has such a better world view and common knowledge base than those in most of the countries these studies say are so far ahead of us.

    I did think it was funny that they pointed out that most college freshmen this year will have never used a corded phone in their homes.
     
  10. SilverTrain

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    4,582
    Albums:
    8
    Likes Received:
    404
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
    In my experience, there are very few things more treasured than a worldly, educated acquaintance.
     
  11. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    I lived in Europe (UK and France), and never saw the youth as better educated. The French are a bit more philosophical in general than Americans, but they're taught to be that way. I wouldn't say they're more worldly or "smarter" overall.

    Education-wise, Australians didn't impress me, either (lived there 2 years).

    So, when are we meeting?
     
  12. B_subgirrl

    B_subgirrl New Member

    Joined:
    May 15, 2010
    Messages:
    9,873
    Likes Received:
    11
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    NSW, Australia
    Boyo, you were barely alive when the turtles came out the first time round :wink::smile:
     
  13. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    Anti-intellectualism is all the rage. :smile:

    (this treed is like sily)
     
  14. maxcok

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2009
    Messages:
    7,392
    Likes Received:
    12
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Elsewhere
    So true. As is incompetency, underachievement and illiteracy.

    (civulizashun as we no it is doomd)
     
  15. lucky8

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2006
    Messages:
    3,716
    Likes Received:
    17
    Gender:
    Male
    I agree with this notion. I recently graduated 8 months ago with a double major in finance and accounting, and I really feel like it was a waste of time. I was one of the very few people in my classes that actually read my textbooks. Everyone else just crammed the night before a test using only the powerpoint slides....and time and time again, after spending 5 hours reading and comprehending what I was reading, I would get an 88 or 89 on a test, whereas my friends would just study the powerpoint slides for an hour or 2 and get an 80....the thing is, an 89 and an 80 are both B's when your school doesn't have a +- system....bullshit I say.

    On top of that, just about every decent job offering I come across says "3 or more years of experience required" More bullshit. I forewent 5 years of work experience to obtain my degree, and suddenly that's worth nothing to employers. If I would have just started working full time out of high school, I would have a pretty decent paying job by now. But instead, some dumbfuck who doesn't even know what GAAP stands for is more qualified than I am just because he worked at the front desk of an accounting firm for 3 years after high school? Bullshit. A Bachelor's degree, for the most part, is no longer worth it. There's even a new lady that just started working at my current employer who has a double major in accounting and finance, an MBA, and a CPA, and she's making $10 an hour because "she doesn't have work experience" WTF? She is way more qualified to do ANYTHING than most people in my city, yet she's making $10 an hour? WTF!?!?!?! She probably has at least $60,000 of student loans....and she's making $10/hr. The world is a mess right now, and I doubt it gets better any time soon...
     
  16. Stretch

    Stretch New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    2,408
    Likes Received:
    10
    Gender:
    Male
    I could not disagree with you more. I'm born and raised in NYC...I've lived in London, Paris, Amsterdam, Hamburg and have my homebase at the moment in Vienna. I travel extensively with my job and I've found that Americans in general are not even in the same league as most Europeans generally, as far as international awareness, facility with languages and common knowledge.

    I actually don't trust you...how many years and exactly which European educational systems did you work in and in what capacity?
     
  17. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    I don't think that European youth are in general better educated than Americans. And the fact that they are more linguistically aware is mainly because the interdependence and close proximity between the little countries has always led to greater linguistic awareness and multi-lingualism. It's not something you can really give them credit for.

    However, you will find more adults who enjoy intellectual conversation in France and Germany than in North America, whether they really know a lot more or not. In France, it is all really due to the philosophical thinking that is introduced to French students at the junior-high level and then culturally encouraged thereafter. I can't speak well for the other countries (except for the UK) and don't know about the other countries, but probably a little less intellectual overall than those already mentioned.

    Sorry, but the educational system in the UK is not impressive. The private schools are ok, but who can afford them?

    And, by the way, there is no idea of a liberal arts education at the university level in Europe.
     
  18. Zayne

    Zayne New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2008
    Messages:
    520
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Young people know who Beethoven was. This is a silly, attention-grabbing lead-in. Nothing scientific here.
     
  19. bigbull29

    Gold Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2006
    Messages:
    5,737
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    2,420
    Gender:
    Male
    I know, buddy, it's maddening. I fully sympathize with you.

    That the woman with no experience at your firm making $10/h is truly more common than we want to believe.

    There are kids with "no education" in their 20's bringing in megabucks where I live (doing blue-collar jobs that require minimal vocational training). It's not just about the money for me, but the big-time respect that these crotch-grabbing, chew-spittin' rednecks get in their entourage/community. Sure, it takes all kinds to make a world, but still...

    I have a cousin in college who wants to learn about as much as the 16-year-old boy racers in a country town. She's anything but an intellectual, and she's got zero business in college (I think she's want to be a FIS-ED teacher).

    I've always taken learning so seriously, but have become quite discouraged with the age we're living in. I say say to myself, "Why do we even have universities nowadays?" Were universities not originally intended to not just train people to be professionals, but to foster learning for learning's sake?

    And, yes, there should be some societal reward and respect for being a true intellectual in our world.

    Nothing gets my feathers more ruffled than seeing people being mocked for trying to learn. What a sin!
     
    #19 bigbull29, Aug 19, 2010
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2010
  20. D_Tim McGnaw

    D_Tim McGnaw Account Disabled

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2009
    Messages:
    7,317
    Likes Received:
    8

    I'm not going to disagree with you strongly about the UK education system, which has taken a dive in recent decades, but I know from personal experience that Germans, Scandinavians and Iberians (Spanish and Portuguese) have excellent education systems which produce a populace which is in general extremely intelligent and well informed.

    I'm sort of shocked to see you write off multilingualism so casually too, I don't think you really understand European multilingualism at all, and it sounds like you're really just trying to justify the lack of language facility in most Americans by belittling it in Europeans.

    I don't think there's any evidence that Liberal Arts Education is best taught at university rather than earlier in life. Besides from what I can tell it's teaching in US universities seems to produce a lot of people (though by no means all) with very superficial understanding of a variety of subjects which they then presume they are expert in when they really aren't.

    Ultimately I don't think there's a useful comparison to be made between US and European Universities, they are too dissimilar.
     
Draft saved Draft deleted