Trump supporters, why does he lie so much?

[MikesJohnson]

Link?

Not surprising. No link. Crickets. And he calls Trump a liar. LOL.

 

[TexanStar]

Not surprising. No link. Crickets. And he calls Trump a liar. LOL.

Hey look, it's one of the right wing residents of my ignore list. Welcome back from whatever void you've been in (and bye again).

 

[Max_Polo]

Hey look, it's one of the right wing residents of my ignore list. Welcome back from whatever void you've been in (and bye again).

Well, he does have a good point...

"You can keep your doctor."
​

What bullshit that was.

 

[TexanStar]

Well, he does have a good point...

"You can keep your doctor."
​

What bullshit that was.

People who run around using words like (xxx) don't get their points listened to.

 

[Max_Polo]

People who run around using words like (xxx) don't get their points listened to.

Doesn't stop them from posting however.

Saw Dunkirk tonight at the movies, quite entertaining but just missed the mark by a bit somehow.

 

[MikesJohnson]

Hey look, it's one of the right wing residents of my ignore list. Welcome back from whatever void you've been in (and bye again).

People who run around using words like (xxx) don't get their points listened to.

Liberals don't listen to anything that casts their liberal masters in anything less than a glorious light. Liberals don't care about the truth; liberals care about the narrative. Hence, they are (xxx).

I enjoy revealing libtards for their lies and hypocrisy. There are MANY members here that don't post in this forum but DO follow it. They don't post because they don't want to be the victims of the inevitable liberal hatred and intolerance. A number of them have sent me pm's thanking me for speaking the truth.

 

[TexanStar]

Doesn't stop them from posting however.

Saw Dunkirk tonight at the movies, quite entertaining but just missed the mark by a bit somehow.

I'm watchin the Dark Crystal. It's playin at the drive-in but I was too tired to deal with the drive. Lucky for me we've got it on Blu Ray

 

[Max_Polo]

Liberals don't listen to anything that casts their liberal masters in anything less than a glorious light. Liberals don't care about the truth; liberals care about the narrative. Hence, they are "libtards".

I enjoy revealing libtards for their lies and hypocrisy. There are MANY members here that don't post in this forum but DO follow it. They don't post because they don't want to be the victims of the inevitable liberal hatred and intolerance. A number of them have sent me pm's thanking me for speaking the truth.

The good news is that there are some non-conservatives (LEFT) here who do read multi-syllabic words and think about them, even if they are inclined to disagree. They then follow with logical arguments that may enlighten the not-quite-alt-right luddites (RIGHT, me included) among us.

Similarly, there are those among the not-quite-alt-right (RIGHT) who make principled arguments without too much name-calling and might actually inform the masses of non-conservatives (LEFT) here.

Then, there are the ideologically insecure morons (LEFT and RIGHT) who cannot tolerate any dissent. Unfortunately, these assholes appear here all too often and are almost exclusively in the libtard (LEFT) camp. Makes the remaining not-quite-alt-left
(LEFT) look bad; the shame of it all is that the the other non-conservatives (LEFT) don't call them out.

 

[jumbo747jet]

Liberals don't listen to anything that casts their liberal masters in anything less than a glorious light. Liberals don't care about the truth; liberals care about the narrative. Hence, they are "libtards".

I enjoy revealing libtards for their lies and hypocrisy. There are MANY members here that don't post in this forum but DO follow it. They don't post because they don't want to be the victims of the inevitable liberal hatred and intolerance. A number of them have sent me pm's thanking me for speaking the truth.

Hatred and intolerance is never acceptable but I sometimes think that voicing a different opinion and arguing against the arguments of others is mistaken for hatred and intolerance, especially by those who find it difficult to explain the reasoning behind their thinking.

If the objective is to convince others of your way of thinking, it needs to be done in a respectful manner, without insults, as that rather shows a lack of constructive arguments and common civility.

 

[Max_Polo]

Hatred and intolerance is never acceptable but I sometimes think that voicing a different opinion and arguing against the arguments of others is mistaken for hatred and intolerance, especially by those who find it difficult to explain the reasoning behind their thinking.

If the objective is to convince others of your way of thinking, it needs to be done in a respectful manner, without insults, as that rather shows a lack of constructive arguments and common civility.

Nailed it.

But sometimes the issue is not "argument mistaken for hatred and intolerance," it's just plain-old hatred and intolerance clearly stated.

 

[MikesJohnson]

If the objective is to convince others of your way of thinking, it needs to be done in a respectful manner, without insults, as that rather shows a lack of constructive arguments and common civility.

I understand and I will not these are words of advice I've never seen directed at a liberal here.

 

[Industrialsize]

Tweet from this morning:
Donald J. Trump‏Verified account@realDonaldTrump


Will be going to North Dakota today to discuss tax reform and tax cuts. We are the highest taxed nation in the world - that will change.


No Donald, we're not even close.

 

[Max_Polo]

Tweet from this morning:
Donald J. Trump‏Verified account@realDonaldTrump


Will be going to North Dakota today to discuss tax reform and tax cuts. We are the highest taxed nation in the world - that will change.


No Donald, we're not even close.

Interesting Op Ed in WSJ this morning proposing elimination of income and other taxes and replacement with VAT. Sure seems to make sense to tax consumption rather than earning, particularly with a large individual exemption or rebate for early spend. Worth reading in part because almost all politicians hate the idea, seems they fear that the lobbyists would have a fit.

 

[Industrialsize]

Interesting Op Ed in WSJ this morning proposing elimination of income and other taxes and replacement with VAT. Sure seems to make sense to tax consumption rather than earning, particularly with a large individual exemption or rebate for early spend. Worth reading in part because almost all politicians hate the idea, seems they fear that the lobbyists would have a fit.

So you've just glossed over the lie that we are the highest taxed nation in the world.

 

[Max_Polo]

So you've just glossed over the lie that we are the highest taxed nation in the world.

No, I did not "gloss over it," I simply did not comment on that statement because I wasn't trying to pick a fight and because I don't know that we are or are not. I do know that it's not a simple equation because we are taxed at so many different levels.

Personal federal income tax, FICA, Medicare tax, Obamacare tax, State income tax (for some), Business Franchise tax (Texas, maybe elsewhere?), Retail sales tax, Gasoline tax, Electric energy transmission tax, Business income tax, Luxury automobile tax, "Gas guzzler" automobile tax, Federal and state unemployment taxes (may only apply to employer, not sure if I pay personally as well), Business personal property tax (may be unique to Texas, we pay an annual property tax on all business assets), Personal property tax (levied on real personal property such as our home, but also airplanes and other assets). There are probably others that don't pop to mind immediately.

My point was that it'd seem simpler and more fair to tax spending rather than income.

I did find some data that supports your contention about overall tax rates. I don't know the agenda of the source of the data and I'm not vouching for its accuracy or comprehensiveness (don't seem to include many of the taxes I listed above, but:

Also seems that the above may ignore that taxes in UK, Germany and France (and presumably the other listed countries) include the cost of healthcare where the data for the United States only includes a small portion of overall healthcare costs. So, again, don't assume I believe that the above is comprehensive.

And, if you want to believe the first graph, you should accept these as well. And it appears that none of these data include sales taxes in the United States.

A quote from the foundation link that expresses my point as well:

As another tax season winds down, many Americans agree that our tax system is complex, confusing, and inefficient. In addition, many economists believe that simplifying the tax code would help the economy. Comprehensive tax reform could promote economic growth, while also making the code more simple, transparent, and fair. The good news is that many promising solutions exist.​

 

[Industrialsize]

No, I did not "gloss over it," I simply did not comment on that statement because I wasn't trying to pick a fight and because I don't know that we are or are not. I do know that it's not a simple equation because we are taxed at so many different levels.

Personal federal income tax, FICA, Medicare tax, Obamacare tax, State income tax (for some), Business Franchise tax (Texas, maybe elsewhere?), Retail sales tax, Gasoline tax, Electric energy transmission tax, Business income tax, Luxury automobile tax, "Gas guzzler" automobile tax, Federal and state unemployment taxes (may only apply to employer, not sure if I pay personally as well), Business personal property tax (may be unique to Texas, we pay an annual property tax on all business assets), Personal property tax (levied on real personal property such as our home, but also airplanes and other assets). There are probably others that don't pop to mind immediately.

My point was that it'd seem simpler and more fair to tax spending rather than income.

I did find some data that supports your contention about overall tax rates. I don't know the agenda of the source of the data and I'm not vouching for its accuracy or comprehensiveness (don't seem to include many of the taxes I listed above, but:
View attachment 818041

Also seems that the above may ignore that taxes in UK, Germany and France (and presumably the other listed countries) include the cost of healthcare where the data for the United States only includes a small portion of overall healthcare costs. So, again, don't assume I believe that the above is comprehensive.

View attachment 818043 View attachment 818042


And, if you want to believe the first graph, you should accept these as well. And it appears that none of these data include sales taxes in the United States.

A quote from the foundation link that expresses my point as well:

As another tax season winds down, many Americans agree that our tax system is complex, confusing, and inefficient. In addition, many economists believe that simplifying the tax code would help the economy. Comprehensive tax reform could promote economic growth, while also making the code more simple, transparent, and fair. The good news is that many promising solutions exist.​

My point is that TRUMP IS A BIG LIAR.

 

[Max_Polo]

My point is that TRUMP IS A BIG LIAR.

That point was clear.

Mine was that we can fret or debate about whether that's true or not, but such fretting and debate serves no benefit for anyone. And that there may be a better way to get out of our economic mess.

ETA: but your point is taken - this is the lying thread after all.

 

[Industrialsize]

That point was clear.

Mine was that we can fret or debate about whether that's true or not, but such fretting and debate serves no benefit for anyone. And that there may be a better way to get out of our economic mess.

ETA: but your point is taken - this is the lying thread after all.

There is a thread to discuss Trump's tax policy. No one but myself has posted in it yet.
https://www.lpsg.com/threads/trumps-tax-reform.480863/

 

[Novaboy]

There is a thread to discuss Trump's tax policy. No one but myself has posted in it yet.
https://www.lpsg.com/threads/trumps-tax-reform.480863/

The big problem with a VAT type tax is that it places a much bigger burden on lower income people. Paying 15% tax for example, on everything you buy takes up a much larger portion of ones income if they are only making say, 20,000 per year compared to someone making much more. Yes, a person with higher income will eventually pay more taxes, but you are then comparing discretionary spending with essential needs. There would need to be some type of rebate for lower income people. Saying that it's fair because everyone pays the same is not accurate.

 

[Max_Polo]

The big problem with a VAT type tax is that it places a much bigger burden on lower income people. Paying 15% tax for example, on everything you buy takes up a much larger portion of ones income if they are only making say, 20,000 per year compared to someone making much more. Yes, a person with higher income will eventually pay more taxes, but you are then comparing discretionary spending with essential needs. There would need to be some type of rebate for lower income people. Saying that it's fair because everyone pays the same is not accurate.

That was precisely the point of the article. You match the VAT with the portion of GDP that you think the government should get accounting for a rebate of say $10,000 to every adult and child or something like that. It's just as progressive as an income tax, maybe more so because the very wealthy hire accountants and lawyers that others cannot...