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ericbear

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Originally posted by jonb@May 19 2004, 08:00 PM
Actually, I'm surprised that a Southern state allows openly gay men to breathe with their diaphragms.
Having been raised north of the Mason-Dixon line, I held similar views of the South. Then I actually began visiting there, and I became quite ashamed of my Northern views.

My first eye-opener came about 10 years ago, when I was offered a job in Georgia. While considering the offer, I researched the local laws on homosexuality. According to law still on the books in the county where I would work, the police could hold a man for an indefinite period of time if he was suspected of being homosexual. There was no need to have any evidence of a homosexual act. While this might seem to violate constitution rights, in the eyes of the local law it did not, because constitutional rights only applied to humans, not fags. Needless to say, this discovery was in pefect agreement with my bigoted stereotype of what the Old South was about.

But, while I was down there for the interview, I decided to check out the night life (and hoped I didn't get arrested.) I was expecting that the bar would be some unmarked, nondescript building, and that a secret knock would be required for entry, and you would be admitted only after the doorman examined you through a little peephole, like at a speakeasy. Imagine my astonishment as I rounded a bend in the road, and saw a huge, electric sign on top of a 30 foot high pole, which more or less advertised:

GAY BAR! C'mon IN! Parking for 300 cars in back!

So I went in. I met what were probably some of the most open and least closeted people anywhere. I learned that regardless of what the law might say, it did not reflect the way that the community felt about their homosexual members. (By the way, I declined the job for unrelated reasons, having more to do with humidity.)

As I have spent more time in the South, I have learned that the old stereotypes are largely wrong, and that many places in the South are actually more open-minded than the supposedly cosmopolitan places.
 

jonb

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Well, New Orleans is a mecca for all kinds of sexuality. I was more making a reference to the general religious climate in the South. Of course, it's only because I live in California, and we're all ashamed of Orange County, which has produced every right-wing lunatic in the last 50 years.
 

ericbear

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Hey! I happen to live in OC (although I'm originally from Joisey).

Don't blame us for every lunatic, we had nothing to do with W., or quite a few others.

But yes, we do house the headquarters of several right wing religious broadcasters, which spew programming that as a christian I find offensive, obscene, and deeply blasphemous.

On the other hand, despite the repuation as a conservative Republican area, a review of the state assembly roster shows that we have actually elected some pretty broad minded people, including a few leaders in gay issues. But California is a strange place. One of the most homophobic things I ever read was a guest column in the newspaper, written by a representative from Laguna Beach, a community with a large gay population. But the same OC newspaper prominently printed a lengthy rebuttal that I wrote. So, OC is actually more balanced than many people think.

And besides, people drive all the way down from LA to go to the orgy parties here. It's a wonderful feeling as you step outside in the wee hours, exhausted, wet with sweat and juices, and behold the giant glowing electric cross atop the shimmering Crystal Cathedral...
 

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Yeah, well, OC is home to Ronald Reagan, the late Richard Nixon, and all the major defense contractors. So the right-wing reputation is fairly well-deserved. In all fairness, Arthur Jensen has tenure at Berkeley.

California in general is a giant circus. I mean, 14-year-olds getting the vote? (Of course, California adults already vote like 14-year-olds; just ask Governor Schwarzenegger.)
 

ericbear

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Originally posted by jonb@May 22 2004, 05:20 PM
...OC is home to Ronald Reagan,..
Sometimes I really have to wonder where you get some of the strange things that you write. I'm not sure what you possibly mean by "home." During Reagan's campaigns, I remember it being promoted that he came from the land of Lincoln, and indeed he was born and grew up in Illinois. As far as I can tell, during his career (both acting and politics) he never lived in Orange County. His retirement home is in Los Angeles county, in the north-west part of LA, around Bel Air or Pacific Pallisades as I remember, a good 35 miles outside of OC. Although Denver Colorado wanted to host his presidental library there, the actual site of the Reagan Library and Museum is in Simi Valley, CA, in Ventura (not Orange) County. So, yes, while it is true that the Ronald Reagan Federal Courthouse complex is less than two miles from my house, and that OC did carry his vote in both presidential elections (as did more than half of the country), the man himself had little to do with OC. The construction of the courthouse complex had more to do with the city council of Santa Ana being desperate to get something, anything, built to renew badly decayed urban neighborhoods than with any particular affection for its namesake. Reagan's "star wars" program did give a last boost the fading OC defense industry (and to defense contractors nationwide); despite this, defense has shriveled to the point where it hasn't been one of the major drivers of the Orange County economy for many years. So I simply can't understand how OC could ever be considered Reagan's "home."
 

jonb

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I could've sworn he was from OC. Oh, well, the real power, his contributors, was.

My favorite of OC's right-wing reputation will always be Bob Dornan though. Anyone who believes in numerology should be disqualified from office on the basis of mental incompetence.